KD in CA Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 I realize that debating issues is no longer necessary now that the good guys are in charge, and we have much more important things to ponder for weeks on end (like black guys getting arrested in Boston), but here's one attempt to decipher the legislation on the healthcare reform movement. Sounds a little frightening, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Adams Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 I realize that debating issues is no longer necessary now that the good guys are in charge, and we have much more important things to ponder for weeks on end (like black guys getting arrested in Boston), but here's one attempt to decipher the legislation on the healthcare reform movement. Sounds a little frightening, no? No linky no laundry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted July 28, 2009 Author Share Posted July 28, 2009 No linky no laundry. Try, try again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 I realize that debating issues is no longer necessary now that the good guys are in charge, and we have much more important things to ponder for weeks on end (like black guys getting arrested in Boston), but here's one attempt to decipher the legislation on the healthcare reform movement. Sounds a little frightening, no? As a 27 year old healthy low income male, that article is very scary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 Try, try again. As someone who is in the health and life insurance business, this plan is not the most appetizing of thoughts. Does BO realize how many people in the insurance industry will likely be forced out of business if he passes this? That's a fairly large constituency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 As someone who is in the health and life insurance business, this plan is not the most appetizing of thoughts. Does BO realize how many people in the insurance industry will likely be forced out of business if he passes this? That's a fairly large constituency. They're counting on it. They know that the vast majority of the idiots who support them will pull their lever every election no matter what so why not take the chance when the opportunity is at it's peak? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 They're counting on it. They know that the vast majority of the idiots who support them will pull their lever every election no matter what so why not take the chance when the opportunity is at it's peak? True enough. But I can tell you, most of my colleagues didn't vote for that bastard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finknottle Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 As someone who is in the health and life insurance business, this plan is not the most appetizing of thoughts. Does BO realize how many people in the insurance industry will likely be forced out of business if he passes this? That's a fairly large constituency. I find this discussion most remarkable by its absence. Here we are, supposedly so desperate to keep people working that we'll flush away a trillion dollars in future revenue on stimulus spending to artificially create jobs. At the same time, we undertake a trillion dollar health reform. But we are assured that it will pay for itself, we can just wring the money out of waste, paper-pushers, and middlemen. Well guess what? All of these paper-pushers have jobs and earn money. If we can somehow get rid of them - and arrive at some magical lean mean health-providing machine - then we have a bunch of unemployed people on our hands. How much will we require to 'stimulate' them with employment? I dunno - maybe roughly the amount we saved getting rid of them? Getting something for nothing is proving to be harder than Obama let on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Live&DieBillsFootball Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 Sorry, but the status quo sucks worse. There are 40 million plus uninsured. The private individual market is a joke...try to find an individual policy that you can afford if you have anyone in your family with a pre-existing condition. Even if you don't have existing issues, you probably won't find a policy to cover prescriptions. I'm sure that the millions of recently unemployed are learning the hard truth about the cost of Cobra coverage. Try paying $1200 a month to cover your family while living on unemployment benefits. Our current system is great if you work for a large company and plan to stay there for life. Otherwise, there are plenty of minefields. Every feature of the proposed Obamacare has been trashed by the Republicans. Where is the GOP alternative? So far they have come out with a mission statement, but have yet to utter a single alternative. Their only plan is to keep things as they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 Sorry, but the status quo sucks worse. There are 40 million plus uninsured. The private individual market is a joke...try to find an individual policy that you can afford if you have anyone in your family with a pre-existing condition. Even if you don't have existing issues, you probably won't find a policy to cover prescriptions. I'm sure that the millions of recently unemployed are learning the hard truth about the cost of Cobra coverage. Try paying $1200 a month to cover your family while living on unemployment benefits. Our current system is great if you work for a large company and plan to stay there for life. Otherwise, there are plenty of minefields. Every feature of the proposed Obamacare has been trashed by the Republicans. Where is the GOP alternative? So far they have come out with a mission statement, but have yet to utter a single alternative. Their only plan is to keep things as they are. Politicians aren't going to solve a problem they created, though I don't disagree that the current system sucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 Sorry, but the status quo sucks worse. No, it doesn't. There are options out there (mainly in the high-deductible arena) that are VERY affordable. The problem is, people want health insurance for the wrong reasons. Health insurance is to protect against major medical problems, not to cover everyday sneezes and sniffles. The "hair on fire" need of Obama and his criminal cronies Kennedy, Pelosi and Reid to push through a MAJOR drain on the Federal budget to fix a supposed "problem" is just perplexing. What does it matter if it gets done this month, a year from now or three years from now? The answer is, they know it won't pass if given time for review by the American people. We don't do socialism, even though the corrupt Washington establishment seems to be in love with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 No, it doesn't. Actually, it does. Virtually every family in this country is one health crisis away from losing everything they've worked for - whether you have insurance or not. I'm not advocating the ridiculous bureaucratic garbage that's being pushed (it won't fix the issues) but saying the current system doesn't suck is extremely dishonest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 Actually, it does. Virtually every family in this country is one health crisis away from losing everything they've worked for - whether you have insurance or not. I'm not advocating the ridiculous bureaucratic garbage that's being pushed (it won't fix the issues) but saying the current system doesn't suck is extremely dishonest. If you've got a high-deductible plan that has a $4 or $5 million dollar lifetime coverage limit, you won't be facing that issue. If you carry disability insurance, you should also be in fairly good shape. So where is this crisis? I can see someone who has *no* coverage being in that precarious situation, but someone who has a plan? I just don't see it. Edit: And if you have an employer-sponsored plan with better coverage, then you REALLY have no issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chef Jim Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 If you've got a high-deductible plan that has a $4 or $5 million dollar lifetime coverage limit, you won't be facing that issue. If you carry disability insurance, you should also be in fairly good shape. So where is this crisis? I can see someone who has *no* coverage being in that precarious situation, but someone who has a plan? I just don't see it. The crisis is that the car payment and the credit card payment for that big screen come before any type of proactive financial planning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 The crisis is that the car payment and the credit card payment for that big screen come before any type of proactive financial planning. Exactly my point. People don't want to sacrifice luxuries for necessities, like health insurance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finknottle Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 Sorry, but the status quo sucks worse. There are 40 million plus uninsured. The private individual market is a joke...try to find an individual policy that you can afford if you have anyone in your family with a pre-existing condition. Even if you don't have existing issues, you probably won't find a policy to cover prescriptions. The complaints are a joke. Ask yourself this: what is the actual cost of the medical care you consume in a year? Maybe it's a good year. You have two doctors visits and some lab work. An hour of a doctors time is minimally $200. Throw in a receptionist and paying for the facility and his overhead, and it's $400 a visit. And the labwork? Probably another $600. So $1,400 - not bad. But maybe it's a bad year - 4 visits, 10 tests of various sorts, and a proceedure. That's about $12,000. Or maybe it's a *really* bad year, the year you burn through $40,000 of hospital care before kicking the bucket. Most years are good, a few are bad. So what to you would be a fair amount of money to spend per year on medical treatment, on average, to cover your lifetime use? Maybe you feel that that cost is simply too high for someone to afford. It is about choosing what we spend our money on, after all, and the average cost of an individual plan is $4,700. But just out of curiosity, what does your car insurance cost? The average nationwide is $1,837, and we don't hear too many people complaining or going without. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 The average nationwide is $1,837, and we don't hear too many people complaining or going without. Because they have no choice. The gubmint forces people to have car insurance. You can bet your arse that if it didn't, 40 million plus people wouldn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 Politicians aren't going to solve a problem they created, though I don't disagree that the current system sucks. I don't think the plan is what will solve the problem- you have to get something in place and then work to improve it. While socialism isn't something that is good for the entire country's economy, it does have its place- it shouldn't have been demonized the way it has been. Capitalism doesn't solve all problems and isn't appropriate for all forums- paying doctors per procedure is the incorrect way to go about things. I agree with Obama about using the Cleveland Clinic as a model- that won;t solve everything either- solutions don't just appear- you have to be patient and able to adjust to new problems that crop up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chef Jim Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 I don't think the plan is what will solve the problem- you have to get something in place and then work to improve it. While socialism isn't something that is good for the entire country's economy, it does have its place- it shouldn't have been demonized the way it has been. Capitalism doesn't solve all problems and isn't appropriate for all forums- paying doctors per procedure is the incorrect way to go about things. I agree with Obama about using the Cleveland Clinic as a model- that won;t solve everything either- solutions don't just appear- you have to be patient and able to adjust to new problems that crop up. ....by taking small steps. This plan is one giant leap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted July 28, 2009 Share Posted July 28, 2009 ....by taking small steps. This plan is one giant leap. I can agree with you on that point, but one way or another it has to get started and the transition won't be easy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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