Poeticlaw Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 If you look at the success of the Patriots the last 10 years they consistently trade down in the draft and let perceived star players walk out the door (see Bledsoe, Milloy, Branch) and load up on draft picks. Cutler is clearly better then Bledsoe but I like the idea of loading up on draft picks like the Patriots have done and continue to do (see this year's draft). The Bills continually trade up in the draft for players like Losman, McCargo, Poz and look were it gets them. Overall I think the Broncos will reap the rewards of this trade in the long run. The patriots let people walk knowing they had a replacement in place. Denver is going to be a bottom feeder for years to come. They have made all the wrong moves!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flbillsfan#1 Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 They gave up two 1sts and a 3rd. It will be very hard to make the offense good without depleting the defense. Cutler is not the type of QB that will be able to do well with nothing. Also, Schlereth and Dilfer were talking about this earlier, and seem to agree that the bears have screwed themselves. Cutler's strengths are being able to hold onto the ball a long time and finding the open receiver down field... or jamming it into tight holes. He can't do any of that from his back. (not to mention no one can name a Bears wide receiver). I'd imagine he will either throw it a lot less, or throw a ton of INTs trying to get it to his receivers. If he had gone to the Vikings, i would say he would have had a good shot at success. Things CHANGE year to year. Receivers can be found MUCH EASIER than QB's. I would put my money on the Bears that they got the BETTER of this deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PushthePile Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 They gave up two 1sts and a 3rd. It will be very hard to make the offense good without depleting the defense. Cutler is not the type of QB that will be able to do well with nothing. Also, Schlereth and Dilfer were talking about this earlier, and seem to agree that the bears have screwed themselves. Cutler's strengths are being able to hold onto the ball a long time and finding the open receiver down field... or jamming it into tight holes. He can't do any of that from his back. (not to mention no one can name a Bears wide receiver). I'd imagine he will either throw it a lot less, or throw a ton of INTs trying to get it to his receivers. If he had gone to the Vikings, i would say he would have had a good shot at success. Success isn't measured in one season. The Bears are a much better team then the Broncos and he will be provided with targets in time. Greg Olsen and Matt Forte are nice compliments to the offense, already. Devin Hester is also getting better at WR. Is it a stretch to think that they could find help in the draft still? Besides their are FA WRs available and more to come in time. It is much easier to find weapons than it is to find a proven probowl QB. Who was our last probowl QB? Denver has just joined the ranks of irrelevant. Nice move! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 Success isn't measured in one season. The Bears are a much better team then the Broncos and he will be provided with targets in time. Greg Olsen and Matt Forte are nice compliments to the offense, already. Devin Hester is also getting better at WR. Is it a stretch to think that they could find help in the draft still? Besides their are FA WRs available and more to come in time. It is much easier to find weapons than it is to find a proven probowl QB. Who was our last probowl QB? Denver has just joined the ranks of irrelevant. Nice move! I guess it all depends on how they draft. They all ready have two very fine wide receivers in Royal and Marshall. They have a future probowl Tackle in Clady, and now they will have 4 1st round draft choices and 3 3rd rounders in the next two years. That is a lot of ammo PushthePile. Irrelevant, well, we'll see. But it seems as if you have some sort of attachment to Cutler. Why is that if you don't mind me asking? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 looks like a win-win for both.......Denver is going to have to make good on the draft picks......Chicago better hope that Cutler will mature(crybaby punk attitude) and take care of his health (diabetes & drinking) heard he made a fool of himself in Hawaii at the Pro Bowl. Chicago can use the "Cap" money they would have spent on those #1 draft choices to sign more proven Free Agents. We won't know for a couple years who made out better. Based on my "bird in the hand is worth 2 draft picks in the bush" theory, i give slight edge to chicago, for now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffOrange Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 The "draft picks are crucial" line of thought has become like the "run and stop the run" cliche. There is obviously some truth to it - a lot of truth to it - but when made as blanket statements its meaning is severely diminished. Draft picks are important, but a 25yr old franchise QB is more important. That is why they're never traded. It is somewhat humerous that many of the same draft-pick nuts are the same people with the microwave-mentality that there's nobody to throw to in Chicago. They have some good pieces in place with Forte and Olsen. It is not inconceivable that they could develop or sign a legit #1 WR by the time any of Denver's draft picks pan out. In fact, it's a lot more likely than Denver finding a good QB within that time frame. God knows it's taken the Bills 13 years and counting. I think Denver did fine getting what they got in return considering their hand was basically forced. But lets face it - their hand being forced is why the deal happened; not because of some master philosophy of McDaniels. Firing Shannahan was incredibly stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PushthePile Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 I guess it all depends on how they draft. They all ready have two very fine wide receivers in Royal and Marshall. They have a future probowl Tackle in Clady, and now they will have 4 1st round draft choices and 3 3rd rounders in the next two years. That is a lot of ammo PushthePile. Irrelevant, well, we'll see. But it seems as if you have some sort of attachment to Cutler. Why is that if you don't mind me asking? I don't really like Cutler but i feel like he is grossly underrated by a few here. Not really a big deal but it's bizarre that people can't recognize him as fairly accomplished for a three year Qb. FWIW, I think he can be grossly overrated by the media and get ready for more of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justice Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 McDaniels has also been accused of doing naughty things to a pie. Go ahead, try to tell me McDaniels doesn't look like Jim from "American Pie"!!!! http://s.bebo.com/app-image/7927041408/541...4/09/AP_Jim.jpg http://media.washingtontimes.com/media/img...c-333753975.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flbillsfan#1 Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 The Bears have STARTED adding the pieces.........they have signed Orlando Pace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 The Bears have STARTED adding the pieces.........they have signed Orlando Pace. Let's not forget that they signed a backup OL from Carolina. And, we know what that means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VJ91 Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 If you look at the success of the Patriots the last 10 years they consistently trade down in the draft and let perceived star players walk out the door (see Bledsoe, Milloy, Branch) and load up on draft picks. Cutler is clearly better then Bledsoe but I like the idea of loading up on draft picks like the Patriots have done and continue to do (see this year's draft). The Bills continually trade up in the draft for players like Losman, McCargo, Poz and look were it gets them. Overall I think the Broncos will reap the rewards of this trade in the long run. Unless of course by some miracle its against the Buffalo Bills, I hope the Bears win a SB before McDaniels' Broncos even play in an AFC Conference Championship game. Jay Cutler for freakin' Kyle Orton? And John idiot Clayton was complimenting the Broncos for that trade, of course talking up the two 1st round picks (that is always a good thing to get in any trade), but also that Orton will be a better "systems QB" then Cutler would have been?? Yeah right. In one season last year, Cutler set almost every team single season record for the Broncos.....and compared to any single season of the Bears in their 90 some year history! I did not notice Belicheck trading Tom Brady and keeping Cassell, did you? I don't think so. Sorry, no NFL team can afford to trade a young, cocky, talented record setting Pro Bowl QB with a rocket arm, and I don't care how many 1st round picks they "stockpile" in return. STUPID TRADE for the Broncos. And despite Cutler's immature and selfish reaction to McBellicheck trying to trade for Cassell first, McBellicheck was STUPID to try and do that in the first place. I am now a Jay Cutler / Bears secondary fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 The Bears have been in desperate need of a QB, they just got Cutler. Who were they going to pick at 18? Look who they have picked at offensive skill position in the first round over the years. They know exactly what they are getting in Cutler. The Broncos got......a bunch of picks. No names attatched. Odds are some will be busts. They'll have to spend high picks on defense because their defense is so bad, it requires an offense that can score 30 points per game. That kind of production requires .........a QB like Cutler----oops! The Broncos have a moron owner who spent $15 million to fire his coach---only to replace him with a complete nobody (other than he shares the same work zip code as BB), who immediately set to work to get rid of the franchise QB, and totally alienate the fanbase. Yup, tough to figure out who made out on this deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 If you look at the success of the Patriots the last 10 years they consistently trade down in the draft and let perceived star players walk out the door (see Bledsoe, Milloy, Branch) and load up on draft picks. Cutler is clearly better then Bledsoe but I like the idea of loading up on draft picks like the Patriots have done and continue to do (see this year's draft). The Bills continually trade up in the draft for players like Losman, McCargo, Poz and look were it gets them. Overall I think the Broncos will reap the rewards of this trade in the long run. You seem to forget that the latest Bilicheat coaches have all gone on to failure...and also he was a failure in his first head coach gig. Josh McDaniels might be a genius, but to this point he has shown me he is by far the most immature and foolish head coach I have seen in years. I understand he is an ex OC but that team needed defensive upgrading far more more then the offense did. The Bronco's had the #3 offense in the NFL and a pro bowl QB that threw for 4k yards...what a freaking moron to let him get away. Overall I see Denver in ruins for the next 5 years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 Speaking of BB... WHY did BB send Cassel to KC for chump change when we now see that Cutler gets traded for TWO #1's!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 You seem to forget that the latest Bilicheat coaches have all gone on to failure...and also he was a failure in his first head coach gig. Josh McDaniels might be a genius, but to this point he has shown me he is by far the most immature and foolish head coach I have seen in years. I understand he is an ex OC but that team needed defensive upgrading far more more then the offense did. The Bronco's had the #3 offense in the NFL and a pro bowl QB that threw for 4k yards...what a freaking moron to let him get away. Overall I see Denver in ruins for the next 5 years Wow, they havn't even made one of their next 4 1st round picks, 3 3rd rounders and not to mention they have Royal, Brandon Marshall and Ryan Clady to build around. Seems as if you're a little bitter about it. I will agree with you on how Denver has handled this. When I look at Mcdaniels he does have this condescending look of youth and arrogance. I will take the opposite spectrum of your prediction. I think as a result of this trade that they will better themselves. It is a crapshoot, because who knows if the players they draft will be any good or not. And I will go out on a limb and say that they at least play as well as they did last year record wise. As much as people like to turn a blind eye to it (which to me seems unfathomable) whoever their QB is this year, He will lead them to as many victories as Denver had last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaGimp Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 and the problem with that theory is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 and the problem with that theory is... The problem with trying to turn the Broncos into the Patriots overnight is that the Patriots were a defensive team first and foremost. The Broncos haven't got a defense and have to start over from scratch on that side of the ball. So, Wunderkind McDaniels starts out the job by building a "game managing" offense to compliment his great defense. Yeah, baby! The Bears still have all their top receivers from last year: Forte, Olsen, Hester, Clark, Davis. They drafted Earl Bennett last year. Bennett had James Hardy disease in that he came into the NFL unprepared and trying to read the playbook upside down. Some people felt that he was really catching on the last month of the season though... but, yeah, he's totally unproven at this point. PS: Anyone recall that Orton was already on a team with a "game managing" offense that went to a Super Bowl? But, he wasn't the manager, he was the guy with the clipboard watching Rex Grossman manage the team to the big show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 The problem with trying to turn the Broncos into the Patriots overnight is that the Patriots were a defensive team first and foremost. The Broncos haven't got a defense and have to start over from scratch on that side of the ball. So, Wunderkind McDaniels starts out the job by building a "game managing" offense to compliment his great defense. Yeah, baby! you're right. Now they will have to start all over and try to achieve the same great level of success of last year Yeah Baby! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bills_fan Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 Speaking of BB... WHY did BB send Cassel to KC for chump change when we now see that Cutler gets traded for TWO #1's!!! Because one is a true franchise QB and the other is a product of exceptional offensive coordinator coaching, terrific playcalling and having a Super Bowl talented team around him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fingon Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 Because one is a true franchise QB and the other is a product of exceptional offensive coordinator coaching, terrific playcalling and having a Super Bowl talented team around him. And the other isn't a product of his system? I wouldn't hold my breath on Cutler doing well in Chicago, as gun slingers with no one to throw to are bad news. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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