el Tigre Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 When you really boil down the situation with Adams,it just comes down to the guys an a-hole.I saw a similar scenario with him go down out here in Oakland. He was brought in and all the Raider fans were pumped cuz they thought they got a monstrous, impact player. Instead as the season wore on,he fought with the coaches and developed mysterious injuries and ended up getting little playing time. Even though he's 350+ lbs. he plays like a 285 lb gap shooting DT. He can have an impact,but only if he's allowed to do Sam wants to do.If you ask him to anchor,take on the double teams and make others around him better,he refuses and fights with the coaches. He's not a team player,and we're better off without him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macaroni Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 maybe ........ just MAYBE ...... the team would be better served if we let Sam be Sam, and built a defense around him, instead of pulling him and playing a scrub that is willing to play within the "defensive gameplan" even though it can't stop a run OR a pass. I want to like this coaching staff ..... I really really do ..... but until they learn to play to the rosters strength, rather than try and fit a bunch of square pegs into round holes, I have no faith in them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
booya2 Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 Macaroni... I have to agree with you. It seems to me when we let, as you say, "Sam do what Sam wants to do" he often is in the backfield to practically take the handoff on run plays and completely reaks havoc with his penetration on pass plays. I frankly don't care if he's 350 lbs. or 150 lbs. I've seen few players in the history of the game fire off the ball and get the kind of penetration into the backfield that Sam Adams gets. He's a disruptive force that creates game changing plays. As far as him being an a-hole... I agree there's a consistent pattern of quick departures in other venues that led to him signing with Buffalo. However, it was widely being reported by credible sources that Marvin Lewis wanted him and the Bengals offered more money but Sam chose to come to Buffalo. And since he's been here all I've seen of these "blow ups" is Sam is complaining that he wants to play and doesn't want to be taken off the field. I can't exactly fault him for that, because we're clearly a better team with him on the field. I say turn the big guy loose and let him reak havoc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jester43 Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 i think the guy's probably a dickhead, but he STILL should be on the field. even playing the "wrong way" he's still better than anything else we have. but i understand mularkey's pov as well- his hands are tied: he has been handed a steaming pile of schitt for an interior defense (thanks td)and he's just trying to use his players in a way that will minimize the damage. that means sam has to sacrifice his stats and try to plug the middle, as oppose to trying to cheat and shoot the gaps to get sacks. if we had another good nose tackle and a real middle linebacker, that might work, but with this roster sam is going to have to put the team first and just plug the middle. apparently he doesn't want to do that. so i don't blame mularkey for sitting him down. at this point it is too late to build around sam's talents. donohoe should have done that last summer, but he didn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macaroni Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 but i understand mularkey's pov as well- his hands are tied: he has been handed a steaming pile of schitt for an interior defense (thanks td)and he's just trying to use his players in a way that will minimize the damage. 516052[/snapback] But a point I've tried to make in another post is ...... Ted Washington was a great "plug the middle guy" ...... which allowed Pat Williams to collapse the center of the O-line ..... therefore we had a great DT tandem, Ted left .... and all of a sudden we had to ask Phat Pat to be a run stuffer ... he was OK, but not great at stuffing the run, and nobody was collapsing the pocket. We bring Sam-I-am in, and all of a sudden Sam collapses the pocket, while Pat stays at home, then Pat collapses the pocket while Sam stays at home, once again a great DT tandem. THEN we get rid of Pat, and ask Sam to stay at home to stuff the run .... that's not what he does, he's a pocket collapser ...... our DTs stink again. Soooooooo .... in my humble opinion MM wasn't "handed a steaming pile for DTs" we created this pile ....... we could have avoided it twice but we didn't Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadBuffaloDisease Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 Soooooooo .... in my humble opinion MM wasn't "handed a steaming pile for DTs" we created this pile ....... we could have avoided it twice but we didn't It could have been avoided the first time since Fat Ted came crawling back for less money, but with PW getting twice his old salary, keeping him wasn't an option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Gross Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 If the Bills are garbage without Sam how is it that YPC and defensive offside penalties are less in the games he didn't play? Part of our problem stopping the run is him over-pursuing the play, and teams are pretty well depending on it. He's a loose cannon. If they "built a scheme around Sam" it would be back to the Walt Corey "tackle the guy with the ball" strategy.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jester43 Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 But a point I've tried to make in another post is ...... Ted Washington was a great "plug the middle guy" ...... which allowed Pat Williams to collapse the center of the O-line ..... therefore we had a great DT tandem, Ted left .... and all of a sudden we had to ask Phat Pat to be a run stuffer ... he was OK, but not great at stuffing the run, and nobody was collapsing the pocket. We bring Sam-I-am in, and all of a sudden Sam collapses the pocket, while Pat stays at home, then Pat collapses the pocket while Sam stays at home, once again a great DT tandem. THEN we get rid of Pat, and ask Sam to stay at home to stuff the run .... that's not what he does, he's a pocket collapser ...... our DTs stink again. Soooooooo .... in my humble opinion MM wasn't "handed a steaming pile for DTs" we created this pile ....... we could have avoided it twice but we didn't 516065[/snapback] i agree to a point...except that donohoe SHOULD NOT have given williams that kind of money...what he should have done is what he is paid to do: draft capable replacements for these guys when they price themselves out of the market. if he was doing his job there would be enough good DTs and ILBs on this roster that sam could still be sam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macaroni Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 If the Bills are garbage without Sam how is it that YPC and defensive offside penalties are less in the games he didn't play? Part of our problem stopping the run is him over-pursuing the play, and teams are pretty well depending on it. He's a loose cannon. If they "built a scheme around Sam" it would be back to the Walt Corey "tackle the guy with the ball" strategy.... 516076[/snapback] No .... No .... No ...... It's not that the Bills are garbage without Sam ...... however they ARE garbage without Sam and a DT that compliments him. The D-line is also garbage WITH Sam, if you ask him to play a "style" he does not or can not play. It's kind of like the "old days" with Smith and Henson ........ Bruce was the out of control, hair on fire, go for broke sack machine ...... however .... he was a bit "soft" some may even say weak against the run. Phil on the other hand was great at sealing off the edge and closing down the running lane (allowing the LBs to "cheat" to cover up Bruce's "weakness". The tandom of Bruce and Phil played well together ........ one without the other (or at least another DE with the same "talent") wouldn't work nearly as well. Just picture if you will for a moment that back in the 90's we lost Phil, and didn't have someone strong enough to let the LBs "cheat" and Marve goes to Bruce and says .......... "Bruce, we don't want you to rush the passer anymore, the team needs you to establish your territory and stop the run." ............. Bad things man ..... there would be baaaad things happening at that meeting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macaroni Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 i agree to a point...except that donohoe SHOULD NOT have given williams that kind of money...what he should have done is what he is paid to do: draft capable replacements for these guys when they price themselves out of the market. if he was doing his job there would be enough good DTs and ILBs on this roster that sam could still be sam. 516082[/snapback] either way would have been just fine ....... the point I am trying to make is we need a team of players playing to their talents and complimenting each other .... it doesn't really matter what their name is (other than we pay good damn money for their jerseys) as long as we fit the gameplan to the players ...... NOT try to fit a player to our gameplan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 either way would have been just fine ....... the point I am trying to make is we need a team of players playing to their talents and complimenting each other .... it doesn't really matter what their name is (other than we pay good damn money for their jerseys) as long as we fit the gameplan to the players ...... NOT try to fit a player to our gameplan.516090[/snapback] Bingo! Not trying to open up a debate here but, I will use the "dreaded one" (DB) as case in point: IMO, that has been the problem with DB and his last two teams. NE hit gold when he went down. The Bills? Not saying that it wasn't a good move... It was... Just bring in the players that are gonna fit your plan and don't make the same mistakes over again. Maybe it is all part of the plan to revamp the line next year... They can't tell that to "Joe Schmo" fan out there! They'd hit the roof! They (TD/MM) has gotta have a vision? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChasBB Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 It might be okay to let Sam be Sam, but how will that wash with the other players on defense? Won't they (eventually) follow his lead? If they see him giving the coaches crap, won't that result the other players eventually disrespecting the coach and staff? Maybe they already do. This is a tough stage for this football team. The coaches are on the hot seat, the GM is on the hot seat. Many players are on the hot seat. Just a lot of tension in this organization. How old is Sam Adams now? I think it's safe to say that he's old enough that he's not going to change. This isn't just some bad habit that a young player drops when disciplined by a high school or college coach. This is an established behavior pattern and it won't change. As great as Sam CAN be, this is still a team sport. I don't have a problem with Mularkey being hard-nosed with Sam Adams. The team doesn't need head cases like this. It just undermines everyone else's efforts in the organization. If Adams is so great, I'd like to see him turn it up several notches for ALL of the remaining games and help earn this team a playoff spot. If Adams can't/won't put in a better effort, then it's time to deactivate him and move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
el Tigre Posted November 30, 2005 Author Share Posted November 30, 2005 I agree with all of you who say this situation was brought on by TD.He should have either re-signed Pat or gotten a capable replacement.But that didn't happen.TD has done a poor job,but that doesn't excuse Adams actions.If a team asks you to stay at home and plug the middle,you do it.Especially when you're being paid millions.He pulled this crap with the Raiders and now he's doing it here.This is a team game and Sam ain't no team player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiderweb Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 I agree with all of you who say this situation was brought on by TD.He should have either re-signed Pat or gotten a capable replacement.But that didn't happen.TD has done a poor job,but that doesn't excuse Adams actions.If a team asks you to stay at home and plug the middle,you do it.Especially when you're being paid millions.He pulled this crap with the Raiders and now he's doing it here.This is a team game and Sam ain't no team player. 516125[/snapback] I've kind of defended Adams, as he does bring unique talents to the field, but it's painfully obvious that he's best when a team already has a two gap DT next to him so he can go after the QB, collapse the pocket and penetrate against the run. He lacks interest in being the plugger and with what he's being paid, he should be far more willing to adapt. Yet, it does come back on TD doesn't it? Adams, as it seems, has been well known as wanting to play to his strengths and has objected to similar roles before. Recently, it's been said he can be quite a disruptive locker room guy when he's not happy as well, which explains why a player as good as him has traveled as much as he has. Yet, TD knew this, or should have. If they wanted him, it had better for his attack, penetrating, pocket collapsing skills, because Sam wasn't going to be happy any other way. He was and is a known commodity. All this makes us long for the day when we had Ted Washington, a true mountain of a man, plugging the middle. I've never seen anyone better at stuffing the run than big Ted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bills_fan Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 All this makes us long for the day when we had Ted Washington, a true mountain of a man, plugging the middle. I've never seen anyone better at stuffing the run than big Ted. But, hey, a year of John Fina was worth letting Ted go. Cause we all know the 01-02 Bills had the personnell to win shootouts. A tough, run-stuffing interior defender to keep games low scoring and give us a shot wasn't necessary according to TD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 This really is simple to figure out...... Sam was able to overpursue becuase Pat Williams was staying at home.... Now that we dont have that cushion....every time Sam overpursues and guesses wrong.....the bills line pays for it. Get another anchor DT in here and we would see Sam looking like a Pro Bowler again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bills_fan Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 This really is simple to figure out...... Sam was able to overpursue becuase Pat Williams was staying at home.... Now that we dont have that cushion....every time Sam overpursues and guesses wrong.....the bills line pays for it. Get another anchor DT in here and we would see Sam looking like a Pro Bowler again. Bravo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macaroni Posted November 30, 2005 Share Posted November 30, 2005 This really is simple to figure out...... Sam was able to overpursue becuase Pat Williams was staying at home.... Now that we dont have that cushion....every time Sam overpursues and guesses wrong.....the bills line pays for it. Get another anchor DT in here and we would see Sam looking like a Pro Bowler again. 516433[/snapback] By jove I think you've got it!!!!! An even better scenario would be to get another DT who can also crushes the middle of the pocket ....... and they can alternate "staying at home" and persuing the QB. ala Sam and Pat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
el Tigre Posted November 30, 2005 Author Share Posted November 30, 2005 This really is simple to figure out...... Sam was able to overpursue becuase Pat Williams was staying at home.... Now that we dont have that cushion....every time Sam overpursues and guesses wrong.....the bills line pays for it. Get another anchor DT in here and we would see Sam looking like a Pro Bowler again. 516433[/snapback] You're right.That is the simplest solution.It just pisses me off that a guy being paid like Adams is won't swallow his pride a bit and help out the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bdelma Posted December 1, 2005 Share Posted December 1, 2005 Maybe they should let him go and sign with a contender. F the bills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts