Let’s talk D

[GunnerBill]

4 hours ago, HoofHearted said:

When was this? Only time I saw that we went three down was in our dime sets. Other than that we were in our typical 1's and 3's and played some G fronts. Nothing out of the norm.

 

Scheme is not the issue. DL gets too tall and pushed around - doesn't command doubles. Second level defenders looked horrific recognizing pullers.

 

I thought I saw multiple snaps with a bear front, but I was watching it on my ipad in an airport hotel so I wouldn't stake my life on it haha. 

 

I agree on all three points in your second para re. both scheme not being the issue, DL not having anyone that commands doubles without Ed, plays too upright and the second level defenders being a problem. I think the second level has been worse than the DL personally. Pretty much all season.

[Shaw66]

1 hour ago, CNYfan said:

Thompson

Yeah.  Right!

[HoofHearted]

1 hour ago, Fan in Chicago said:

Welcome back. Where ya been?

Haha thanks. I usually disappear during offseason and don’t get a chance to dive into Bills film during my season. Should be able to be more active again here in the coming weeks.

[RunTheBall]

It’s pretty obvious to me the problem is our D-line when it comes to run defense. They are atrocious. Our DT’s get blown off the ball backwards on almost every play. Our slow undersized LBs are getting pummeled by Olineman. Bosa crashes inside on every single play, doesn’t matter. Groot can set the edge unless it’s against Mahomes in the playoffs. This isn’t changing. Our only hope is for Josh Alien Allen to be unleashed and get an early lead so teams get away from the run game. It’s that bad. I don’t think we have the defense to make it far at all int he playoffs. We’ve already seen Josh in God Mode during playoffs and the D lets him down. This defense sucks.

 

[Aesop]

Ive been saying it for awhile. We lack a stud 1 tech. And with oliver out, we are down to depth at the 3 tech. I also have to note that I feel like its been 2 weeks straight that we are playing some of our big boys at end (TJ Sanders and DQ Jones). This may be due to injury (Bosa has been nursing a hand and AJE was out last week).

 

We cant ignore that we are light at LB. Bernard is good when he shoots a gap properly and forcing the play back inside, but if the OL gets to the second level, he gets taken out of the play more times then not. Milano, as much as I love him has been injured and is aging. 

 

I think McD has been trying to impliment more 4-3 base, but the injury to Shaq Thompson has killed that plan since hes been out. When we are in 4-3 and either Dorian or Thompson are in, we fare better against the run game.

 

Now to explain our issues on 3rd and long. This appears to be an issue thats been around for years under McD. Im not sure if teams are just successfully finding the soft spot in the zone and McD is relying too much on only sending 4 in the pass rush. Or if our pressure packages are just not up to snuff. Is it a personnel issue? Guys not winning there 1v1 at the LOS? Im not sure, but boy is it frustrating.

 

Just my 2 cents.

[HoofHearted]

1 hour ago, Dr. Who said:

Are these coaching issues? Can we make technical adjustments and suddenly be a more effective defense?

Some of the defensive problems persist across the years with different personnel, so I had wondered if it was a scheme issue.

I recollect you have insight, so I'd appreciate it if you could briefly explain why it is not a scheme issue.

We are built to be a penetrating, movement based, front. Inherently this will lead to you getting gashed every once in a while, but should lead to far more disruptives than just sitting back and reading. Key reads and, in conjunction, initial attack steps off those reads can absolutely improve with coaching and reps.

 

Our issue right now just seems to be age, on both ends really. You have young guys still learning and growing into the scheme while getting used to the speed of the pro game. On the flip side there’s guys who have lost a step and it’s showing as well. If you’re a half step slow in the trenches it’s the difference in making a tackle for a loss vs. getting reached or washed in the run game.

 

I started going through this weekends game today and was actually encouraged with what I saw from the defensive line, though admittedly I only got a few series in. Backers struggled with reads. Both Dorian and Milano were noticeably slow on some plays. Taron fit incorrectly on one. LBs not working the plus consistently on zone.

 

Overall we do look a lot better than we did earlier in the year, though admittedly I haven’t dissected the stuff from earlier in the year outside of just what I saw watching the game. 

 

 

[Shaw66]

5 hours ago, DrBob806 said:

I don't think anything can change at this point of the season, unless they decide to blitz more. Implementing a brand new scheme is very rare 10 games in to a season.

 

It's one reason why I predicted a 42-38 Bills win yesterday. 

 

The Bills are kind of like an old PAC 12 or Big 12 team. They focus on outscoring the other team, and hope to make a few defensive stops during a game.

I think we will see some different things as we get deeper into the season. I said earlier in the year, and I'll say it again, that I think later in the season we're going to see more man-to-man. It will be sprinkled in, but there will be more of it. I think. Think Benford, White and Hairston all can play it. 

 

I also think we will begin to see more blitzing paired with the man-to-man. There's been very little blitzing so far this year, and I think that will change. 

 

On top of that, I think we will see the zone defenses tightening down a bit. One reason all of those passes get completed underneath the corners is because they're playing deep enough to prevent the deep ball from being in play at all. I think it's been McDermott's plan all along to tighten up the zone coverages as the season goes on and as his young defenders learn the schemes.

 

But I don't think the pass defense is the problem. It's the run defense that has to be much more consistent. McDermott has been clear for years that he's willing to give up running yardage in order to stop the passing game, and the stance. This season is similar to other seasons. We're at the top of the league in past defense and in the middle of the league and run defense., this season we're at the bottom of the league and run defense.

[HoofHearted]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I thought I saw multiple snaps with a bear front, but I was watching it on my ipad in an airport hotel so I wouldn't stake my life on it haha. 

 

I agree on all three points in your second para re. both scheme not being the issue, DL not having anyone that commands doubles without Ed, plays too upright and the second level defenders being a problem. I think the second level has been worse than the DL personally. Pretty much all season.

In the few series I’ve watched so far in this game I’d definitely agree. Backers looked to have clear run throughs early on in the game. DL definitely looks much improved from earlier in the year at least through the first couple series of the game I was able to look at from the endzone angle in this game.

[HoofHearted]

20 minutes ago, Aesop said:

Ive been saying it for awhile. We lack a stud 1 tech. And with oliver out, we are down to depth at the 3 tech. I also have to note that I feel like its been 2 weeks straight that we are playing some of our big boys at end (TJ Sanders and DQ Jones). This may be due to injury (Bosa has been nursing a hand and AJE was out last week).

 

We cant ignore that we are light at LB. Bernard is good when he shoots a gap properly and forcing the play back inside, but if the OL gets to the second level, he gets taken out of the play more times then not. Milano, as much as I love him has been injured and is aging. 

 

I think McD has been trying to impliment more 4-3 base, but the injury to Shaq Thompson has killed that plan since hes been out. When we are in 4-3 and either Dorian or Thompson are in, we fare better against the run game.

 

Now to explain our issues on 3rd and long. This appears to be an issue thats been around for years under McD. Im not sure if teams are just successfully finding the soft spot in the zone and McD is relying too much on only sending 4 in the pass rush. Or if our pressure packages are just not up to snuff. Is it a personnel issue? Guys not winning there 1v1 at the LOS? Im not sure, but boy is it frustrating.

 

Just my 2 cents.

Our pass rush is not good. We resorted to overloading one side of the line yesterday and completely playing unsound vs the run in obvious passing situations just to ensure we get 1v1s and we still weren’t great winning those. Our interior twist game is awful - as athletic as we are up front we sure do struggle to read and move laterally with our interior guys. Also doesn’t help that we’re playing with tackles at end in obvious passing situations.

[Dr. Who]

23 minutes ago, HoofHearted said:

We are built to be a penetrating, movement based, front. Inherently this will lead to you getting gashed every once in a while, but should lead to far more disruptives than just sitting back and reading. Key reads and, in conjunction, initial attack steps off those reads can absolutely improve with coaching and reps.

 

Our issue right now just seems to be age, on both ends really. You have young guys still learning and growing into the scheme while getting used to the speed of the pro game. On the flip side there’s guys who have lost a step and it’s showing as well. If you’re a half step slow in the trenches it’s the difference in making a tackle for a loss vs. getting reached or washed in the run game.

 

I started going through this weekends game today and was actually encouraged with what I saw from the defensive line, though admittedly I only got a few series in. Backers struggled with reads. Both Dorian and Milano were noticeably slow on some plays. Taron fit incorrectly on one. LBs not working the plus consistently on zone.

 

Overall we do look a lot better than we did earlier in the year, though admittedly I haven’t dissected the stuff from earlier in the year outside of just what I saw watching the game. 

 

 

Thanks. This is somewhat more hopeful than I had supposed. I had surmised that McDermott took over calling the D, and that was the main engine of any discernible improvement. It would be encouraging if development of the younger players is also part of that. They still have to limit the explosive running plays. They're making a fella like Tucker appear to be an all pro.