erynthered Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 Unless you are a homosexual, a divorcee..... 362484[/snapback] Birth control? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 Birth control? 362536[/snapback] If you don't want to follow the rules, then don't be Catholic. But this world would be a better place if one didn't be-little others for their choices on religion. If that religion is not affecting you (like Islam does) what do you care what they accept and don't accept? If you choose not to follow then you take the change in 100 years or so when you die that you made the right decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erynthered Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 If you don't want to follow the rules, then don't be Catholic. But this world would be a better place if one didn't be-little others for their choices on religion. If that religion is not affecting you (like Islam does) what do you care what they accept and don't accept? If you choose not to follow then you take the change in 100 years or so when you die that you made the right decision. 362541[/snapback] Do you really think Jesus said " No to birth control, its evil" Where did this rule get its begining? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gavin in Va Beach Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 Do you really think Jesus said " No to birth control, its evil" Where did this rule get its begining? 362549[/snapback] "Be fruitful, and multiply!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erynthered Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 "Be fruitful, and multiply!" 362551[/snapback] I thought they didnt like "Homo's" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 Do you really think Jesus said " No to birth control, its evil" Where did this rule get its begining? 362549[/snapback] Has more to do with how birth control works. Most do not prevent conception, but rather prevent the embryo from attaching to the uterine wall. There have been some discussions about permitting estrogin type contraceptives (which block ovulation) and condoms, but the IUD, Norplants, etc... But again for the hot pocket folks they don't see the big picture and understanding. They just see the Catholic Church bad because all contraceptives bad. What the Churches major issue is those that just kill the embryo. While I know currently all are banned the ones that abort a child are on another scale. Breaking one of the major commandments of thou shall not kill, which these effectively do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gavin in Va Beach Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 I thought they didnt like "Homo's" 362554[/snapback] It's 'Be fruitful'...not 'Be fruity'... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnTheRocks Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 Breaking one of the major commandments of thou shall not kill, which these effectively do. 362556[/snapback] one of the major ones? is it ok to break any of the less major ones? this has nothing to do with what you just said VA, but one of the things that always bothers me is when someone says they are going to heaven because they keep the 10 Commandments. Then you ask them if they can name them, and you hear a lot of what my deaf grandmother hears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erynthered Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 It's 'Be fruitful'...not 'Be fruity'... 362563[/snapback] My fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 one of the major ones? is it ok to break any of the less major ones? this has nothing to do with what you just said VA, but one of the things that always bothers me is when someone says they are going to heaven because they keep the 10 Commandments. Then you ask them if they can name them, and you hear a lot of what my deaf grandmother hears. 362565[/snapback] It's actually more then the ten commandments, you have the 7 deadly, etc... But you're right there is a lot of dead air space when asked. Most have a real issue with the coveting part. They think only if they have sex with her is it a sin, lusting after her is a laso just as bad. That one always gets me BTW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubes Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 But again for the hot pocket folks they don't see the big picture and understanding. They just see the Catholic Church bad because all contraceptives bad. 362556[/snapback] I often wonder if it's the Catholic Church that sometimes doesn't see the big picture with respect to contraceptives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erynthered Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 Jimmy Buffets 7 deadly sins.......... The rumors and the stories of my past i can't deny I'm no saint ignatius but again i'm no barfly The wrong thing is the right thing until you lose control I've got this bank of bad habits in a corner of my soul Bank of bad habits The price of vice fortold One by one they'll do you in They're bound to take their toll The wrong thing is the right thing until you lose control I've got this bank of bad habits in a corner of my soul Last night i said goodbye to a dear old friend of mine Just a throw back shell beach party, nothin' really asinine Rum and cooked animals and bull sh-- by the ton That party lasted way too long and i had too much fun Bank of bad habits The price of vice fortold One by one they'll do you in They're bound to take their toll The wrong thing is the right thing until you lose control I've got this bank of bad habits in a corner of my soul That bank of bad habits is worth its weight in gold Time for you to spend that dough You're the only one you owe So put away those alibis You can't fool that banker in the sky (spoken) Now let me tell you about the 7 deadly sins: 1. pride...thou shalt not have pride in thy neighbor. 2. coveting...thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife. 3. lust...thou shalt not lust after his neighbor's wife. 4. anger...do not be angry with your neighbor's wife. 5. gluttony...do not eat thy neighbor's wife's ........popcorn. 6. envy...do not envy your neighbor's wife. 7. sloth...do not be a slob. And the eighth deadly sin is............pizza! A picture's worth a thousand words just ask a cameraman And it's no sin to stop and look, i do it when i can But you have to purge that urge to merge You have to keep your head Or trouble is what you will find inside some stranger's bed Bank of bad habits The price of vice foretold One by one they'll do you in They're bound to take their toll The wrong thing is the right thing until you lose control I've got this bank of bad habits It's worth it's weight in gold (spoken) Yeah, we're talkin' krugerands......dubloons I was wonderin', um, do you think they have an atm machine for bad habits? Hmm. I think i'll apply for that card. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 I often wonder if it's the Catholic Church that sometimes doesn't see the big picture with respect to contraceptives. 362579[/snapback] Well there are two issues with it. One being the one I mentioned that those "contraceptives" that do not block ovation and only prevent the fertalized egg from embedding is considered murder. The other one and part of the teaching is that once it becomes common blace that man will use and abuse the woman for his own pleasure and will lose the unity of the both that is supposed to exist when one has sex. Meaning there will be no emotions to the act, making it worthless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 Some of you remind me of my brother who plays video games hooked up to the internet talking to invisible friends through the medium of a screen thinking if they spend enough time on it some type of prize is awaiting them. Here's a solution to your dilemma: get a life. Who knows you might do something productive with your life and actually be a benefit to society and others. I hate to tell you this, but there is more to life than message boards. I may read them every so often, but I will not waste my life answering to all the pettiness or reading all the responses. If you think you will post some great response to illustrate some type of hypocrisy or judgementalism here's another clue: learn what the words mean that you are using and realize that Our Lord was judgemental and so am I. Our Lord said not to judge, but that was the intention of the individual, not their actions or their malice, of which He said, "Judge not according to the appearance, but judge just judgment." (John 7: 24) Don't quote Jesus Christ on "Judge not lest ye be judged" without realizing that we are supposed to judge justly, to the point of calling people "a brood of vipers... how will you flee the wrath of hell." If you want to ask me legit questions and know my position, fine, and I will answer, but if you think I'm going to get into a match of wits with sarcasm as your means of communicating and half-brained responses than you are blowing hot water through your nose. I have a life, a good business, I enjoy learning and helping others. That is why you will not see my posting much for the rest of the week (hint: I'm trying to be more than a leech on a message board and deal with real people) As a new friend just reminded me: Illegitimi Non Carborundum (thanks Beausox) Oh and Darin, when you finally think of something intelligent to say formulate it with proof and explain your own position of what you believe and how you practice it without playing the role of the Devil's Advocate. At this point you are only playing a mindless Devil. 362477[/snapback] You're just the bestest guy ever. You're gonna have a swell time in heaven, by golly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 Well there are two issues with it. One being the one I mentioned that those "contraceptives" that do not block ovation and only prevent the fertalized egg from embedding is considered murder. The other one and part of the teaching is that once it becomes common blace that man will use and abuse the woman for his own pleasure and will lose the unity of the both that is supposed to exist when one has sex. Meaning there will be no emotions to the act, making it worthless. 362586[/snapback] I sure hope you never jerked off. That's pretty much half murder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of BiB Posted June 20, 2005 Share Posted June 20, 2005 I sure hope you never jerked off. That's pretty much half murder. 362740[/snapback] Been watching. Have fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 I sure hope you never jerked off. That's pretty much half murder. 362740[/snapback] If I have I have been to reconilation and been absolved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erynthered Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 I sure hope you never jerked off. That's pretty much half murder. 362740[/snapback] I held back from that one, I really did, I swear. (Lets see, Married for 15 years, faithfully, condom, no condom, condom, no condom, condom, no condom. !@#$ it I'll go to hell making love with the woman I love having a Sperm stopper. Please forgive me ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 So let me get this straight: God created the earth and all men. And approximately 1-2 billion are Catholics, and if they say the right stuff they're going to Heaven. But what happens to all these other 6 billion of God's children who believe something else or nothing at all? They just go to Hell? Really? This is really God's wish for his non-Catholic children? Is there even room for all these people? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 So let me get this straight: God created the earth and all men. And approximately 1-2 billion are Catholics, and if they say the right stuff they're going to Heaven. But what happens to all these other 6 billion of God's children who believe something else or nothing at all? They just go to Hell? Really? This is really God's wish for his non-Catholic children? Is there even room for all these people? 362825[/snapback] Children are never condemned. However, every Christian faith does say that you have to accept Jesus or you are condemned. But this also applies to those who have reach the age of reasoning. Has nothing to do either with saying the right thing. Actions speak louder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UConn James Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 I sure hope you never jerked off. That's pretty much half murder. 362740[/snapback] And all that yellow stuff on your car this time of year? I wonder if the oak trees feel ashamed because they masturbated. I had a botany and Shakespeare class in the same semester years ago. It's pretty cool how the Bard compares people's life cycles in terms of the planting season. Look at the process, and in the grand scale, the processes of Life really aren't very different.... In re: to the original subject, I always remember a scene from my youth at my grandparents' church in WNY (Palmyra?), a pretty big congregation. I excused myself to use the facilities downstairs shortly after the collection. There on the table was the biggest pile of money I'd ever seen and there were five guys sitting around smoking and counting it up and words can't describe the look in their eyes and faces, but it's probably a lot like Silas Marner when he was counting his gold pieces in his dark hovel. I visited them last week actually, and got the annual You're Going to Hell speech. Whatever. I don't like an entity that allows things to happen like He does and call it His Plan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Children are never condemned. However, every Christian faith does say that you have to accept Jesus or you are condemned. But this also applies to those who have reach the age of reasoning. Has nothing to do either with saying the right thing. Actions speak louder. 362830[/snapback] Children grow up though. Eventually they are adults and can be condemned. So in other words, if there is 8 billion on the planet, God saves all Catholics who act the right way, and sends the other 7.5 billion or so to hell? And you really believe this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 So in other words, if there is 8 billion on the planet, God saves all Catholics who act the right way, and sends the other 7.5 billion or so to hell? And you really believe this? 362833[/snapback] Never said it was easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Never said it was easy. 362834[/snapback] So in other words, God punishes any child who grows up in another faith anywhere on the planet who continues to believe in the faith that his or her parents brought them up in by sending them to Hell. Billions of them. And you believe this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 So in other words, God punishes any child who grows up in another faith anywhere on the planet who continues to believe in the faith that his or her parents brought them up in. Billions of them. And you believe this? 362835[/snapback] How many times are you going to ask the same exact question? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gavin in Va Beach Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Children grow up though. Eventually they are adults and can be condemned. So in other words, if there is 8 billion on the planet, God saves all Catholics who act the right way, and sends the other 7.5 billion or so to hell? And you really believe this? 362833[/snapback] Or what of a tribe of people cut off from the modern world who have never even heard about this Jesus fellow, are they banned from heaven because missionaries haven't gotten around to them yet? That would be pretty cruel methinks... I don't want to start any blasphemous rumours But I think that God's got a sick sense of humor And when I die, I expect to find him laughing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 How many times are you going to ask the same exact question? 362836[/snapback] Until you answer, yes, I believe that God sends billions to Hell because they do not convert, even if they have never heard of Jesus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Until you answer, yes, I believe that God sends billions to Hell because they do not convert, even if they have never heard of Jesus. 362839[/snapback] But he doesn't and the Catholic faith doesn't profess that. While some pretestant religions do the Catholic faith says that those who use other forms of faith or are ignorant of the Church can be saved but first must enter Purgatory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erynthered Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Never said it was easy. 362834[/snapback] Is Eryn Illegal because she was conceived via IVF. Is she not a child of God ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Is Eryn Illegal because she was conceived via IVF. Is she not a child of God ? 362851[/snapback] No child is "illegal". Do you think this sh-- up as you go or you been hanging out with BF a little too much lately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erynthered Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 No child is "illegal". Do you think this sh-- up as you go or you been hanging out with BF a little too much lately. 362853[/snapback] Answer the question then. How is my daughter viewed in the Church. And you know what church I'm talking about. She was ill conceived according to the church. Pisses me off, as you can see.............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gavin in Va Beach Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Is Eryn Illegal because she was conceived via IVF. Is she not a child of God ? 362851[/snapback] Yeah, so tell her to stop picking lettuce and get her ass back to Mexico! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Answer the question then. How is my daughter viewed in the Church. And you know what church I'm talking about. She was ill conceived according to the church.Pisses me off, as you can see.............. 362854[/snapback] No the problem with IVF is how it works. There are several issues, the first being if boths the eggs and sperm come from annonymous donors you could potentially wind up with a child who is the joining of a brother and sister. Highly unlikely but could happen. Second the Church looks on the Eryn as a creation of God. Always has, and always will. To think otherwise is wrong. The Catholic Church has always said that the creation of a baby in a marraige is right even if scientific means are used. Finally the real problem with IVF is that usually multiple eggs are fertalized and only the most viable one implanted with the others destroyed. Anyway you look at it that was a life and the other babies were killed. Another fact you may or may not be aware of is that some doctors actually implant multiple fertalized eggs in the uterus and several months into the pregnancy figures out which one is doing the best and aborts the other. BTW a lot of people are not aware of that final paragraph and the Catholic Church recognizes that and understands that a lot of people get IVF without full knowledge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 But he doesn't and the Catholic faith doesn't profess that. While some pretestant religions do the Catholic faith says that those who use other forms of faith or are ignorant of the Church can be saved but first must enter Purgatory. 362841[/snapback] I thought I read that all people who enter Purgatory eventually get to Heaven, so how is that possible? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 I thought I read that all people who enter Purgatory eventually get to Heaven, so how is that possible? 362860[/snapback] Not true, I don't think, but I don't know everything. The are sent there to be purged of there sins. They will then be judged. I believe most who go to purgatory go to Heaven. However, in order to even go to purgatory one must have at least lived Christlike, if not in the faith. It is believed that one reduces or eliminates their time in purgatory by receiving the graces of God, via the sacraments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erynthered Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 No the problem with IVF is how it works. There are several issues, the first being if boths the eggs and sperm come from annonymous donors you could potentially wind up with a child who is the joining of a brother and sister. Highly unlikely but could happen. Second the Church looks on the Eryn as a creation of God. Always has, and always will. To think otherwise is wrong. The Catholic Church has always said that the creation of a baby in a marraige is right even if scientific means are used. Finally the real problem with IVF is that usually multiple eggs are fertalized and only the most viable one implanted with the others destroyed. Anyway you look at it that was a life and the other babies were killed. Another fact you may or may not be aware of is that some doctors actually implant multiple fertalized eggs in the uterus and several months into the pregnancy figures out which one is doing the best and aborts the other. BTW a lot of people are not aware of that final paragraph and the Catholic Church recognizes that and understands that a lot of people get IVF without full knowledge. 362859[/snapback] While I appreciate your response, you really have no !@#$ing idea what its like. Honestly, you dont. While I like you as a friend, you are a complete idiot when it comes to this, and what it encompasses. You know how much I love my girls VA, Should I have been punished by not having the oppertunity to be a father because of my faithbecause I shouldnt have spent 15K the first time? Or the second? Or the third? Or the fourth? Thats right 4 times we tried over 8 years. I was raised a RC, even went to a RC military school. Why was my faith strayed, was it because I love my wife? I wanted help in procreating for her? Who's fault is this? Bull Sh*t Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Not true, I don't think, but I don't know everything. The are sent there to be purged of there sins. They will then be judged. I believe most who go to purgatory go to Heaven. However, in order to even go to purgatory one must have at least lived Christlike, if not in the faith. It is believed that one reduces or eliminates their time in purgatory by receiving the graces of God, via the sacraments. 362863[/snapback] After death, people who had repented for their sins, but had not expiated them, are purged before entering Heaven. Everyone who enters Purgatory will eventually reach Heaven, therefore it is not some lesser form of Hell. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purgatory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 While I appreciate your response, you really have no !@#$ing idea what its like. Honestly, you dont. While I like you as a friend, you are a complete idiot when it comes to this, and what it encompasses. You know how much I love my girls VA, Should I have been punished by not having the oppertunity to be a father because of my faithbecause I shouldnt have spent 15K the first time? Or the second? Or the third? Or the fourth? Thats right 4 times we tried over 8 years. I was raised a RC, even went to a RC military school. Why was my faith strayed, was it because I love my wife? I wanted help in procreating for her?Who's fault is this? Bull Sh*t 362866[/snapback] No I don't. I neither judged you nor said I don't think anything bad about you or your situation. I can try to understand but never truely will. No I am not an idiot when it comes to this, but I do know what the Church teaches. And trust me they do not look at your daughter as anything less then a gift from God. Trust me on that, I know that for a fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purgatory 362869[/snapback] Okay, I honestly thought it was more of a "trial and purging" by fire, and some still choose not to go through the pain and suffering and are expelled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beausox Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Andrew Greely is a Roman Catholic priest and has a decent article which shows why many Catholics are not involved in the Intelligent design debate: http://www.commondreams.org/views05/0211-25.htm 362345[/snapback] Greeley is a Jesuit not a Catholic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts