CBS.com: This year’s version of Dak Prescott = Mason Rudolph

[MrEpsYtown]

3 minutes ago, BigBuff423 said:

 

1. The bolded part seems to be the qualifier as "huge" in that Dak's is fine, it's not just Stafford like. Rudolph has average arm strength as well, his downfield throws show he's got the arm but not that high speed velocity that Josh Allen or Rodgers or Newton have. That's not a deal breaker, plenty of good QBs have average arm strength. Look at the article from 20 years ago when comparing Peyton to Leaf...Peyton wasn't thought to have a "huge" arm either, but we know how that worked out. 

2. As for how it worked out for Cowboys, I'd say they did all right....and yes, sometimes we're protected from our own poor decisions by extraneous factors. Russell Wilson, 3rd, Cousins, 4th, now Dak in 4th....keep in mind, everyone who thinks they KNOW what QBs will do well and which ones won't are simply over confident. Rudolph has had one of the best college careers and he's shown he can throw deep, make progressions - give Trapasso credit for pointing this out and showing you how he's doing it, and is accurate. Can he throw the ball on a frozen rope on the 20 yard out? Probably not right now....but velocity can improve just a notch...and he doesn't need it to be improved that much. The key will be will the OC scheme to fit Rudolph's strengths? But, that could be said about all the QBs, especially the Rookie type and this year seems to be even more in that direction. Rudolph is a decent late 1st to 2nd round guy. He'll be good on the right team in the right system. 

 

Rudolph's arm strength is nowhere near Dak's is my point. It's closer to Nate Peterman. Trappaso is using Dak to make Rudolph sound good. It is lazy. Dak's arm strength is in that class right under huge. Rudolph's is below average. 

[BigBuff423]

4 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

 

Rudolph's arm strength is nowhere near Dak's is my point. It's closer to Nate Peterman. Trappaso is using Dak to make Rudolph sound good. It is lazy. Dak's arm strength is in that class right under huge. Rudolph's is below average. 

 

That may be your opinion, and to each his own. But it's hard to accept when you watch Rudolph's games and see him routinely pass the ball 50-60 yards in the air downfield. So, while I completely recognize long balls require a different strength than quick zip balls, he does have those throws in the 10-15 yard distances with tight windows. He can, and should, get better with zip (to some degree, you can't make it significantly better) but that is the ONE area everyone points to when it comes to Rudolph. His Offense is no different than Mayfield's or Darnold's yet that is often used in referencing how Rudolph isn't as good as those others.

 

I'll eat my crow, but Rudolph goes to a team who knows how to use him, gives him a year on the bench to grow a bit stronger, learn the Offense and gain NFL confidence, and he will be a top 10 QB. Will he pass for 5000 yds and 40 TDs? Almost certainly not, but I think he absolutely can be a guy who passes for close to 4,000 yards, 25-28 TDs, and helps lead an Offense to a top 5 in scoring. 

[MrEpsYtown]

8 minutes ago, BigBuff423 said:

 

That may be your opinion, and to each his own. But it's hard to accept when you watch Rudolph's games and see him routinely pass the ball 50-60 yards in the air downfield. So, while I completely recognize long balls require a different strength than quick zip balls, he does have those throws in the 10-15 yard distances with tight windows. He can, and should, get better with zip (to some degree, you can't make it significantly better) but that is the ONE area everyone points to when it comes to Rudolph. His Offense is no different than Mayfield's or Darnold's yet that is often used in referencing how Rudolph isn't as good as those others.

 

I'll eat my crow, but Rudolph goes to a team who knows how to use him, gives him a year on the bench to grow a bit stronger, learn the Offense and gain NFL confidence, and he will be a top 10 QB. Will he pass for 5000 yds and 40 TDs? Almost certainly not, but I think he absolutely can be a guy who passes for close to 4,000 yards, 25-28 TDs, and helps lead an Offense to a top 5 in scoring. 

 

I'll eat crow too, there is absolutely no way that will happen in this dude's career. He is more likely to be a career #2 who starts a handful of games. 

 

But overall, my point is that he is nowhere near the prospect that Dak Prescott was. It's a lazy comparison to make him sound good. The only thing they had in common, which they also have in common with Mayfield is that they threw to wide open receivers. Not many people get better when it comes to tight window throws and accuracy. Dak really has not improved in that regard very much, but the running game, his athletic ability and offensive line allow him to make plays. Rudolph is a guy who needs work and solves nothing for a team like ours. He is not a true franchise quarterback. He could be serviceable in the right system. He needs just as much work as a guy like Allen, without any of the immense upside. He is not a first round pick. 

 

Dak is good. Not great. He cannot carry a team and they will likely be looking for another upgrade in a few years. He's a second round pick who went in the fourth. 

 

Rudolph is nowhere close to that. Maybe he becomes a below average starter, or ok backup. You don't draft those in the first round. His upside is much closer to what we already have and doesn't solve the conundrum we've been in for 20 years. 

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

As an analogy, I'll take it.

 

Now, what I want is for the Bills to take a gamble to trade up to #2 and take Rosen. But that requires the Giants to be willing to play ball, and even then there is a chance that Cleveland fakes us all out and takes Rosen a #1. 

 

If that falls through, and the Bills are looking at #22...I could live with it. It would mean almost no hope of playoffs in 2018 (our supporting cast is nowhere as good as the 2016 Cowboys), but I could deal with it.

1 minute ago, MrEpsYtown said:

 

 

Dak is good. Not great. He cannot carry a team and they will likely be looking for another upgrade in a few years. He's a second round pick who went in the fourth. 

 

 

I really don't think they will be upgrading. They stuck with Romo for all those years, and "good not great" and cheap is a good combination.

[BigBuff423]

2 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

 

I'll eat crow too, there is absolutely no way that will happen in this dude's career. He is more likely to be a career #2 who starts a handful of games. 

 

But overall, my point is that he is nowhere near the prospect that Dak Prescott was. It's a lazy comparison to make him sound good. The only thing they had in common, which they also have in common with Mayfield is that they threw to wide open receivers. Not many people get better when it comes to tight window throws and accuracy. Dak really has not improved in that regard very much, but the running game, his athletic ability and offensive line allow him to make plays. Rudolph is a guy who needs work and solves nothing for a team like ours. He is not a true franchise quarterback. He could be serviceable in the right system. He needs just as much work as a guy like Allen, without any of the immense upside. He is not a first round pick. 

 

Dak is good. Not great. He cannot carry a team and they will likely be looking for another upgrade in a few years. He's a second round pick who went in the fourth. 

 

Rudolph is nowhere close to that. Maybe he becomes a below average starter, or ok backup. You don't draft those in the first round. His upside is much closer to what we already have and doesn't solve the conundrum we've been in for 20 years. 

 

I respectfully disagree, but only time will tell. But, I am a man of my word: Rudolph doesn't become a quality NFL starter in 2 years, I'm back on this board and I'll admit I was wrong. 

[MrEpsYtown]

12 minutes ago, BigBuff423 said:

 

I respectfully disagree, but only time will tell. But, I am a man of my word: Rudolph doesn't become a quality NFL starter in 2 years, I'm back on this board and I'll admit I was wrong. 

 

Same. I have definitely been wrong on guys who I thought were going to be good who sucked. I've never been wrong on guys I thought were going to suck and wound up sucking. That's probably because I think everyone sucks. 

 

16 minutes ago, WhitewalkerInPhilly said:

I really don't think they will be upgrading. They stuck with Romo for all those years, and "good not great" and cheap is a good combination.

 

Popular thought is that he is really good. He really isn't. He is ok. He is totally reliant on having a good supporting cast and can't really make plays when he is the man. I think he does still have some upside because he has the physical ability. If he doesn't make a huge jump, the Cowboys will be drafting another in a couple of years. 

 

http://www.star-telegram.com/sports/nfl/dallas-cowboys/article192404149.html

 

https://247sports.com/nfl/dallas-cowboys/Bolt/Dak-Prescott-isnt-even-a-game-manager-110956037

 

So people want a supposed version of Dak....with significantly less ability ....in the first round. Makes sense.  

Edited April 9, 2018 by MrEpsYtown

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

26 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

 

 

Popular thought is that he is really good. He really isn't. He is ok. He is totally reliant on having a good supporting cast and can't really make plays when he is the man. I think he does still have some upside because he has the physical ability. If he doesn't make a huge jump, the Cowboys will be drafting another in a couple of years. 

 

http://www.star-telegram.com/sports/nfl/dallas-cowboys/article192404149.html

 

https://247sports.com/nfl/dallas-cowboys/Bolt/Dak-Prescott-isnt-even-a-game-manager-110956037

 

So people want a supposed version of Dak....with significantly less ability ....in the first round. Makes sense.  

 

He had pretty decent numbers his rookie year, but it helped a lot that he had a fantastic O-line and RB. I am curious to see how he does in 2018, but I agree that he is good, not great.

 

There were people clamoring in Summer 2017 that the Eagles had made a horrible mistake betting the farm on Wentz when they could have taken a shot at Dak. No one is saying that now.

[Mat68]

1 hour ago, BigBuff423 said:

 

That may be your opinion, and to each his own. But it's hard to accept when you watch Rudolph's games and see him routinely pass the ball 50-60 yards in the air downfield. So, while I completely recognize long balls require a different strength than quick zip balls, he does have those throws in the 10-15 yard distances with tight windows. He can, and should, get better with zip (to some degree, you can't make it significantly better) but that is the ONE area everyone points to when it comes to Rudolph. His Offense is no different than Mayfield's or Darnold's yet that is often used in referencing how Rudolph isn't as good as those others.

 

I'll eat my crow, but Rudolph goes to a team who knows how to use him, gives him a year on the bench to grow a bit stronger, learn the Offense and gain NFL confidence, and he will be a top 10 QB. Will he pass for 5000 yds and 40 TDs? Almost certainly not, but I think he absolutely can be a guy who passes for close to 4,000 yards, 25-28 TDs, and helps lead an Offense to a top 5 in scoring. 

Rudolph has very good deep accuracy.  The arm strength concern with Rudulph is not a matter of how far he can throw it, but how much velocity he can put on a ball.  Rudulph's largest issue is the lack of outside breaking route accuracy.  There are not many throws he makes outside the numbers inside 20 yards.  Those are the bread and butter throws in the NFL.  

[reddogblitz]

4 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

Oh jeez. Prescott was 24-38 for 302 yards, 3 tds, and 1 turnover (pick) for a 103.2 rating. The Cowboys scored 31 points and lost on a miracle play by Rodgers. Prescott did not "lose" the game.

 

People, be better than this. (Also, Yolo: the Cowboys went 13-3, not 12-4.)

 

Thanks for responding.

 

My response was mostly in jest to a silly topic.  Will Rudoph be the next Prescott?  Of course not. There is only 1 Dak Prescott just like there was only 1 Johnny Unitas, Jim Kelly, Roger Staubach, or Drew Brees.  There was only 1 and will never be another.  this is just lazy sport journalism IMHO.

 

But some guys are castigated  for his team losing a first round playoff game like Hotrod or Alex Smith or Flutie.  Yet other guys get a pass like Dak or Goff.