OldTimeAFLGuy Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 3 hours ago, ALF said: Thank you Bocephuz for such thorough research on such a critical draft. ...have to agree ALF....a critical and pivotal draft for this club....some key points IMO...... 1. At Pegula's expense, McBeane assembled a pretty formidable staff of major brass in the NFL personnel world. Despite the draft NEVER being an exact science, the pressure is on to produce. 2. All of the conjecture says this is one of the better QB classes in recent memory. Sure none have played a single NFL down, but the prognosis seems very positive, especially in a year when McBeane/McD are "QB hunting". 3. When is the last time Bflo has accumulated this type of draft capital in recent memory? If in fact this QB class is one of the better ones in recent memory, is it fate that Bflo has excellent draft capital and the need? Have the stars aligned? ....stay tuned............ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 27 minutes ago, Virgil said: Rosen’s weight and shoulder injury worries me Yeah, me too. But we do have a history here in B'lo, with drafting a guy who had a shoulder injury in the 1st, and he sure looked like his shoulder is fine last year. His concussion history worries me more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transplantbillsfan Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 Mayfield please Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 24 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Fair, and actually now that I look more carefully at the enlarged chart, that can't be the answer either as Bocephuz has "touch" as its own category as well. Since we have your attention...can you educate me about Mayfield's footwork? It looks non-standard to me, but he seems to move about neatly and effectively. What am I seeing there? Rosen OTOH seems to have very nice footwork. Been waiting for the next installments of QB Film Room, assume you're tied up with the main job. There is a lot going on at the end of the football year for me. During the season I'm on the advance scouting side so I am week to week I do personnel stuff at the end of the season And do player reports but I have other stuff to finish. I will get Darnold and Rosen up ASAP, next few days As for Rosen, he has beautiful picture perfect technique. His upper body is crisp and fluid and he has the feet of a ballerina. Perfect balance , setup and release almost every time Baker does not have bad footwork by any means... though not as good as Rosen... he just has a bit wider of a base which makes it look somewhat off it doesn't seem to hinder him that much as he is pretty fluid moving in the pocket. He can work on his base though 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 5 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said: Mayfield please ...put your "please" aside for a moment.....do you SERIOUSLY see McBeane expending draft capital to move up to where the perceived range of where Mayfield may go?....OR.......OR ....is Mayfield the 2017 version of Brady Quinn stuck in the Green Room long after his high forecasts and falls to McBeane at 21/22 (sorry, had to ask....LOL)?............maybe the new "Aaron Rodgers slip"...... 8 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said: There is a lot going on at the end of the football year for me. During the season I'm on the advance scouting side so I am week to week I do personnel stuff at the end of the season And do player reports but I have other stuff to finish. I will get Darnold and Rosen up ASAP, next few days As for Rosen, he has beautiful picture perfect technique. His upper body is crisp and fluid and he has the feet of a ballerina. Perfect balance , setup and release almost every time Baker does not have bad footwork by any means... though not as good as Rosen... he just has a bit wider of a base which makes it look somewhat off it doesn't seem to hinder him that much as he is pretty fluid moving in the pocket. He can work on his base though ...you know your stuff bud.....why is much being made about Rosen coming from a wealthy family and being a tennis player?........is his commitment to playing the rigorous game of NFL football coming into question and if so, is that a detrimental consideration for his draftability?............ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 3 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said: ...put your "please" aside for a moment.....do you SERIOUSLY see McBeane expending draft capital to move up to where the perceived range of where Mayfield may go?....OR.......OR ....is Mayfield the 2017 version of Brady Quinn stuck in the Green Room long after his high forecasts and falls to McBeane at 21/22 (sorry, had to ask....LOL)?............maybe the new "Aaron Rodgers slip"...... ...you know your stuff bud.....why is much being made about Rosen coming from a wealthy family and being a tennis player?........is his commitment to playing the rigorous game of NFL football coming into question and if so, is that a detrimental consideration for his draftability?............ Scouts and executives pick apart everything, especially this time of year. Of course Rosen has flaws, but he doesn't do anything really bad... so even his flaws are better than other peoples game so people try to break down his character , work ethic and love of the game etc... People say he comes off as a know it all, a little punkish... Maybe it's because he's worked his ass off and expects to be the best? Maybe he damands greatness out of himself and gets pissed when he comes up short Either way , he was the first true Freshmen to EVER START opening day for UCLA... and they have been around forever Hes extremely talented and he realizes it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 Just now, OldTimeAFLGuy said: ...put your "please" aside for a moment.....do you SERIOUSLY see McBeane expending draft capital to move up to where the perceived range of where Mayfield may go?....OR.......OR ....is Mayfield the 2017 version of Brady Quinn stuck in the Green Room long after his high forecasts and falls to McBeane at 21/22 (sorry, had to ask....LOL)?............maybe the new "Aaron Rodgers slip"...... All I can say is, if there's a QB the Bills evaluate carefully and have slotted in near that position, I hope Beane is willing to "expend the draft capital". As for Mayfield, it's hard for me to tell. Trubisky and Mahomes went 1 and 10 overall last year, despite being relatively short at 6'2". In general, though, GMs still appear to still have a strong preference for QB who "look the way you expect your QB to look" eg built like Big Ben Roethlisberger 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transplantbillsfan Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 23 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said: ...put your "please" aside for a moment.....do you SERIOUSLY see McBeane expending draft capital to move up to where the perceived range of where Mayfield may go?....OR.......OR ....is Mayfield the 2017 version of Brady Quinn stuck in the Green Room long after his high forecasts and falls to McBeane at 21/22 (sorry, had to ask....LOL)?............maybe the new "Aaron Rodgers Sooo... are you saying Mayfield might be exactly the guy McBeane is targeting and that they've somehow got it figured out that he's going to fall to them at 21? I don't know anything except for the fact that if we stay put at 21 expecting to draft our future Franchise QB in an apparently extremely top heavy QB class, we almost certainly aren't getting our #1 choice and maybe not even #2 or #3. Leftovers can be delicious. But they're still leftovers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 17 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said: Scouts and executives pick apart everything, especially this time of year. Of course Rosen has flaws, but he doesn't do anything really bad... so even his flaws are better than other peoples game so people try to break down his character , work ethic and love of the game etc... People say he comes off as a know it all, a little punkish... Maybe it's because he's worked his ass off and expects to be the best? Maybe he damands greatness out of himself and gets pissed when he comes up short Either way , he was the first true Freshmen to EVER START opening day for UCLA... and they have been around forever Hes extremely talented and he realizes it ...welcome to "paralysis by analysis".....logically and realistically, they ALL have flaws.......without flaws both physically and mentally, a BUST would NEVER happen, right?....and as the draft will FOREVER remain an INEXACT science, you base your pick on exhaustive due diligence which conceivably fails in the end.....roll 'em................ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billspro Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 5 hours ago, Bocephuz said: I watched 3 games each of the top 6 prospects. See chart below for my rankings. My scoring system is weighted... for example... decision making has a weighting of 3x... under center experience has a 1.5x weighting My 3 general takeaways are this - Mayfield and Rosen are on their own elite level - Darnold is not worth a top 10 pick - Rudolph could be a serviceable starter.. not a high ceiling.. but could be Tannehill Flame away:) Click on the image below to bring up the chart in viewable size. Can you do an assessment on Mike White? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 3 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said: ...welcome to "paralysis by analysis".....logically and realistically, they ALL have flaws.......without flaws both physically and mentally, a BUST would NEVER happen, right?....and as the draft will FOREVER remain an INEXACT science, you base your pick on exhaustive due diligence which conceivably fails in the end.....roll 'em................ Sometimes a kids career is set in stone before he even plays... its all about circumstances and being in the right place. A kids career may shine bright in one place... but because of scheme / coaching/ atmosphere or all 3 he might not make it if drafted by another franchise Josh Rosen was 17 and telling Trent Dilfer what was wrong with his playbook... you can take that a few ways but at the end of the day Dilfer even knew the kid was special Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 5 hours ago, Bocephuz said: I watched 3 games each of the top 6 prospects. See chart below for my rankings. My scoring system is weighted... for example... decision making has a weighting of 3x... under center experience has a 1.5x weighting My 3 general takeaways are this - Mayfield and Rosen are on their own elite level - Darnold is not worth a top 10 pick - Rudolph could be a serviceable starter.. not a high ceiling.. but could be Tannehill Flame away:) Click on the image below to bring up the chart in viewable size. Great work. You are illuminating! There are a few participants on this board who thrive during the draft period. You are in that lofty group. I made a point of watching Mayfield as much as possible this season. I saw him in at least three to four games. What I can say about him, even against some very good teams, is that he was always the most dynamic and compelling player on the field. There wasn't I game that I watched where that wasn't the case. Rosen in some ways reminds me of Marino in that he throws a beautiful ball and can make all the pro throws. But for me the most enthralling player in this draft is Mayfield. I covet him! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badanswer Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 (edited) 52 minutes ago, JohnC said: Great work. You are illuminating! There are a few participants on this board who thrive during the draft period. You are in that lofty group. I made a point of watching Mayfield as much as possible this season. I saw him in at least three to four games. What I can say about him, even against some very good teams, is that he was always the most dynamic and compelling player on the field. There wasn't I game that I watched where that wasn't the case. Rosen in some ways reminds me of Marino in that he throws a beautiful ball and can make all the pro throws. But for me the most enthralling player in this draft is Mayfield. I covet him! I thought the same thing about Tim Tebow when watching Florida play, but we all see how his future went...so how will Baker do at the NFL level?...that is the question I guess Nice work Bo...ty for your time and effort Edited February 17, 2018 by Badanswer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 52 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said: Sometimes a kids career is set in stone before he even plays... its all about circumstances and being in the right place. A kids career may shine bright in one place... but because of scheme / coaching/ atmosphere or all 3 he might not make it if drafted by another franchise Josh Rosen was 17 and telling Trent Dilfer what was wrong with his playbook... you can take that a few ways but at the end of the day Dilfer even knew the kid was special ...interesting and something I did not know.....Dilfer?.....at first glance, I solely considered his playing career (meh)...in his defense, he has become a better analyst than his playing days....although it won't happen, I'd love to see an in depth analysis of all QB prospects done by Romo, who is a definite rising star and knows his stuff...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 2 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said: ...interesting and something I did not know.....Dilfer?.....at first glance, I solely considered his playing career (meh)...in his defense, he has become a better analyst than his playing days....although it won't happen, I'd love to see an in depth analysis of all QB prospects done by Romo, who is a definite rising star and knows his stuff...... Yea it was at his elite 11 camp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 7 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said: Yea it was at his elite 11 camp ...so now get your azz in gear, use those magical scouting connections and get us "Tony's Take"....I'll be waiting..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 6 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said: ...so now get your azz in gear, use those magical scouting connections and get us "Tony's Take"....I'll be waiting..... Hahah Romo is definitely very good at his new job and seems like a natural He is so in tune with the little subtleties he knows what every check at the line of scrimmage is... i do like listening to him I bet defensive coordinators would love to listen to him as well during the game lol get me a feed of tony! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kemp2Warlick Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 SiriusXM NFL RadioVerified account @SiriusXMNFL 4m4 minutes ago More WSU HC Mike Leach on Sam Darnold & Josh Rosen: "I thought they both should have stayed. I think that Rosen measures out better in some areas, the ball he throws is real pretty, but to me it seems like Darnold elevates his team & I think those guys play around him a little better" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mat68 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 3 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Ha ha! I would say that about Flacco. Seriously, Flacco has had great play on the D side of the ball at times, and he has that SB win but otherwise in terms of actual recent QB results Tannehill > Flacco. After a few solid years starting in 2013, it's like every other year Flacco throws almost as many INTs as TDs. Tannehill is at least as good as Dalton, and without the benefit of throwing to AJ Green. The only knock I can give you on Tannehill is he threw too many picks his first 2 years but he seems to have got to grips with that, so unless he starts doing a Flacco, we could win with that. Smith is sort of his own outlier class as a QB since he took like, 5 years in the league to start playing decently and longer to become good. So do you call him what he was last year (quite good), or what he was previously in KC (servicable) or what he was his first 5 years (bust)? I shouldn't answer for Bocephuz but IMO arm strength may reflect different things - Allen clearly has a howitzer but he doesn't seem to have touch on his short and intermediate throws. Mayfield doesn't have a howitzer, just a good hunting rifle, but he seems able to dial it in. Perhaps that is part of what Bocephuz is seeing? Rating Allen and Mayfield 5 for arm strength would be same as rating them both 5 in accuracy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said: Hahah Romo is definitely very good at his new job and seems like a natural He is so in tune with the little subtleties he knows what every check at the line of scrimmage is... i do like listening to him I bet defensive coordinators would love to listen to him as well during the game lol get me a feed of tony! After his first couple games he seemed to tone it down a bit, and I wondered if that was way - "Tony, back off, the DCs are piping you into their headsets!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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