Lfod Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 (edited) I think the end of the Chiefs game told me all I needed to know. You posses the ball and with a few minutes remaining in the game you are holding on to a slipping lead. At that point you are in control. You can grind clock to leave no time if your forced to punt or you can secure a victory if your aggressive and score a touchdown. Instead it was decided to just be conservative and get stuffed on 3 runs only taking 12 seconds off the clock. You could of at least attempted to be serious and take shots to move the chains with a QB known for not turning the ball over. You gave the Chiefs a chance to come back and win the game. That's all it took for me. It's not just a certain player but a lack of balls in a philosophy. You wanna be playoff caliber you don't just play to win. You play to dominate and embarrass the opposition. You don't make it to the big show just meeting expectations. It's hard to look mean and serious when you tuck tail and run or curl up in a ball and just take hits. Edited December 1, 2017 by Lfod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bills757 Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 5 minutes ago, Lfod said: I think the end of the Chiefs game told me all I needed to know. You posses the ball and with a few minutes remaining in the game you are holding on to a slipping lead. At that point you are in control. You can grind clock to leave no time if your forced to punt or you can secure a victory if your aggressive and score a touchdown. Instead it was decided to just be conservative and get stuffed on 3 runs only taking 12 seconds off the clock. You could of at least attempted to be serious and take shots to move the chains with a QB known for not turning the ball over. You gave the Chiefs a chance to come back and win the game. That's all it took for me. I agree. The play calling was as if there was only 40 seconds on the clock. It was beyond ridiculous....not one play action short pass to maybe catch the Chiefs off-guard? One first down would've been huge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Arnold Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 23 minutes ago, ScottLaw said: You don't need a dominate defense. With a solid defense you can easily win with Tyrod. A really good defense are your a Super Bowl contender. I've said it a few times. You put Tyrod on that 2014 team and they are AT LEAST playing in the divisional playoff game, IMO. No. Not with Marrone's and Hackett's scheme. You really think Tyrod is much if any better than Kyle Orton in a system like that? I do not. Greg Roman's system? Sure. 18 minutes ago, Lfod said: I think the end of the Chiefs game told me all I needed to know. You posses the ball and with a few minutes remaining in the game you are holding on to a slipping lead. At that point you are in control. You can grind clock to leave no time if your forced to punt or you can secure a victory if your aggressive and score a touchdown. Instead it was decided to just be conservative and get stuffed on 3 runs only taking 12 seconds off the clock. You could of at least attempted to be serious and take shots to move the chains with a QB known for not turning the ball over. You gave the Chiefs a chance to come back and win the game. That's all it took for me. It's not just a certain player but a lack of balls in a philosophy. You wanna be playoff caliber you don't just play to win. You play to dominate and embarrass the opposition. You don't make it to the big show just meeting expectations. It's hard to look mean and serious when you tuck tail and run or curl up in a ball and just take hits. 11 minutes ago, Bills757 said: I agree. The play calling was as if there was only 40 seconds on the clock. It was beyond ridiculous....not one play action short pass to maybe catch the Chiefs off-guard? One first down would've been huge. I don't blame McDermott for not trusting Dennison to make the right play play call. And in the end he was right - they won. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lfod Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 2 minutes ago, ScottLaw said: It was god awful. But hey, they won. 4 minutes ago, Bills757 said: I agree. The play calling was as if there was only 40 seconds on the clock. It was beyond ridiculous....not one play action short pass to maybe catch the Chiefs off-guard? One first down would've been huge. I try to stay positive about the team with an understanding that this team is going through several changes. Out of everything that happened this year that was the only situation that left me disgusted. I might just be reading to much into it but that was the only thing that actually made me lose some hope for the next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bills757 Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 4 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said: No. Not with Marrone's and Hackett's scheme. You really think Tyrod is much if any better than Kyle Orton in a system like that? I do not. Greg Roman's system? Sure. I don't blame McDermott for not trusting Dennison to make the right play play call. And in the end he was right - they won. Can't argue that; however, when the offense has a chance to actually seal a game with a first down, IMO, you try to do just that. There's a difference in doing what the Bills did versus the offense actually putting the game away and I think it has an effect on the next game and future games. By putting the game away you give the offense confidence which is important and sometimes underrated by some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Arnold Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 1 minute ago, Bills757 said: Can't argue that; however, when the offense has a chance to actually seal a game with a first down, IMO, you try to do just that. There's a difference in doing what the Bills did versus the offense actually putting the game away and I think it has an effect on the next game and future games. By putting the game away you give the offense confidence which is important and sometimes underrated by some. I don't disagree, in theory. But you also have to consider - the offense stinks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bills757 Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said: I don't disagree, in theory. But you also have to consider - the offense stinks. When you run it up the gut, yes, I would agree. If Dennison would actually call games to the strength of his unit, I think the results can be better. Throwing 5 passes in the second half was not the right approach. I think it's interesting how McD and Dennison were all-in on Peterman playing against the Chargers to see if he could "jump start" the offense....and they were obviously willing to turn the ball over evidenced by actually letting him throw 5 picks in one half. Then, all of a sudden, against the Chiefs, it's back to ultra conservative? Why is that? Why not open it up, get Taylor running the ball more...encourage more high-risk plays. It's classic Jekyll and Hyde. Part of me thinks McD and Beane simply don't want Taylor to have success....they'd rather just bide their time and release him. Edited December 1, 2017 by Bills757 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 Give us a game where the offense doesn’t have to rely on a defense to make the last play a kneel down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lfod Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said: I don't disagree, in theory. But you also have to consider - the offense stinks. My point wasn't about winning or losing as much as stradegy. Tyrod may not be a lot of things but from most accounts he doesn't turn the ball over. Would taking shots to secure the game be any less risky than punting it back to your opponent with plenty of time to operate? Chances are the passes would of been incomplete but that really wasn't my point either. If your stradegy is a good one I imagine you would rather put the game away sooner then later. We basically just said screw it punt it away because we are to timid. We won the game but if it had ended in a loss that would of been a strong talking point. If this is the stradegy moving forward I just have a strong feeling it's going to cost us wins in the future. Edited December 1, 2017 by Lfod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTBill Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 In my not football educated opinion... The problem is not the OC, the QB, or the skill players (other than keeping WR healthy)... it starts with the O-Line. A solid O-Line would improve a lot. TT can win in this league playing efficient error free... trouble is, the O-Line can't provide enough protection - or deal with good D lines... It all starts up front. If you have a crap o-line, it doesn't matter who your QB or OC is. We get some pieces of it (Incognito, Dawkins) - but not all of it (Ducasse/Mills)... Until we get much better on the line, we're not going anywhere - unless the D is getting insane turnovers, as they did earlier this year. Just my .02 as someone who does not get to see the games very often, but see the constant pressure/sacks whenever I do. With a better O-Line, you could get a different OC/QB who might well to much better than the current combination, but I think we would be just fine right now if we could get solid/consistent play on the line. #love dawkins... We need to get the right side upgraded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 2 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said: Wood signed an extension a few months ago....you think they move him to maybe right guard next year? That's where he played his rookie year I believe. I was thinking Groy at RG but t works either way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bills757 Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 (edited) 32 minutes ago, MTBill said: In my not football educated opinion... The problem is not the OC, the QB, or the skill players (other than keeping WR healthy)... it starts with the O-Line. A solid O-Line would improve a lot. TT can win in this league playing efficient error free... trouble is, the O-Line can't provide enough protection - or deal with good D lines... It all starts up front. If you have a crap o-line, it doesn't matter who your QB or OC is. We get some pieces of it (Incognito, Dawkins) - but not all of it (Ducasse/Mills)... Until we get much better on the line, we're not going anywhere - unless the D is getting insane turnovers, as they did earlier this year. Just my .02 as someone who does not get to see the games very often, but see the constant pressure/sacks whenever I do. With a better O-Line, you could get a different OC/QB who might well to much better than the current combination, but I think we would be just fine right now if we could get solid/consistent play on the line. #love dawkins... We need to get the right side upgraded. Agree with your first comment 100%. The Oline is the most important unit on the offense. It allows the skill players to do their jobs. But you know how people think on this board.....they think a "franchise QB" can overcome a bad Oline.....THE guy can somehow make throws from his back and lead the Bills to the SB. That's why I chuckled at the suggestion the Bills take Eli Manning and how that would somehow be a major upgrade. Edited December 1, 2017 by Bills757 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 (edited) 3 hours ago, Lfod said: My point wasn't about winning or losing as much as stradegy. Tyrod may not be a lot of things but from most accounts he doesn't turn the ball over. Would taking shots to secure the game be any less risky than punting it back to your opponent with plenty of time to operate? Chances are the passes would of been incomplete but that really wasn't my point either. If your stradegy is a good one I imagine you would rather put the game away sooner then later. We basically just said screw it punt it away because we are to timid. We won the game but if it had ended in a loss that would of been a strong talking point. If this is the stradegy moving forward I just have a strong feeling it's going to cost us wins in the future. Why do you assume this? Hotrod completed 66% of his passes in that game. Looked to me like he was on. I wanted them to let him throw a few short passes for a first down or 2 but coach obviously had other ideas. Edited December 1, 2017 by reddogblitz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lfod Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 1 hour ago, reddogblitz said: Why do you assume this? Hotrod completed 66% of his passes in that game. Looked to me like he was on. I wanted them to let him throw a few short passes for a first down or 2 but coach obviously had other ideas. I honestly don't assume it. It's just something I said so it wasn't used as a counter point to the one I was attempting to make. Obviously in that situation I let Tyrod fire some shots if I was in charge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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