Deranged Rhino Posted November 21, 2019 Share Posted November 21, 2019 Can't stop it now. 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 It's only just begun... 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 1 hour ago, Deranged Rhino said: Gee, I wonder why they quietly reauthorized FISA under the cover of the impeachment circus... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 Just now, DC Tom said: Gee, I wonder why they quietly reauthorized FISA under the cover of the impeachment circus... They kicked it to March. It's still active between now and then though. I suspect there will be a much bigger debate in March about it than we'd (as a country) be able to have before this report hits. At least, that's my hope. 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 + more to the thread WaPo is spinning. Everyone is spinning... Expect more spinning from all sides the closer we get to the 9th. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Gal Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 This reminder clip is making the rounds today. (it is from a hearing a while back) 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 36 minutes ago, Buffalo_Gal said: This reminder clip is making the rounds today. (it is from a hearing a while back) This isn't directed at anyone here, just me thinking out loud: I know more than a few people think this is what it's going to end up being about -- I'm less than 20% on that (based on my own work, not saying I know one way or the other for sure). A lot of people are attached to RR being either good or bad, and are building their expectations on this issue around that. As we discussed many times down here, I'm personally more confused than ever about what role RR was playing -- if any -- on the counter-intel side of the coin. I went back and forth, many times, and eventually gave up trying to decipher that particular piece of the puzzle because it required too much guessing -- and once you get locked in on a position with him, it colors the whole way you look at the rest of the situation. Because he did some shady stuff... and some seemingly above the board/honest/ethical stuff throughout the whole ordeal. The danger of this whole thing from the beginning is that the spook world is NOT the same as the political world or traditional law enforcement world. There's even less black and white with spy v spy stuff than there is in the murky worlds of law enforcement or Congress, and many more shades of gray. Worse, only a fraction of the spook world activities ever really get brought to the light of day in terms of legal consequences/indictments/public disclosure -- so there will be large chunks of this story that our generation(s) will likely be unable to confirm. That will be done by future historians, 20-30-50 years down the line when more records get unsealed. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Gal Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 Just now, Deranged Rhino said: This isn't directed at anyone here, just me thinking out loud: I know more than a few people think this is what it's going to end up being about -- I'm less than 20% on that (based on my own work, not saying I know one way or the other for sure). A lot of people are attached to RR being either good or bad, and are building their expectations on this issue around that. As we discussed many times down here, I'm personally more confused than ever about what role RR was playing -- if any -- on the counter-intel side of the coin. I went back and forth, many times, and eventually gave up trying to decipher that particular piece of the puzzle because it required too much guessing -- and once you get locked in on a position with him, it colors the whole way you look at the rest of the situation. Because he did some shady stuff... and some seemingly above the board/honest/ethical stuff throughout the whole ordeal. The danger of this whole thing from the beginning is that the spook world is NOT the same as the political world or traditional law enforcement world. There's even less black and white with spy v spy stuff than there is in the murky worlds of law enforcement or Congress, and many more shades of gray. Worse, only a fraction of the spook world activities ever really get brought to the light of day in terms of legal consequences/indictments/public disclosure -- so there will be large chunks of this story that our generation(s) will likely be unable to confirm. That will be done by future historians, 20-30-50 years down the line when more records get unsealed. I am one that thinks RR is a weasel who cannot be trusted. A few things give me pause and makes me reexamine that thinking ... this testimony being one. And then, I have questions - Did he flip when he figured it was all gonna get pinned on him? Was he always aghast at what was happening? As you say, everything is not black and white, and RR may very well be a shade of grey. He also received a massive farewell ceremony/retirement party attended by people like Barr, Sessions, Kellyanne Conway, etc. That was interesting, to say the least. I won't be alive in 40 or 50 years (20 is possible) to see what the rest of the unsealed records reveal, but I am sure they will tell some story. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 He's been lying to your face for three years... why do people on this board who hate Trump (which is their right, and not an issue) give a proven liar and manipulator the benefit of the doubt? Just because he's not Trump? Doesn't that strike you as a tad simplistic? 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section122 Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 1 hour ago, Deranged Rhino said: He's been lying to your face for three years... why do people on this board who hate Trump (which is their right, and not an issue) give a proven liar and manipulator the benefit of the doubt? Just because he's not Trump? Doesn't that strike you as a tad simplistic? I'm not your target here as I don't hate Trump. I'm not a fan of the way he represents the country but hate is not at all a word I would use for my feelings. I will take a crack as I think the answer is very simple. It lines up with their beliefs. Same reason everyone here is quick to believe Trump and everything the right pumps out. Trump is a proven liar and manipulator. However he gets the benefit of the doubt all the time on this board. People want to believe what fits their narrative. It is really that simple. Confirmation bias runs rampant on both sides. You think Trump was brought in as some outsider to bring down the cabal that really runs this country. I think Trump who was born rich and profits greatly from his position as the president is more of the same. In 5 years a Dem will get elected and this board will go crazy about how evil the new president is, and 8 years later a repub will go in and on and on and on and on. Before people ask for proven liar proof: https://www.politifact.com/personalities/donald-trump/statements/byruling/false/ or if you prefer the ap: https://apnews.com/f3073b1291e94d3289c9404c5936db3e 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 36 minutes ago, section122 said: I'm not your target here as I don't hate Trump. I'm not a fan of the way he represents the country but hate is not at all a word I would use for my feelings. I will take a crack as I think the answer is very simple. It lines up with their beliefs. Same reason everyone here is quick to believe Trump and everything the right pumps out. Trump is a proven liar and manipulator. However he gets the benefit of the doubt all the time on this board. People want to believe what fits their narrative. It is really that simple. Confirmation bias runs rampant on both sides. You think Trump was brought in as some outsider to bring down the cabal that really runs this country. I think Trump who was born rich and profits greatly from his position as the president is more of the same. In 5 years a Dem will get elected and this board will go crazy about how evil the new president is, and 8 years later a repub will go in and on and on and on and on. Before people ask for proven liar proof: https://www.politifact.com/personalities/donald-trump/statements/byruling/false/ or if you prefer the ap: https://apnews.com/f3073b1291e94d3289c9404c5936db3e If you participated here for a bit of time, you'd know that about half the people who you probably think are in lock step with Trump were/are his biggest critics on this forum (when it's truly deserved). The difference of course is that it gives us a perspective to also see through the blatant hit jobs that he's taken. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 Just now, GG said: If you participated here for a bit of time, you'd know that about half the people who you probably think are in lock step with Trump were/are his biggest critics on this forum (when it's truly deserved). The difference of course is that it gives us a perspective to also see through the blatant hit jobs that he's taken. how do you keep on this surfboard of sensibleness? ----------------------- i'm not taking the command of "what is truth" from the media or the DNC.... truth...... HAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 58 minutes ago, section122 said: I'm not your target here as I don't hate Trump. I'm not a fan of the way he represents the country but hate is not at all a word I would use for my feelings. I will take a crack as I think the answer is very simple. It lines up with their beliefs. Same reason everyone here is quick to believe Trump and everything the right pumps out. Trump is a proven liar and manipulator. However he gets the benefit of the doubt all the time on this board. People want to believe what fits their narrative. It is really that simple. Confirmation bias runs rampant on both sides. You think Trump was brought in as some outsider to bring down the cabal that really runs this country. I think Trump who was born rich and profits greatly from his position as the president is more of the same. In 5 years a Dem will get elected and this board will go crazy about how evil the new president is, and 8 years later a repub will go in and on and on and on and on. Before people ask for proven liar proof: https://www.politifact.com/personalities/donald-trump/statements/byruling/false/ or if you prefer the ap: https://apnews.com/f3073b1291e94d3289c9404c5936db3e GG answered well -- I was also writing up a longer response in the Boomerang thread which covers a lot of this. ************************** 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 10 minutes ago, Deranged Rhino said: GG answered well -- I was also writing up a longer response in the Boomerang thread which covers a lot of this. I get very tired of being told I'm a Trump supporter when I've disliked the charlatan longer than the people calling me a Trump supporter have even been alive. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 Just now, DC Tom said: I get very tired of being told I'm a Trump supporter when I've disliked the charlatan longer than the people calling me a Trump supporter have even been alive. It's why about a year + ago I just stopped, for the most part, arguing the point that I wasn't a Trump voter, and was, in fact, a Hollywood liberal I just leaned in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 Just now, Deranged Rhino said: It's why about a year + ago I just stopped, for the most part, arguing the point that I wasn't a Trump voter, and was, in fact, a Hollywood liberal I just leaned in. You're not a Hollywood liberal. You WERE a Hollywood liberal, but you got sane, and now you're just a liberal. Really, I remember when you were a Hollywood liberal. Your turn-around has been...interesting. Sometimes hilarious. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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