Doc Posted July 24, 2016 Share Posted July 24, 2016 It was more hypothetical, seeing as we can't retroactively take money back from Clay. I was trying to demonstrate the ripple effect of how overpaying for one position leaves you unable to easily get a deal done for another down the line. Gilmore is just as good of a CB as Clay is a TE, IMO, Pro-Bowl notwithstanding, with an upward trajectory on his career. The Bills currently have $21.2M in cap space for 2017 and will be able to rollover another $11.8M from this year, assuming nothing else changes. So they'll have more than enough money to sign TT and Gilmore, as well as others. But I seriously doubt they want to give Gilmore $15M/year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted July 24, 2016 Share Posted July 24, 2016 The Bills currently have $21.2M in cap space for 2017 and will be able to rollover another $11.8M from this year, assuming nothing else changes. So they'll have more than enough money to sign TT and Gilmore, as well as others. But I seriously doubt they want to give Gilmore $15M/year. I doubt they wanted to give Clay what he got, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted July 24, 2016 Share Posted July 24, 2016 I doubt they wanted to give Clay what he got, too. They did it though, didn't they? And Gilmore wants more than double what Clay got. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted July 24, 2016 Share Posted July 24, 2016 (edited) They did it though, didn't they? And Gilmore wants more than double what Clay got. Yep. Just as they might give Gilly $15M. Edited July 24, 2016 by FireChan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted July 24, 2016 Share Posted July 24, 2016 Yep. Just as they might give Gilly $15M. So far, reports are that they won't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted July 24, 2016 Share Posted July 24, 2016 So far, reports are that they won't. Probably because they don't have the big bucks to throw around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted July 24, 2016 Share Posted July 24, 2016 Probably because they don't have the big bucks to throw around. Again they have $11.8M in cap room right now. If they offered him Norman's deal, his cap hit for this year would be $8M, leaving them with a good $3.8M in room still. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted July 24, 2016 Share Posted July 24, 2016 Again they have $11.8M in cap room right now. If they offered him Norman's deal, his cap hit for this year would be $8M, leaving them with a good $3.8M in room still. You do realize contracts decisions aren't made in a vacuum, yes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted July 24, 2016 Share Posted July 24, 2016 You do realize contracts decisions aren't made in a vacuum, yes? Yes. Do you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted July 24, 2016 Share Posted July 24, 2016 (edited) Yes. Do you? Well then us having $3.8M this year isn't the only consideration that matters, is it? Pursuing other FAs in the future, re-signing other key players, etc etc etc all come into consideration. Bottom line, without Clay's $6M, $9M and $9M cap hit over the next 3 years, the Bills would have more room to maneuver and may be more inclined to budge on an extra $2M with Gilmore. I thought this was a pretty obvious point, not warranting a page of back and forth. But, live and learn I suppose. Edited July 24, 2016 by FireChan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted July 24, 2016 Share Posted July 24, 2016 Well then us having $3.8M this year isn't the only consideration that matters, is it? Pursuing other FAs in the future, re-signing other key players, etc etc etc all come into consideration. Bottom line, without Clay's $6M, $9M and $9M cap hit over the next 3 years, the Bills would have more room to maneuver and may be more inclined to budge on an extra $2M with Gilmore. I thought this was a pretty obvious point, not warranting a page of back and forth. But, live and learn I suppose. I just proved to you that the Bills could give Gilmore Josh Norman's deal (I'm assuming that's what he's shooting for, but it's possible he'd take less, which only strengthens my argument) right now and still have a decent amount of money left over for this season. Therefore Clay's contract isn't hindering anything this year, or next year, as I also showed you. It's abundantly apparent that they do not want to give him $15M/year. And we don't even know what they are offering him. They could be offering $11M/year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted July 24, 2016 Share Posted July 24, 2016 (edited) I just proved to you that the Bills could give Gilmore Josh Norman's deal (I'm assuming that's what he's shooting for, but it's possible he'd take less, which only strengthens my argument) right now and still have a decent amount of money left over for this season. Therefore Clay's contract isn't hindering anything this year, or next year, as I also showed you. It's abundantly apparent that they do not want to give him $15M/year. And we don't even know what they are offering him. They could be offering $11M/year. This is subjective. Decent for what? Decent for re-signing Bob Woods and TT and sitting out in FA? Cool beans Doc. Remember when I talked about vacuums? Edited July 24, 2016 by FireChan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MYSHIFTKEYISBROKE Posted July 24, 2016 Share Posted July 24, 2016 Massive downgrade, Lamar Miller to this. Sky blue, water wet, Arian Foster injured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted July 24, 2016 Share Posted July 24, 2016 Massive downgrade, Lamar Miller to this. Sky blue, water wet, Arian Foster injured. It just seems typical Dolphins at this point. But i don't doubt he could help Tannehill. One would hope his exp will be enough. Be very interesting to see how is used. Maybe he is a locker room leader and player coach for the kids ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted July 24, 2016 Share Posted July 24, 2016 This is subjective. Decent for what? Decent for re-signing Bob Woods and TT and sitting out in FA? Cool beans Doc. Remember when I talked about vacuums? Just a correction, if the Bills extend Gilmore, they'll actually have $6.6M in cap room this year since his current cap number of $11M would reduce to $8M. As for sitting out FA, FA is over this year. As for TT, they probably won't be touching his deal until next off-season. And finally as for Woods, given the choice between he and Clay, I'm taking Clay, especially since Woods will probably get what the Bills gave Clay. And they might be able to extend him this year if they want, even if they extend Gilmore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted July 24, 2016 Share Posted July 24, 2016 Yes, the Bills should always decline to sign top FAs at critical positions of need NOW because of what a player's demands MIGHT be a year and a half later even though there is no threat to the salary cap, regardless. If Gilmore is intractable on getting north of $15m per and $50m guaranteed, screw him. We can sign TT to market rate (assuming he merits it with a solid year), and tag Gilmore in 2017 if we have to. And have comfortable space under the expected cap in '17. I think Gilmore and his people understand that, too. Which is why I think he'll re-sign with us sooner than later. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted July 24, 2016 Share Posted July 24, 2016 Just a correction, if the Bills extend Gilmore, they'll actually have $6.6M in cap room this year since his current cap number of $11M would reduce to $8M. As for sitting out FA, FA is over this year. As for TT, they probably won't be touching his deal until next off-season. And finally as for Woods, given the choice between he and Clay, I'm taking Clay, especially since Woods will probably get what the Bills gave Clay. And they might be able to extend him this year if they want, even if they extend Gilmore. You're being obtuse on purpose now. Yes, the Bills should always decline to sign top FAs at critical positions of need NOW because of what a player's demands MIGHT be a year and a half later even though there is no threat to the salary cap, regardless. If Gilmore is intractable on getting north of $15m per and $50m guaranteed, screw him. We can sign TT to market rate (assuming he merits it with a solid year), and tag Gilmore in 2017 if we have to. And have comfortable space under the expected cap in '17. I think Gilmore and his people understand that, too. Which is why I think he'll re-sign with us sooner than later. GO BILLS!!! "Should always?" Nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MYSHIFTKEYISBROKE Posted July 24, 2016 Share Posted July 24, 2016 It just seems typical Dolphins at this point. But i don't doubt he could help Tannehill. One would hope his exp will be enough. Be very interesting to see how is used. Maybe he is a locker room leader and player coach for the kids ? No running back can help Tannehill. My favorite two days of the year, the games against him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted July 24, 2016 Share Posted July 24, 2016 You're being obtuse on purpose now. Just countering your obtuse statements, bud. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted July 24, 2016 Share Posted July 24, 2016 No running back can help Tannehill. My favorite two days of the year, the games against him. A Pick Fest Against Geno can be quite a treat as well! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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