H2o Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Mack is destined to be an All Pro, but I think Watkins is as well. We needed offense, we made the right choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Good idea. I just added that option to the poll. When are you gonna explain the 2 win theory ? My calculations show 2 more losses ? Am I multiplying my minus signs improperly ? Justify that please, because I can far more reasonably say that we'd have 3 fewer wins with Mack than Sammy. Sammy made crucial plays against Miami, Minnesota, and Detroit that delivered wins. Please show me how substituting Mack would've meant (a) also winning those games, and (b) winning two others among: SD Houston NE KC Miami Denver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bananathumb Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 No WR or LB is worth giving up a first round pick by just moving up a few spaces. Insanity and I highly doubt it was Whaley's doing. Something Brandon might push or hackett. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
negativo Posted December 19, 2014 Author Share Posted December 19, 2014 (edited) If Mack were in red, white and blue instead of silver and black the votes would be flipped. Sammy MAY develop into a star someday, or he MAY go the path of CJ Spiller. At this point the jury is still out. He's had strong moments where you think he's special, but he's also been tentative going over the middle, taken plays off, been a bit injury prone and got burned showboating. We'll see what next year brings and then evaluate. As of now, he's tied for 4th in the NFL among ROOKIES in both receptions and yards. Nice, but not nearly good enough considering what we gave up for him. Meanwhile, Mack is there already. Now. Today. Best in the game at a position far more important and difficult to fill than WR. I know the glow of fan-hood can be blinding, but objectively speaking it's not even close which player has been the better choice. Hands down it's Mack. Edited December 19, 2014 by negativo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 If Mack were in red, white and blue instead of silver and black the votes would be flipped. Sammy MAY develop into a star someday, or he MAY go the path of CJ Spiller. At this point the jury is still out. He's had strong moments where you think he's special, but he's also been tentative going over the middle, taken plays off, been a bit injury prone and got burned showboating. We'll see what next year brings and then evaluate. As of now, he's tied for 4th in the NFL among ROOKIES in both receptions and yards. Nice, but not nearly good enough considering what we gave up for him. Meanwhile, Mack is there already. Now. Today. Best in the game at a position far more important and difficult to fill than WR. I know the glow of fan-hood can be blinding, but objectively speaking it's not even close which player has been the better choice. Hands down it's Mack. So I guess you're not going to justify this comment: Our offense is not appreciably better this year with Sammy. He's been solid, but nothing special. Stevie Johnson was putting up as good or better numbers during his run. Mack is the best 4-3 LB in the league. When we've struggled on defense it's been stopping the run. We'd have at least two more wins right now with Mack than Sammy. I'll repeat my line of logic just in case you missed it... Justify that please, because I can far more reasonably say that we'd have 3 fewer wins with Mack than Sammy. Sammy made crucial plays against Miami, Minnesota, and Detroit that delivered wins. Please show me how substituting Mack would've meant (a) also winning those games, and (b) winning two others among: SD Houston NE KC Miami Denver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whack 'Em Williams Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Tough call at draft time. these two were the only options bills were taking minus ebron if all others were gone and stuck at picking 6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 (edited) If Mack were in red, white and blue instead of silver and black the votes would be flipped. Sammy MAY develop into a star someday, or he MAY go the path of CJ Spiller. At this point the jury is still out. He's had strong moments where you think he's special, but he's also been tentative going over the middle, taken plays off, been a bit injury prone and got burned showboating. We'll see what next year brings and then evaluate. As of now, he's tied for 4th in the NFL among ROOKIES in both receptions and yards. Nice, but not nearly good enough considering what we gave up for him. Meanwhile, Mack is there already. Now. Today. Best in the game at a position far more important and difficult to fill than WR. I know the glow of fan-hood can be blinding, but objectively speaking it's not even close which player has been the better choice. Hands down it's Mack. hot take. Looking at the poll results, looks like you are in the minority but sure ... "hands down."If the Bills had traded away next year's 1st rd pick for a LB considering what they already had at that position - and did not have at the #1 WR position - it would have been a clown show. I know everything has to be black and white in the moment and hot takes on Twitter are all the rage, but "objectively speaking" most logical evaluations of the 2014 draft will be made a bit further down the road and pertain to the needs of the specific team. Edited December 19, 2014 by YoloinOhio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2o Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 No WR or LB is worth giving up a first round pick by just moving up a few spaces. Insanity and I highly doubt it was Whaley's doing. Something Brandon might push or hackett. You doubt Whaley had a hand in it? I bet Whaley had everything to do with it my friend. Anyone who doubts Whaley is in charge of any and all personnel moves as far as to whom is on this team is mistaken. Whaley has built this roster, helping Nix for a couple years before completely taking over, after the mold of the Steelers teams he was affiliated withbefore he came to Buffalo. They wanted Watkins because they felt he was the best player in the draft, a game changer, and moved up to get their man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Hands down it's Mack. This is a cool story. We need more help on defense. Especially linebacker The votes have spoken. Jmo and imo are your friends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
negativo Posted December 19, 2014 Author Share Posted December 19, 2014 *IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENTS* 1. For those who are reading impaired, and feel the need to continue reminding me "how one-sided the votes are", please note that I qualified in my comment that, "If Mack were in red, white and blue instead of silver and black the votes would be flipped." 2. For those who think I'm going to engage in a dispute that involves researching analytics to quantify statistically how many more wins I think the Bills would have with Mack vs Watkins, please note: I'm not diving into a bottomless pit of wasted time and boredom just to satisfy your life-sucking desires. Thank you, and have a great day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonborn10 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Mack wouldn't give the Bills another victory this year. Without Watkins the offense is even worse and the team would likely be no better than 6 - 8 at this point. Agree with others the best move was to trade down in this WR rich class. They could have added a guard/center in the second. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 (edited) *IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENTS* 1. For those who are reading impaired, and feel the need to continue reminding me "how one-sided the votes are", please note that I qualified in my comment that, "If Mack were in red, white and blue instead of silver and black the votes would be flipped." 2. For those who think I'm going to engage in a dispute that involves researching analytics to quantify statistically how many more wins I think the Bills would have with Mack vs Watkins, please note: I'm not diving into a bottomless pit of wasted time and boredom just to satisfy your life-sucking desires. Thank you, and have a great day. So the 2 more wins with Mack thing isn't true now ? My reading comprehension is off, can you post a picture of Mack in blue and red to see if it will change my vote ? How would Mack fare if his garb was yellow and purple ? Edited December 19, 2014 by Ryan L Billz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 *IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENTS* 1. For those who are reading impaired, and feel the need to continue reminding me "how one-sided the votes are", please note that I qualified in my comment that, "If Mack were in red, white and blue instead of silver and black the votes would be flipped." 2. For those who think I'm going to engage in a dispute that involves researching analytics to quantify statistically how many more wins I think the Bills would have with Mack vs Watkins, please note: I'm not diving into a bottomless pit of wasted time and boredom just to satisfy your life-sucking desires. Thank you, and have a great day. Then perhaps next time don't mention a totally-unfounded and unquantifiable evaluation as support for the assertion about which you opened a thread and asked for opinions. Have a great holiday season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
negativo Posted December 19, 2014 Author Share Posted December 19, 2014 (edited) Keep in mind, without Sammy we would still have Stevie. Statistics say that would be an even swap, plus a superstar OLB in Mack. I tend to agree that the price of moving up was excessive, but if we were going to do it Mack would have been the better choice...at least as of right now. If somehow Sammy explodes next year into the next Megatron while Mack gets injured, well, things could change. I can only go by what we have to work with here and now. Edited December 19, 2014 by negativo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whack 'Em Williams Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Let Mack cover sammy over the middle sunday, results will speak the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snorom Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 (edited) Our offense is not appreciably better this year with Sammy. He's been solid, but nothing special. Stevie Johnson was putting up as good or better numbers during his run. Mack is the best 4-3 LB in the league. When we've struggled on defense it's been stopping the run. We'd have at least two more wins right now with Mack than Sammy. Stevie didn't play until his 3rd year Watkins is pacing or breaking Bills rookie WR records with crap at the QB position. Actually Watckins has been special. 4 100 yard receiving games 5 TDs as a rookie while battling injury and of course our QB woes. Watkins is already in the bills record book and that is a heluva an accomplishment for a rookie WR in this league and even more so knowing what we know about the Bills OL and QB issues Edited December 19, 2014 by Snorom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Still not a big fan of the trade, but without Watkins we have zero offensive weapons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snorom Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Still not a big fan of the trade, but without Watkins we have zero offensive weapons. that is not true at all. We have Woods Hogan Chandler Jackson Spiller and Boobie DIxon has looked solid. What we don't have is a consistent accurate QB who can see the entire field Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 If we had drafted Mack, we would be 0-14 right now. And I came to that conclusion after a life-sucking analysis of every applicable metric. You're welcome. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSOL Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Khalil Mack is great, but dont forget, we thought wed have Kiko this year. We just didnt need anymore linebackers no matter how good, we needed offensive weapons. I think Whaley made the correct descision Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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