YoloinOhio Posted June 16, 2014 Author Share Posted June 16, 2014 I don't think what Kaplan suggests will be an issue will be an issue. How bad does it look for the league to oppose a privately financed stadium from a WNY native? I don't think they'll want to go there... WGR asked Kaplan for his reasoning of why he didn't think it would work this morning and then they read it on the air. He said the NFL does not wish its teams to be in a traditional tenant-landlord situation, esp if it is Jacobs. Isn't the county now technically the landlord of RWS? The stadium is run and operated by the county and the Bills are leasing it. They don't know why he mentioned that the NFL would care that it was Jacobs unless it had something to do with the gambling interests. I don't see why any of that would matter in stadium ownership. As Buftex mentioned...does the league want to be more in charge.... they won't have leverage to force the Bills to leave at some point if a private individual owns a stadium? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted June 16, 2014 Author Share Posted June 16, 2014 Now Kaplan is live on 930... he said the issue is the NFL just does not want a situation in which the team is not operating its own stadium anymore. He did not specify it has anything to do with Jacobs/DN as he had when talking to WGR. He basically said that the NFL wants a different model now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXBILLSFAN Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 (edited) Yolo, I read the same tweet and listened to same reports and I don't get it either ? --- a lot of NFL stadiums are not owned or operated by the team's owner --- sometimes the team owner owns and/or operates the stadium, but in many cases it's neither -- (edit): BTW, if Pegula buys team, I don't believe he's under any obligation to have a specific new stadium plan to get approval, nor is any owner at this stage -- so, all of his could be worked out post-sale Edited June 16, 2014 by TXBILLSFAN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pondslider Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 Yolo, I read the same tweet and listened to same reports and I don't get it either ? --- a lot of NFL stadiums are not owned or operated by the team's owner --- sometimes the team owner owns and/or operates the stadium, but in many cases it's neither -- (edit): BTW, if Pegula buys team, I don't believe he's under any obligation to have a specific new stadium plan to get approval, nor is any owner at this stage -- so, all of his could be worked out post-sale The NFL has been vocal about the Bills needing a new stadium to stay. It's possible they will require a firm stadium plan to approve any ownership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McD Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 The NFL has been vocal about the Bills needing a new stadium to stay. It's possible they will require a firm stadium plan to approve any ownership. I keep hearing this, but I wonder why they want a new stadium so badly? The Ralph is a good venue and the new renovations will keep it viable. I'd love a new state of the art stadium (as long as it doesn't hurt the game day experience, tailgating, etc), but if the NFL is that hell bent on stadiums why don't they tell the Packers and Bears to get a new stadium as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted June 16, 2014 Author Share Posted June 16, 2014 (edited) The NFL has been vocal about the Bills needing a new stadium to stay. It's possible they will require a firm stadium plan to approve any ownership. Interesting that you bring that up because with both Golisano and Pegula, when their intentions to bid were reported it was immediately coupled with or followed by stadium plans (Congel partnership for Golisano, Jacobs for Pegula). The Congel info was swatted down by Golisano afterward and not sure if Jacobs is directly tied to Pegula or if he is independent, but still notable that occurred as if maybe it has been told to the Bills and/or potential bidders that is necessary. It was reported that Jacobs/DN was in talks with at least one potential ownership group. Edited June 16, 2014 by YoloinOhio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pondslider Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 Interesting that you bring that up because with both Golisano and Pegula, when their intentions to bid were reported it was immediately coupled with or followed by stadium plans (Congel partnership for Golisano, Jacobs for Pegula). The Congel info was swatted down by Golisano afterward and not sure if Jacobs is directly tied to Pegula or if he is independent, but still notable that occurred as if maybe it has been told to the Bills and/or potential bidders that is necessary. It was reported that Jacobs/DN was in talks with at least one potential ownership group. Yeah, I mean I know about the same as everybody else right now which isn't much, but I doubt the league wants the team sold to someone and then still have to deal with stadium stuff near the end of the current lease. Not saying a new owner needs to break ground the day they take over, but I could see the NFL approval being based somewhat on what will happen with the stadium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 @hsimon62 hear why one expert believes the NFL wouldn't let Delaware North own/operate a new #Bills stadium. http://audio.wben.com/a/93209145/bills-stadium-ownership-questions-marc-ganis.htm#.U577cjmLVv0.twitter … Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple haze Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 WGR asked Kaplan for his reasoning of why he didn't think it would work this morning and then they read it on the air. He said the NFL does not wish its teams to be in a traditional tenant-landlord situation, esp if it is Jacobs. Isn't the county now technically the landlord of RWS? The stadium is run and operated by the county and the Bills are leasing it. They don't know why he mentioned that the NFL would care that it was Jacobs unless it had something to do with the gambling interests. I don't see why any of that would matter in stadium ownership. As Buftex mentioned...does the league want to be more in charge.... they won't have leverage to force the Bills to leave at some point if a private individual owns a stadium? I don't get it. Minnesota's new stadium is being paid for by tax payers. There are some owners who own their own stadiums, but I do not believe it is most or many owners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 howard @hsimon62 39m hear why one expert believes the NFL wouldn't let Delaware North own/operate a new #Bills stadium. http://audio.wben.co...witter … Hmmm...Sounds familiar: http://forums.twobillsdrive.com/topic/168444-jacobs-and-the-future-stadium/page__st__20#entry3157298 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted June 16, 2014 Author Share Posted June 16, 2014 Hmmm...Sounds familiar: http://forums.twobil...20#entry3157298 oh I see now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple haze Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 I get it now. The NFL is getting on my nerves with all of their BS "desires". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted June 16, 2014 Author Share Posted June 16, 2014 I get it now. The NFL is getting on my nerves with all of their BS "desires". Control freaks... I agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXBILLSFAN Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 NFL is getting too controlling -- I get why they'd like a stadium to be part of sale process, in my opinion it doesn't mesh with reported timeline --- I also don't see how NFL could not approve Pegula (or other local buyer) who has successful $1B+ bid even if they don't have new stadium figured out --- it would be PR disaster and worse than selling to an LA party -- can you imagine Pegula bids $1.2B, trust accepts bid and owners say we want a new stadium and a local owner --- I don't see that happening --- to me, it's up to the owner to decide what stadium he wants and at what cost and let him negotiate with local/state -- now, that owner might decide it's better to leverage a deal now, before a sale is finalized, but it shouldn't be a prerequisite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 (edited) Bob Kraft financed 100% of the construction of Gillette Stadium (325 mil), and owns the property outright. Yes... I was asking, is there a stadium that is privately owned, by someone other than the team owner? I can see the inherent advantage for Kraft to own the stadium that his team plays in...but what advantage would there be to the NFL, for, say, Terry Pegula to own the Bills, but Jacobs own the stadium they play in? The advantge to a tax-payer funded stadium, to the NFL, is obvious, they, nor any of their owners, would have to fund a new stadium. But why would the NFL want to deal with a team owner, and a private owner of an NFL stadium? NFL is getting too controlling -- I get why they'd like a stadium to be part of sale process, in my opinion it doesn't mesh with reported timeline --- I also don't see how NFL could not approve Pegula (or other local buyer) who has successful $1B+ bid even if they don't have new stadium figured out --- it would be PR disaster and worse than selling to an LA party -- can you imagine Pegula bids $1.2B, trust accepts bid and owners say we want a new stadium and a local owner --- I don't see that happening --- to me, it's up to the owner to decide what stadium he wants and at what cost and let him negotiate with local/state -- now, that owner might decide it's better to leverage a deal now, before a sale is finalized, but it shouldn't be a prerequisite I would would find it hard to fathom, whoever buys the Bills, would not want to be clear on the stadium issue, before they agreed to invest 1+ billion dollars on buing the team. We know that Goodell has said that the Bills "need" a new stadium. It is unclear to me if that means simply that they "need a new stadium that is up to the standards of modern NFL stadiums"....or does he mean they "need a new stadium, and the NFL owners will not approve a local buyer, without some promise of a new stadium being part of the deal". Edited June 16, 2014 by Buftex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXBILLSFAN Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 (edited) Yes... I was asking, is there a stadium that is privately owned, by someone other than the team owner? I can see the inherent advantage for Kraft to own the stadium that his team plays in...but what advantage would there be to the NFL, for, say, Terry Pegula to own the Bills, but Jacobs own the stadium they play in? The advantge to a tax-payer funded stadium, to the NFL, is obvious, they, nor any of their owners, would have to fund a new stadium. But why would the NFL want to deal with a team owner, and a private owner of an NFL stadium? I would would find it hard to fathom, whoever buys the Bills, would not want to be clear on the stadium issue, before they agreed to invest 1+ billion dollars on buing the team. We know that Goodell has said that the Bills "need" a new stadium. It is unclear to me if that means simply that they "need a new stadium that is up to the standards of modern NFL stadiums"....or does he mean they "need a new stadium, and the NFL owners will not approve a local buyer, without some promise of a new stadium being part of the deal". I don't -- why would Pegula, Jacobs or Golisano require assurances on the stadium up front before they bid ? I trust these guys, and I'll throw Trump in, are perfectly capable of negotiating a deal with state/local/NFL parties after the sale --- I think the requirement is nonsense for buyers with interest in keeping teams in Buffalo --- like I said, maybe those guys think they have more leverage to negotiate ahead of a bid -- but, let's face it, the bids will be due within the next few months and I don't see state/local authorities being ready to say they'll pitch in $400M -- on the NFL side, the financial support is pretty clear for new stadiums --- Edited June 16, 2014 by TXBILLSFAN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbb Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 I keep hearing this, but I wonder why they want a new stadium so badly? The Ralph is a good venue and the new renovations will keep it viable. I'd love a new state of the art stadium (as long as it doesn't hurt the game day experience, tailgating, etc), but if the NFL is that hell bent on stadiums why don't they tell the Packers and Bears to get a new stadium as well? I don't get it, either. On one hand, I'd like a new stadium, because I assume that would come with a long term ironclad lease. On the other hand, PSLs and higher ticket prices scare me. I'm fine with paying them, but I wonder how many people will be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cleveland Rocks? Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 I don't get it, either. On one hand, I'd like a new stadium, because I assume that would come with a long term ironclad lease. On the other hand, PSLs and higher ticket prices scare me. I'm fine with paying them, but I wonder how many people will be. In Cleveland, we had PSLs for the new stadium in 1999. At first, you needed to buy on in order to buy seasons. They were anywhere from 250-1500 and at that time, people were willing to do it because they were just happy to have the team back. Last year (I think) they removed that restriction and allowed fans to buy seasons without a PSL. They needed to sell more tickets, basically. I don't think it would have been an issue though if the team was better and not completely different year after year. People just didn't know if they wanted to shell out money for the Browns. The PSLs were kind of looked at as a civic duty at the time, like the cost of getting a football team. Cleveland also administered a sin tax on alcohol and cigarrettes in Cuyohoga Cty and then there were the corporate 10-year leases on luxury suites. The problem with the PSLs too is they were sold to the fans as an investment that would grow in value. After 12 losing seasons in the last 14, that is anything but true and now they have eliminated them to try to increase attendance, so a lot of the most loyal fans feel cheated. Browns attendance has gone down each year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbb Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 In Cleveland, we had PSLs for the new stadium in 1999. At first, you needed to buy on in order to buy seasons. They were anywhere from 250-1500 and at that time, people were willing to do it because they were just happy to have the team back. Last year (I think) they removed that restriction and allowed fans to buy seasons without a PSL. They needed to sell more tickets, basically. I don't think it would have been an issue though if the team was better and not completely different year after year. People just didn't know if they wanted to shell out money for the Browns. The PSLs were kind of looked at as a civic duty at the time, like the cost of getting a football team. Cleveland also administered a sin tax on alcohol and cigarrettes in Cuyohoga Cty and then there were the corporate 10-year leases on luxury suites. The problem with the PSLs too is they were sold to the fans as an investment that would grow in value. After 12 losing seasons in the last 14, that is anything but true and now they have eliminated them to try to increase attendance, so a lot of the most loyal fans feel cheated. Browns attendance has gone down each year. Yeah, it really sets things up to burn your best fans, if it goes that way. There are some teams, I think the Bears and big market clubs, where the PSLs did go up, but I bet for most teams, they will not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXBILLSFAN Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 I want a new stadium (in downtown Buffalo), don't get me wrong. What I want is the new owner who has no interest in moving the team to drive the process -- right now, it seems more like the NFL is trying to create a shotgun wedding and force the issue to be finalized as part of the sale --- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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