Comprehensive O Line FA Thread

[OCinBuffalo]

First, we have already had our existing Bills O line evaluation thread: http://forums.twobil...luation-thread/

 

This thread is about taking other guys from other people's lines. That means: it's not about the draft.

 

Refrain from evaluating our existing line here, as well. (There's little point in writing everything, everywhere.) Go do it at the link, if you want, but understand: we've already come to some fairly well backed-up conclusions there.

 

So far:

The thinking appears to be Glenn/Wood Solid. Everybody else is negotiable, and, our backups aren't starters. We don't know about Hairston, and whether he, or anyone else already on the roster, will develop into anything, ever.

 

Therefore, we appear to be in the market for both Gs and a RT. That's 3 spots, and I believe we have cap money for all 3, regardless of what's coming in 2015.(Anybody who tries to make this into a Spiller/Dareus thread will wish they...were smarter ).

 

However, Cap discussion vs. FA O Lineman this year IS relevant to this thread. It's a FA thread. Cap guys are free to have at it, provided it stays in context of what we can spend THIS year on O LINE.

 

 

So......

If you know about a FA, and have some info on him, please let us know. Please refrain from "I have got a name, and I got a number" posts. If you haven't see the guy play, or don't have a pile of PFF-like stats to back it up...you're not signed up.

 

Frankly, there may not be a single post here. Good: at least we will know where we stand. I don't know anything about FA O line(that we can actually get. BTW, let's keep the "unrealistic trade for such and so" to a minimum as well). Wouldn't surprise me if nobody else did either.

 

Actually, that would surprise me. With the reach of this board, I'm sure there's somebody who knows something.

Edited January 12, 2014 by OCinBuffalo

[Fixxxer]

FA OTs

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2014/01/01/2014-free-agent-offensive-tackles/

 

FA Guards

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2014/01/01/2014-free-agent-guards/

 

FA Centers

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2014/01/01/2014-free-agent-centers/

[NewEra]

Not many options available at Guard. Maybe some options at Tackle. I'd take about 5 or 6 tackles on the list over pears. The question is, how much will it cost to get them signed? Looks like we're gonna have to solidify the OL via the draft.

[peterpan]

Seems to me the best Gs in the NFL tend to be Tackles in college. Logan Mankins, Jari Evans, Levitre, those kinda guys.

 

Why not take a guy who kinda underwhelmed at T, like Oher, and try him at LG?? Im not OL expert, but if half the scouts thought Glenn was a G only, there cant be much difference between the positions. Heck he could play RT too.

 

 

On another note I noticed Will Yeatman was on that FA list. We should sign him and give him a shot at TE and/or T. He was an All American Lacrosse Player and one hell of an athlete. He was 260 in college, and bulked up to 315 it looks like. Hows that for a blocking TE? Or maybe the next Peters???

[Bill from NYC]

The following will surely fail to qualify me as "signed up."

 

This is a link from a draft site that I often visit:

http://www.drafthistory.com/

 

In it, he explains just how early the top DL and OTs are drafted. He also mentions Jason Peters, but I won't dive into that and bring up bad memories.

 

In summary, most of the time teams have to draft top linemen. Very few teams will let go of their best blockers, let alone OTs.

In 2008, the Bills drafted Leodis McKelvin at #11.Clady went next at 12. Branden Albert (on the list and a fine LT) went 3 picks later at 15. Btw Flacco went at 18. This is an example of why we are in such a mess.

 

Wrt Albert, he entered the league as a guard. He's one of the very few college guards who moved to OT in the NFL. Would he be a good fit on the Bills? Sure, but expect to pay him 12-15 million per season.

Oher is on this list. They have him rated poorly, but I always thought him to be a good player. That said, I barely saw him this year. He would cost far less.

 

To put things in perspective, I am well into my fifties. I'm 6'2'/206. Good size for DB and wideout, no? Of course I would be dead after 1 NFL play, but how many people do you know that are at least 6'4" /320? Now, can they bench 220 35 times? Do they have long arms? Are they coachable? And can they run the 40 in approx. 5 seconds, with a burst of speed?

My point is that teams keep these guys because they are so hard to find.

 

PS: There is a sliver of hope. The Chiefs are trying to extend Alex Smith, who will surely make 15 mil. per year plus. The QBs are getting the money that the owners saved on the rookie cap, NOT positional players. Still, the best things for bringing in blockers remain good scouting and good drafting.

Edited January 13, 2014 by Bill from NYC

[BuffaloBillsMagic1]

Does anyone know what exactly is wrong with Chris Hairston???? I never got the deal with his injury or illness.....

[Yard Monkey]

This post has a lot of rules. Need to consult with my attorney before responding

[OCinBuffalo]

This post has a lot of rules. Need to consult with my attorney before responding

This thread has exactly the number of rules....as there would be highjacks on the first page....without the rules.

The following will surely fail to qualify me as "signed up."

 

This is a link from a draft site that I often visit:

http://www.drafthistory.com/

 

In it, he explains just how early the top DL and OTs are drafted. He also mentions Jason Peters, but I won't dive into that and bring up bad memories.

 

In summary, most of the time teams have to draft top linemen. Very few teams will let go of their best blockers, let alone OTs.

In 2008, the Bills drafted Leodis McKelvin at #11.Clady went next at 12. Branden Albert (on the list and a fine LT) went 3 picks later at 15. Btw Flacco went at 18. This is an example of why we are in such a mess.

 

Wrt Albert, he entered the league as a guard. He's one of the very few college guards who moved to OT in the NFL. Would he be a good fit on the Bills? Sure, but expect to pay him 12-15 million per season.

Oher is on this list. They have him rated poorly, but I always thought him to be a good player. That said, I barely saw him this year. He would cost far less.

 

To put things in perspective, I am well into my fifties. I'm 6'2'/206. Good size for DB and wideout, no? Of course I would be dead after 1 NFL play, but how many people do you know that are at least 6'4" /320? Now, can they bench 220 35 times? Do they have long arms? Are they coachable? And can they run the 40 in approx. 5 seconds, with a burst of speed?

My point is that teams keep these guys because they are so hard to find.

 

PS: There is a sliver of hope. The Chiefs are trying to extend Alex Smith, who will surely make 15 mil. per year plus. The QBs are getting the money that the owners saved on the rookie cap, NOT positional players. Still, the best things for bringing in blockers remain good scouting and good drafting.

Bill, you are perma-signed up to talk O line. Anything less is disrespectful, after all of the years we have had our O line vs DB fights.

 

However, the reality is: Jason Peters is an UDFA. So are a lot of lineman out there that end up as starters.

 

FA lineman aren't a known commodity, any more than Mike Williams was a known draft pick.

 

However, the advantage to them is: we've seen them play in the NFL. Good, bad, etc. They've played.

 

I believe there's not only cap room and need, to spend some $ here, I also think there's some players who are worth signing in FA....given the PFF data.

 

I would even consider signing a 32-year old guard. If Marrone wants to develop people, it helps to have a guy who's played 10 years to assist in that.

 

I'm already on record as saying: "I think we need to spend 3 of the top 5 picks on O line".

 

But, I'm also on record saying: "I think we need to sign 3 O line in FA".

 

$9 mil was/is/will continue to be stupid money spent on a guard. That doesn't mean $4 million spent on Oher, or some other OT, to play G is a bad idea. It doesn't mean getting a G in a trade, on draft day or not, is a bad plan either.

 

I'd love to see us trade down, and, instead of getting a pick, getting some team's solid LG instead.

[3putt]

I don't see much there after the first handful on each list. But Miami is in a world of hurt if they dont resign some of their fas. I concur with Bill, the draft might be the better route. I woul take at least 3 OTs. One or two could play guard.

[thewildrabbit]

I don't like to be the bearer of bad news here, but I wouldn't count on this team bringing in a top quality free agent O linemen. Just look at the past history. Derrick Dockery, Langston Walker, Cornell Green, Garrision Sanborn, Cordaro Howard, Geoff Hangartner et al. In the past the Bills scouts haven't been able to judge the difference between a good player and a washed up has-been.

 

The best predictor of future behavior is past behavior.

 

Then, Marrone is at it again. Silk purse, sows ear type of thing with....

 

"None of them were a part of Buffalo’s 53-man roster at the start of the 2013 season, but Doug Marrone sees all three of his young interior offensive line prospects as a part of Buffalo’s future. Mark Asper, Antoine McClain and J.J. ‘Unga are guards that Buffalo’s head coach believes all have the potential to be regular starters in the NFL."

 

And,

 

“We’re in a league that’s based on a salary cap and there are certain positions you need to develop and spend your money in other areas,” he said. “My background as an offensive line coach I realize that you’re not going to be able to spend top dollar for five offensive linemen across the board.”

 

http://www.buffalobills.com/news/article-1/Marrone-sees-promise-in-young-guard-prospects/eba6f00d-58f9-4daf-8dfe-6de9ab15ab16

 

If you love watching an O line dominate like I do, then this is a letdown, and the forecast for another down season

 

Marrone towing the company line in the belief that top quality OG's are not needed and they can get by with "coached up players" off the waiver wire or low cost free agents like Gailey did, and like he did just last year.

 

You would think that after 14 losing seasons of no playoffs that someone, somewhere at OBD would have noticed that all those defensive players drafted during that time didn't equal a playoff berth. Plus, the lack of top talent across that line since the Jim Kelly days have resulted in no playoff wins for 17 years.

 

Look at the current Bills defense Two #1's at CB. Two #2's at safety. A 100 million dollar DE who was the 1st overall draft pick. A first round DT who was the #3 overall draft pick. A #2 at LDE. A #1 & #2 at LBer. That's 5 first rounders, 4 second rounders. So nine out of eleven on defense drafted in the first two rounds and its still a 6-10 team with no playoffs.

 

I'm already on record as saying: "I think we need to spend 3 of the top 5 picks on O line".

 

But, I'm also on record saying: "I think we need to sign 3 O line in FA".

 

I'd love to see us trade down, and, instead of getting a pick, getting some team's solid LG instead.

I've been hoping that the Bills would build a top solid competent line for years and years. They fill one or two positions and think that will be good enough, and it never is. Think about having to go up against that Seattle defense, and then ask how would the Bills line do against that team.

 

As far as the Bills obtaining 3 of the top 5 draft picks on the O line. I'm going to go on record and say I'll believe it when I see it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Armchair GM]

With Marrone's view of the young guys currently on the roster, it makes sense to bring in a vet on a 1-2 year deal. Not that there are many out there, but Wade Smith tops the list.

 

The guy will be 33 to start the season, but he's had a solid career and has played his best ball over the last 2 seasons. He won't break the bank as a 30+ yr old, but Houston may overpay to keep him as they've lost some quality linemen over the last couple seasons, so it may be a stretch.

 

He's a dominant run blocker and an above average pass blocker. Having him as a stop gap to allow the young bucks to develop makes more sense than not.

 

While I agree that you should build your team through the draft, I still hope that Doug will shake Nix's view of FA and utilize to suppliment the roster. When you have a team with many, many holes to fill, you have to do something other than the draft to put out the best "product" for a 2/3 years.

 

I'm not saying this guy's the answer, just saying that I think the Bills need to put a little bit more value on FA than in years past. On the flip side, don't go "Irleand" on us and break the bank in FA...Miami, yet again, proves that signing a bunch of FA's isn't the answer; however, it was a decent last ditch effort.

[JPS]

Who was the last big (big money…long term) free agent signing by the Patriots? How about the Steelers? Ravens?

 

Good organizations don't build through free agency. You play Russian roulette with someone else's expensive rejects and hamstring your own ability to keep your good players.

 

You want to sign some old guy on June 16th to a 1 year deal, have at it. But throwing $10 M at Branden Albert is foolish, desperate and would not be done by any smart GM.

[4merper4mer]

Seems to me the best Gs in the NFL tend to be Tackles in college. Logan Mankins, Jari Evans, Levitre, those kinda guys.

 

Why not take a guy who kinda underwhelmed at T, like Oher, and try him at LG?? Im not OL expert, but if half the scouts thought Glenn was a G only, there cant be much difference between the positions. Heck he could play RT too.

 

 

On another note I noticed Will Yeatman was on that FA list. We should sign him and give him a shot at TE and/or T. He was an All American Lacrosse Player and one hell of an athlete. He was 260 in college, and bulked up to 315 it looks like. Hows that for a blocking TE? Or maybe the next Peters???

 

How about inside out? Sign Alex Mack and move him or Wood to G? No expert here but I've heard of him unlike many of the other names on the list. There seem to be a lot of older players on all of the lists. Mack seems to fit the age/skill profile pretty well.

Edited January 14, 2014 by 4merper4mer