BillsVet

It seems to me that cutting Holcomb, based on clump's page, wouldn't net us any gain. His cap hit is about equal to his salary. So if we unload him and Spikes onto Philly, I guess that's progress. Then again, it all comes down to what we get in return. If Holcomb is cut, we suffer a 2.185 in dead cap this season. It's almost good enough to get a 5th and 6th for both of them and let go the salary. If we get a player who can step in, all the more better.

Some of those little blurbs regarding Spikes on ESPN.com mentioned he demanded a trade or be released. I think Buffalo is attempting to meet his requirement. It could be argued they need to get rid of him for cap reasons, but ultimately when a guy is so publicly shopped there's not a chance he's back next season. Like it or not, I don't feel Spikes fits in with the youth movement. I personally believe his public complaints about Vincent's release started he and the Bills down a dead end road and for Spikes a ticket out of town. Some might not agree, but it's a combination of his supposed drop off in talent, high salary, and locker room lawyer mentality that is his ticket out.

I thought it was everyone's favorite pencil-necked geek John Clayton who "broke" the story. It's pathetic how all the ESPN people fall all over themselves breaking stories. It seems Chris Mortensen was talking about it too. Maybe they just have too many people doing football. If he's gone today, I don't know how I'll react until we hear what we received in return. I would think it'd be a third.

Eerie thinking about it, but true. Coy Wire starting at SLB? Scary.

I've heard DJ talk about, "moving in the right direction" quite a bit this off-season. If it's not fair to criticize the front office and coaching staff, it's not fair to declare their moves successful. The season will ultimately be the only thing to decide this. Frankly, I don't believe everything the front office or DJ says. You don't seem to understand what this team is up against. We're not going to sign talented veteran cuts after 1 June because we simply don't have the funds. Spikes' cap hit is roughly 6.4 million this season. Should he be traded, that frees up enough money to sign the rookies, including the first rounder's signing bonus and keep us within the framework of cash to the cap. When you rely on the draft for this season's success and 1 June cuts, it's simply a dangerous recipe. Optimism for the sake of optimism is a dangerous thing. George Patton once said, "If everybody's thinking alike, somebody isn't thinking.” And that's what some on this board have become- fans who do not take counsel of their fears purely to make themselves feel better.

Yeah, I think editors have decided en masse to take the day off when these things go to print. I'd say ESPN's is the best I've seen, what do you all think?

Had to laugh about what Street and Smith's Draft Guide says about the Bills. After talking about last season's draft and some random stats, they reviewed the offensive line pre-Free Agency. And this is what they said about the OT position: "Tackles Jason Peters and Terrance Pennington would be decent backups, but are not starters." Granted this was written before the acquisition of Dockery, but any mag that labels Peters a backup isn't worth it. Save yourself the $7.99.

Is there anything the Bills front office has done wrong? There's always rationale for everything they do. I don't have a problem with them letting Clements and LFB, WM, and perhaps Spikes depart. But, the key question remains who replaces them? I think that's all we're trying to point out. Some think that these positions are simply interchangeable and that anyone Marv and DJ get in here will suffice at a minimum for the short term. What if they can't? That's too negative for some people to think, but not all their draft picks are slam dunks like some would think. You can't just insert any RB next to A. Thomas and expect to get average production. A draft pick in the 2nd-3rd isn't going to give you the edge in the running game most likely. For every Jones-Drew there's someone who ends up in the CFL. And despite the Oline improvement you still need someone quick enough to exploit those holes. It's not as simple as insert body here and run there.

If you were managing a department and one of your employees who used to be excellent (and isn't performing well of late) at his job started bad mouthing you to fellow employees, would you want him to stay there? I don't think so. You'd get rid of him if you could. They're going with a youth movement and character people. I'm not crazy about some of the moves that have been made, but a lot of what I've heard about Spikes isn't high character. If he's saying things publicly about team transactions, I can't imagine what's being said behind closed doors. This has nothing to do with vindication. It has everything to do with getting good locker room guys. We, as fans see what happens on the field. The locker room is an entirely different realm. And Spikes isn't good there and that's what counts to Marv and DJ.

It's a gamble that he'll be able to jump in and play at a relatively good level. I think the Cover 2 is a little more popular than 6-7 teams in the league. He was baptized by fire, I'll say that, but I'm concerned that we're demanding attacking LB's but we don't have the DT's to allow it. And Ellison will be at the point of this at WLB from time to time.

I'll agree you can't get an educated opinion until we play the games. For all we know Youboty and Ellison will be big time players at a future point. With Youboty, I realized he missed significant time due to a death in the family over the summer. But I didn't understand that as a projected first round talent who went in the third why he didn't get more PT at CB? The coaches must have known something that we didn't. I think an excellent college player should have had the time and intelligence to learn the system by November. But we're quibbling over stupid points. I do hope for the best, but there's no point in having unsubstantiated optimism. More rookies and 2nd year players are generally not going to get you to the promised land. And we're making a habit of doing that far too often. Getting younger might be good 2 years from now, but this coming season is an entirely different matter. And that's why I started this topic. Rome was not built in a day. But NFL franchises aren't built over 3-5 years either anymore. The playing field has been leveled and parity is the way of pro football.

I'd hope we get better sometime soon, because we are perilously thin at a host of positions. To get back to 7-9 requires impact players who will play for less money. It's looking like 2008 will be the year, though it's too soon to write off 2007. If we had 1 or 2 positions that needed help on draft day I'd be a little more comfortable. But we're required at this point to get 2-3 instant starters from this draft. 2 at LB, a RB who gets considerable time, and a DT. And they need to play well now not next year.

Well, I'm not going to put too much faith into a former 6th round pick with size concerns. He's going to be the starter based on the lack of talent at the position. If he fits the bill, fine. But I'm not going to place all my chips on the Keith Ellison table just because the team likes him. Of course that's what they're going to say, he's the only conceivable option left at this point. Buffalo will not go shopping anymore with the cap concerns and Spikes being moved for partially that reason.

Needing one LB is certainly not hard to overcome. But replacing 2 in one off-season demonstrates to me a desperate need. Believe what you want, replacing starters and the turnover experienced this off-season will require some shifty moves on draft day. Using your first pick for a desperate need is very probable considering last year's moves.

I take it you're concerned Buffalo's need will outweigh their draft position and necessitate a reach for a player that is ranked the highest at their respective position? If so, I'd agree. I think this is a realistic scenario. Undoubtedly, BUffalo's hand has been forced with even the proposed shopping of Spikes. I know they couldn't hide it forever, but dealing him alerts everyone that Buffalo has a significant need at LB. And if they get blinders on like they did last season, I can see this happening.

I don't think the front office was happy with Spikes when he publicly complained about Vincent's release. I didn't think that was a good move by Spikes and never should have been in the public realm. That's stuff that needs to be kept in the locker room. But I've read that Spikes wasn't too enthusiastic about Losman starting either. Forgive me for not providing direct links to the latter, but here's an example of his displeasure with the front office: Spikes-Vincent 9-14-06 I can understand wanting to shed him from the team for multiple reasons. I'm merely concerned with the replacement. I personally like Okoye and Posulszny. Both would seem to be excellent on this team. Same for Willis, they are all character people. Plain and simple, I think the front office would deal Spikes to prevent the younger players from buying into a guy with great playing credentials who is bad-mouthing the transactions the team makes. Not a good thing. I'd like to see Buffalo grab another DT, a starting LB, and a RB. Those are my three distinct areas of need.

An excellent point. Surely 5 years of TD greatly contributed to Buffalo not being post-season bound. But Buffalo is part of some infamous company with regard to playoffs. Detroit and Arizona are the only other teams (excluding Houston) who have failed to make the post-season for 7 or more seasons. You can't blame the current regime for this because they've been on-board for a short time. But I'm still not convinced this team can be a playoff team. Granted, it's March, but the chances of adding players after draft day who can make your team instantly better are few and far between. I'm not talking about spending crazy cash in free agency, but adding the guys who can fill a position and be reliable without needing to be spectacular. Cato June wasn't had for all that much in TB. But if the cash to the cap method is studied, Buffalo is at about 105M of their 112M maximum. Getting rid of Spikes saves some money, but basically eliminates the Bills from almost all the decent free agents. That money will go toward their draft picks.

If that PC was any indication, Marv is not your classic Polian, Newsome, Pioli, insert GM here, type of General Manager. I got that. I'm just not comfortable with a triumvirate of people making decisisons. I have no definitive smoking gun truth, but I think it's safe to say they make decisions by committee up there at OBD. But I'll say one thing, micromanaging a team or an organization is doomed to fail. Individuals don't care for someone looking over their shoulder. At the same time, you must exercise some level of control. Hopefully Marv is in the middle of those two areas. If anything, he's closer to the latter. The season itself will point out mistakes and good decisions. Hindsight is 20/20. But it's my take that they're stripping away too much of the team at once, and while some people like to rationalize every move and question nothing, I don't see it that way. You can talk about Spikes being a negative influence, his cap hit, whatever. But you don't have a better option. If he departs for draft picks, you're leaving the team extremely thin at LB. And CB doesn't look much better. We're hoping and praying that the guys who've been career backups and our 1st and 2nd year guys can perform at a certain level. To believe that is nonsense. You can get picks for experienced veterans, but doing that too often is such a long-term and risky investment. Let's see what Spikes goes for first, because it seems like a foregone conclusion. We all agree draft picks are not a sure thing, no matter who is doing the selecting. In Buffalo, having 2-3 starters come from each draft will be required, not optional. Marv and DJ need immediate impact players each season.

Not sure if someone kicked your dog today, but that's funny stuff. Troll? Nah, wouldn't have joined in the dead of January when nothing was going on. I enjoy talking about moves and seeing what other teams do. While there are exceptions, I like what people bring to the table here with news and opinions. And that's all they are...opinions. If you don't like mine, so what. Listen, I'm not a DJ fan after what happened in Chicago. Sure, there's the career record, not to mention an 0-1 playoff record and one good season to show for five seasons total. And yes, he has immense impact on Marv's personnel decisions. Ever wonder why we went defense with 6 of 9 picks last draft? It's because Jauron is a defense first and second coach. His Bears teams recorded 4 30+ point games. That's fine if you've got the defense to stop the other team, but if you don't you're in for a long day. Kinda like this last season. As for Marv, he was out of football for 10 years. Have you ever asked yourself why we hired him? How many guys come back into the league as a GM with no NFL GM experience? Only teams in need of a face-lift and a better rep do something like that. And did you watch or listen to the press conference back in February? Marv spoke about running down the hall to Overdorf about cap issues and just now getting deeper into scouting and personnel issues. And did you even think he didn't know what Willis said? Come on, that's more wishful thinking. Do you think Marv didn't know or was feigning cap knowledge? He's too honest for that. And one more thing-I don't care what a newbie said about your tone. At the end of the day your opinion and mine make no difference, so shelve the intimidation thing. Who cares? Then again, this could all be a devil's advocate thing.

There certainly aren't many free agents left who could be counted on as quality free agents. In fact I think we can all agree it wasn't a real strong class after about 5 players who commanded immense cash for their services. Still not sure about Chris Brown, but he's been rumored to go to Buffalo for about 2 weeks now. I have a feeling it's not happening. To say we've got to wait some more ignores the players we have on the roster from the TD regime. There are some remnants from TD's five poor seasons who make contributions to this team. You know the names, but if we need 3 full drafts in addition to what was here before Marv arrived you're looking at 2008 to compete. That's a long time. I guess the sum of this topic is this: Do you want to have 8-9 years between playoff appearances? The salary cap was designed to get more teams into the playoffs rather than a select few who had the best personnel departments. 7 years is already an eternity. But if that doesn't bother people, I guess it shouldn't bother everyone. And for the character who wondered if I was TD...nice. But unless TD was running the show from Iraq, then I'm not him.

Marv and DJ are confident. In what we're not sure. But if last season's, "we're going to be quicker" mentality remains, it's going to be a long season. Of course it's not for another 5 months until opening day, but some people haven't figured out the people who may stop the run are assembled in March and April. Without DT's in the middle, your "attacking" LB's will quickly become "pursuers." Trust in Marv?

I'm merely suggesting that you can win more than 2 games over the previous season. And you don't have to acquire big name talent to do that. I think this board has agreed the path to success begins on draft day. But free agency is there to fill in for those times you can't stock a position through the draft or need help right away. The draft takes 2-3 years normally. Listen, I'm not advocating getting name free agents every year. We can agree that's not the solution. But a little spending goes a long way to enhancing the draft. Dockery, Langston, and Whittle have been signed to improve the OL and I believe they'll do just that. But did any other area improve? The answer is decidedly no. We're wishing and hoping that what we had last season combined with improvement in now 2nd year and drafted players will provide the difference. Plain and simple, it seems to me that expectations are modest for the 2007 season. As for Levy, still a great guy. He's not bad as a person or coach. But GM remains to be seen. Unless that press conference was a complete and purposely misrepresentation of his knowledge, I'm not really confident of his abilities to be an NFL GM. HOF coach...newcomer to GM. We want to give Marv credit for everything, but how much did Polian, Butler, Smith, and Adams contribute to those late eighties and early nineties teams? In their sted we have Tom Modrak and Jim Overdorf. Just because Marv believes in character players doesn't mean that's a dynamic or new-wave approach. That's been going on now a few years. The Dockery signing was huge and I'm glad for it. It will come off like a kid not getting enough on Christmas, but I was expecting more beyond that. Not once did I insinuate being a Super Bowl team. There's 32 teams in this league and that's not going to happen. But 12 teams get into the playoffs. And just once I'd like to be one of those 12.

As a fan, if you're not looking to make the playoffs and win each season, you may as well not even follow the sport. That's my point. There are a host of teams last season that made huge strides from one year to the next. New Orleans, the Jets, Baltimore, Philly, and San Diego all improved their win total by 4 from 2005 to 2006. Seems like we're taking baby steps toward respectability. Then again, we're not giving our front office enough time. So other teams can become successful (see playoff appearances) from one season to the next and yet we somehow don't have to be because we're building up to it. Marv's a great guy, but the league passed him by. He relies considerably on Dick Jauron, whose 43-58 career record doesn't really make me feel better. Face it, Marv was hired to provide gravitas and a nice popular face after the departure of the universally hated TD. Other peole do the heavy lifting. He provides the image and character. This team's struggles have a huge effect on WNY. There are varying levels of Bills fans throughout the region, but the fans I can't stand are the ones who see Buffalo lose and don't care by Tuesday. In comparison, the people who carry it around for months are also out there. The team's PR people get you all excited season after season and we end up on the outside looking when the playoffs roll around. Yeah, patience is a virute. Most Bills fans have had 7 years worth. I guess it's OK to give another year.

There's nothing like a sarcastic response to brighten your day. Thanks for the new perspective. Seriously, please give me something more than that. When someone starts using facts to back a perceived "negative" (see realisitc) opinion we get sarcasm in return. It's so predictable and usually comes from those who want to feel good about their team without much beyond wishful thinking to back themselves up. Asking the tough questions doesn't go over well with them. Already this off-season we've shed some players that needed to go and didn't replace them all that well. I'm happy they addressed the offensive line, but if you target one area in free agency, you're never going to cover all your bases. This team has more young (read >3 years in the league) starters it's unbelievable. Some of them will be good, others won't. Youth doesn't usually lend itself to success. But you know sarcasm, it's what you fall back on when you've got nothing.

I'd agree with you on this one. Usually there isn't one year where RB is stocked. This season there are 2 clear #1's and a host of 2nd-3rd round talents. Even if you don't get the guy you want this season and have something serviceable, there's next year's draft. But for this year, we need to get a guy who can carry the load at about 4 ypc. Two guys who can't are 3.5 ypc isn't going to do it. McFadden made Arkansas run with one of the most highly recruited HS QB's in 06 on the team. Hart is a local guy from Syracuse area and Slaton has done some amazing things at WVU. So there's going to be talent there in 2008. As for that 20 million in cap room-I'm fine with using it to keep Losman and Evans. I personally think Evans is a more sure thing by virtue of his performance last season. Losman still has further strides to make. If he can make them, then yeah lock him up. But I do expect us to get close to the salary cap limit at some point. Spending less from season to season (i.e. the minumum) isn't an encouraging sign.