BADOLBILZ

Oh the Josh Reed love was real. Not the initial "he outplayed Eric Moulds and Peerless Price in training camp" real like you claiming Trent f@cking Sherfield should have started over Deebo and Aiyuk. But yes, fans and the Bills themselves thought Josh Reed was going to step right in and replace a 1200 yard receiver and that the Bills had wisely re-allocated capital to the defense instead. Bills even had him running Price's deep routes. It was dumb and I knew it was destined to fail but there were a lot of people like you around......what can I say? Your lack of knowledge on Bills related topics is impressive for someone who thinks they have some kind of perspective.

Chiefs. Thanks to Lil' Dummy keeping the score close.

Against the Oilers in those butt ugly red grazer helmets Bruce Smith had the best sack game of his career with 5.

Again.......Kumerow was the top WR for the Bills in camp in 2021. It just doesn't mean anything that Sherfield played well in the summer of 2021 when you first noticed him. He's averaged 190 yards per SEASON in his 5 year career. Yes, you read that right. He wasn't a newbie when you saw him in SF. He played 3 years in Arizona and after a better statistical rookie year than the disappointing Khalil Shakir had last season he disappeared from offensive football altogether for the next 3 years. Regarding Josh Reed...........the Bills traded a 90+ catch 1200+ yard receiver in Peerless Price and the prevailing opinion was that they would be fine because Reed was going to be a better all around receiver. He was seen as a steal of a draft pick at the top of round 2 and that his Biletnikoff award was no fluke. I disagreed and felt it was a dumb decision to trade Price........but in fairness Reed was great and didn't drop a catchable ball as a rookie. And he was still tremendous at getting open after that..........but he got the yips in year two and his promising career went to sh!t. So don't tell me about knowing NFL players.........you don't even know or remember players from the Bills. That's clear from your takes in this thread.

OMG @Chaos is now an analytics nerd. It's not just the fans who are impacted emotionally by failure..........turning the ball over at the 5 is NOT just the same as a long punt pinning the team at the 5. It can have a very different impact depending on the other situations involved in the game. Momentum is real. We've recently been discussing the WC game against the Dolphins and there was a play late in the half where a wide open Khalil Shakir dropped a long bomb that would have set the Bills up for another score. Not coming away with points on drives where you should have can be deflating to the team. A punt followed and a minute later the whole tenor of the game had changed from a likely blowout to a dogfight. And you can't tell me that a lack of energy/emotion wasn't a huge factor in the playoff loss a week later. As for there not being much room to improve statistically...........yeah there is plenty. Josh Allen is or was at the peak of his all around abilities. With the right cast around him there was no reason that the Bills couldn't have rode his generational skills to put up 38 points per game like the 2013 Broncos. 10 more points per game than what they produced last year is A LOT of room for improvement. What the Chiefs produced in a transition year or what the Eagles produced with Jalen Hurts at QB( no Josh Allen) shouldn't be the standard. The 2007 Patriots produced 37 points per game and the 2018 Chiefs with a first year starter in Mahomes produced 35 points per game. These are the standards when you have a generational QB at the peak of his skills.

My contention with the points you are trying to make is the absurd hyperbole. If you are saying Sherfield is better than Brandon Aiyuk and Deebo Samuel then you are, in fact, saying he is "some future pro-bowler". Because those dudes are legit studs........arguably the top 2 options on the team with the most offensive weapons around their QB in the NFL. Absurd take. Sherfield has averaged less than 200 yards per season in his career. And you need perspective on offseason/summer evaluations. Nobody outperformed Jake Kumerow in Bills camp in 2021. He was absolutely killing it. When the real games started he couldn't get on the field because real NFL games are a lot different than camp and preseason. Could Shakir be much improved this season? Sure. It's a maybe that you declare is a FACT just because of experience. That's ignorance. Plenty of receivers don't get better in year 2. Here are a couple notable Bills examples: 1) Robert Foster 540 yards receiving as a rookie.......just 60 total yards in year 2 in the same amount of games. 2) Josh Reed......looked like a future All Pro as a rookie........catch % dropped 7% and yards per target dropped precipitously from 8.6 to 5.7......and he remained a JAG the rest of his career. You are confusing your HOPE with fact...........we all hope these guys exceed their production of last season and their careers..........but history tells us very few, if any, will.

What you mean is that injury history is a HUGE concern with Harty. He had like a dozen hamstring injuries and re-aggrivations in his brief career before his turf-toe/surgery lost season. Like I said, one offseason he reportedly re-aggrivated his bad hammy 3 times. He's done more nursing than a nurse. And missed 24 of the last 50 games in their entirety. Many others he's been limited. I honestly don't think you were aware of how brittle this dude has been. If he plays in 9 games this year and finishes the season on the IR is that going to be good? Because that's who he's been. I mention Crowder as both a very recent frame of reference for unrealistic expectations for an offseason flyer signing and because he was also a guy who fans like you presumed was just suddenly going to be past his injuries. He was not. To this point Sherfield = Kumerow 2.0. We hope he's better but there were moments when it looked like Kumerow was going to break out too. Sherfield's propensity for gaffe's like "butt punt" and that killer dropped TD pass in the playoffs versus Buffalo is concerning.

The grazer is not iconic in either sense of the word. The charging Buffalo is far more famous AND was what was worn during the greatest years of the franchise. 10 playoff trips, 4 SB appearances and 5 AFCCG appearances in 12 years in the NFL, not some minor league.

1) No, it's not a fact...... it's an opinion based on extremely limited data.......all of which indicates the opposite of what you are presuming. Dude was a 5th rounder for a reason. Modest speed and quickness combined with very short arms makes him a tweener prospect. 2) Harty caught all of 2 passes for 13 yards last season. He's caught a measly 64 passes in his entire career and has never had a 100 yard game. There is not much to draw from but some youtube highlights in a stretch of the 2021 season which was about the only stretch of his career when he's been healthy. He's been plagued by recurring hamstring inuries every year......including during offseasons even........ until last year when he was hurt all year with the turf toe! That's why he was out of the Saints plans.......lack of availability. McKenzie is a proven mistake factory but he has caught 141 passes........and he's actually been available most of the time. He hasn't missed an entire season to a foot injury like Harty and Jamison Crowder both did last year. 3) Individual stats aside? Jamison Crowder put up 650 yards per season prior to joining the Bills.........were Harty and Sherfield playing with lesser QB's when they were putting up their 190 per season? Face it, these guys are journeymen in the truest sense of the word. Crowder was not. But like Harty his injury history followed him around despite the change of scenery. Go figure.

Yeah they were great except for the lifeless grazer on the helmet. The charging buffalo has been an iconic logo for almost 50 years now as opposed to 15 for the sad carcass that was the grazer look. People who want to throwback the grazer need to remember why it got thrown out in the first place. It couldn't talk proud. It was bad.

Joe Bob says hold my Big Gulp

I'm saying it. Go back to the full 90's look. It's the only significant period of time since the Bills have been in the NFL that you can't tell the story of the league without talking about the Bills. Current Bills have been something like the Schottenheimer/Norv Turner era Chargers........look good on paper, preseason favorites, high ranking units on O and D, regular season point differential champs.........but have not been close at all to winning a SB. They could use a change of threads. The current uni's with the charging Buffalo on the white helmet isn't bad but the 90's uni's were great.

Shakir? What has he done to instill confidence? He was uninspiring as a rookie and the final impression was dropping a bomb when he was wide open in the WC game against Miami that helped flip the momentum into the Dolphins favor. Every team has late round picks in the mix for a WR spot. And how are Sherfield and Harty proven to be "noticeable upgrades"? Against the Bills Sherfield took a punt up his a$$ costing the Dolphins 2 points and then dropped a TD pass in the WC game. Harty has averaged less yards per season over the course of his career than McKenzie and they are both unplayable fumble factories on special teams. Harty also has a more significant injury history. The reality is that they shuffled one set of guys who had proven they couldn't excel in Buffalo.........for a group of guys who have only proven they can't excel elsewhere, to this point in their run as journeymen in the NFL. We are all hoping that these guys are better than the backs of their football card say they are but it's a stretch saying this years flyers are definite upgrades or more promising than guys like OJ Howard and Jamison Crowder were last offseason. OJ Howard was the same kind of receiver his first 3 seasons in the NFL that Dawson Knox was last season.....after he got paid. There were expectations that OJ Howard would return to that form. AT LEAST if not be better. And I saw one person cite Sherfield and Harty as better players than Crowder when those two guys haven't even averaged 200 yards receiving per season in their careers. Crowder averaged over 650 yards per season in his career coming into last season.

Dorsey inherited notably less talent and fielded a more consistent offense than Daboll had in 2021. It's funny how some fans look back on Daboll with such reverence when they were aghast at him after some of their performances in 2021. Like the 6 point performance in Jacksonville against the absolute worst team in the NFL. Daboll's bad game plans and play calling cost the Bills home field advantage in 2021. But just like Gabe Davis last impression in that 13 seconds game caused people to forget how wildly inconsistent a player he'd already PROVEN that he was........the same can be said for Daboll.

To put the term "conjecture" in perspective..........the Bills use "a whole lot of conjecture" when making all personnel moves. All of them. Nothing is guaranteed........it's just an opinion on the basis of incomplete information. How could projecting what a player will do next season be anything else? How it pertains to your post? You are just pretending that conjecture isn't presumed because you are inclined to bicker for the sake of it. I like Kincaid but if the Bills had the first overall pick in the draft would that have been my choice? No. Does that make their pick a consolation prize? I guess in your mind it does but that's not how the draft works. They were slotted where they were and I tend to agree that he was the best receiving prospect left on the board when they decided to move up. All rookies bring the additional risk of adjusting to the league. Rookies being asked to convert from TE to WR.......probably a little more of a transition than a polished receiver like Jordan Addison......who could have come out in 2022 after an incredible season with Pitt........who will be playing a more familiar role.

1) With regard to 100% confidence......yeah, sure now that we know in hindsight that some of those guys were totally washed........but in terms of what they have proven in the NFL: OJ Howard > Kincaid.........most Bills fans thought they might get that very productive 2017-2019 version of OJ Howard Crowder > Harty or Sherfield.....no contest..... 2 guys who have averaged 190 yards per season versus Crowder who had averaged 657 yards per season prior to last year McKenzie > Sherfield..........clearly more production offensively in career Kumerow > Shakir..........two depth guys that need to cover kicks and one of them doesn't I understand that it's the offseason and we want to imagine the greatest outcomes for the new players but if you don't know your past........you don't know your future. The odds don't favor these dudes all out performing their 2022 counterparts. Isaiah McKenzie was trash in hindsight.........but his 224 yards per season average is well above the career averages of Sherfield and Harty. I am actually a little worried that Sherfield is going to be a stumble-bum like Lil' Dummy after he co-authored the "Butt punt" last season and dropped a sure TD pass against the Bills in the playoffs. 2) As with #1.......I hope you are right but they didn't exactly sign studs for the IOL. Hopefully Torrence pans out because they other guys were sketchy adds. 3) Agree that I expect Dorsey to be better. I think McD wanted a more consistent play caller than the wacky-wacky Daboll and Dorsey was that.........but a first year OC hasn't won a SB in almost 40 years. And true to form......he got outcoached by an experienced DC in Anarumo in the playoffs. 4) I think fans discount Juju because they don't like his social media act. Dude had a 1400 yard receiving season in his still relatively young career and put up over 900 yards as option 2 with a 77% catch rate last season. That is undeniably good.

By WR1, WR2, WR3 we are really talking about receiving weapons.......so Travis Kelce was an elite WR1. 110 catches 1338 receiving yards 12 TD Juju did finish 24th in the NFL receiving yards and did so with a gaudy 77% catch rate.........technically WR1 type numbers..........but by SB contender standards that was a very good WR2. Not Tee Higgins or Devonta Smith but still legit. MVS was basically Gabe Davis but with like a dozen less targets.......those two guys are as close of a comp to each other as any two WR's in the NFL.

Kincaid is a TE-in-name only........but so is Mike Gesicki. Until Kincaid proves he is actually capable of winning against a steady diet of NFL CB coverage then he brings more question marks than a stud WR like Jordan Addison would have. They reportedly wanted one of the top not-TE-in-name-only receiving targets and settled on Kincaid when he was perceived to be much better than what was left.

I am afraid you are playing the offseason "on paper" game. The Bills had 5 guys last season who "on paper" should have put up 500+ yards receiving.......Diggs, Davis, Knox, McKenzie and Cook. And I mean.......the first 4 all did or came very close and they had a total of 3200+ yards.........but it was the inefficiency in accumulating those bulk numbers that plagued them once teams developed a good strategy for Stefon Diggs and The Pips. Your argument sounds a lot like the narrative that @Zerovoltz has been pushing..........but the reality is that it's a matchup league and if you don't have a very good WR2(which Juju was for KC last season) it doesn't matter that much if the rest of your corps are all WR3-WR4 type talents. There has been no better indicator of SB worthiness over the last 6 years than the quality of your second receiving option. I liked the Kincaid pick but there is a lot riding on one rookie to become the 2nd option and get the Bills in the conversation with the other SB contenders.......who all have a better playmakers. Or in the case of the Chiefs, much better pedigree of unknowns with a #1 or #2 from each of the last 3 drafts competing for WR2 between Kelce and MVS.

I don't really buy that the Bills still think Gabe is a good enough #2 option. I think some fans confuse the fact that they "like" Gabe with this idea that they think he's a stud. KC paid MVS $10M+ aav to be their 3rd option in the passing game. You can like a player and be willing to pay 8 figures per season without necessarily thinking they are a #1 or #2 option. I think they DID think Gabe was a tremendous WR2 waiting to break out at this point last offseason..........and that's why they didn't pursue a top 2 WR......but I think they know better now. They aren't blind to his flaws. They were eye-balling WR talent in round 1 and did pursue Hopkins this offseason.........and if 1 of those pursuits doesn't say plenty about what they think of Gabe as WR2 then the other does.

@yall agrees (but he's one of those not showing up if you gonna' charge his dam credit card! Then it's like..... ) People are crazed about free stuff and little makes those folks more upset than when they don't get it. I missed out on practice tix last summer and it never even occurred to me to be upset about it...........the camp setting is much more interesting if you are going to a practice.

Yeah, you want to take loved ones to the stadium but so do season ticket holders who have groups of family and friends who otherwise can't attend in-season because they can't afford tickets or work weekends or because their parents don't want them around the adult environment in-season etc.. That's why the ST holders get priority for this extravaganza. If you don't like it.......there is a preseason game there 8 days later you can get into for REALLY cheap. Next time you are irritated about "greedy" people getting priority to free things then sign yourself up as a season ticket holder and get in line for all the perks. Next year you will even get a chance to pay full price for TWO preseason games.

Nah, they limit seating to a portion of the lower deck. It's a weird experience.........the crowd is VERY local-heavy because it's not a big event to travel to........so people show up and then flee. A couple years ago we walked out and traffic was jammed up like after a game so we decided to walk down the block and eat at Big Tree thinking it would be packed and there was one person at the bar and one couple seated waiting to be served food and that was it.