thebandit27

Saying that he only throws half his passes accurately is not being realistic; its hyperbole.

He should've been benched against Tennessee? It was a one-score game the entire game, and they ended up winning. You wanted to see them shelf the rookie in a situation where he could manage a 4th quarter comeback win? At least against GB you can say that (a) he played his worst game of the season and (b) it would've been a mercy (like Rosen on Sunday).

If all you do is judge accuracy by a box score, then yes, that's a fine way to convince yourself that you know what you're talking about. There are those of us that care to watch the game, chart throws, look at play designs, and actually understand what's happening on the field.

It must be all about feelings these days, else you wouldn't have such an issue simply saying "huh, I guess he's throwing the ball a bit better than I thought".

The answer is, was, and always will be: VIVA EL PEGUAL!!!

I'm more than happy to talk details about Rosen. My my only major criticisms of him as a prospect were (a) that he got rattled under pressure and (b) he had way too many tipped passes for my liking--both seem to remain problematic for him at this point. I had him as my QB1 (of course, I did say that Baker was 1A ), and I still think he'll be very good. I also think that folks like WRONG JOSH need to take a step back and look at Allen's performance in an honest light. Both guys are in lousy situations, but one guy is clearly inspiring confidence, while the other has more or less floundered.

Ah, they got beat by the defense that scored zero points and allowed 2 early TDs that put the team behind? Got it! And drop the agenda man. Nobody is bragging; we're just pointing out that you're way off base.

Rosen has the lowest passer rating in the NFL when throwing from the pocket, so be glad we didn't draft him And don't you think it's a bit silly to criticize Allen for producing offense however he can? It may not be sustainable, but the first team to take the run away from him got beat with his arm on Sunday, so, ya know, there's that.

He is the team's entire offense. Folks that knock him as Tebow-esque don't watch football; the two are nothing alike. People bang the completion percentage drum because they box-score-scout, which is what I've been saying since March. You should know, you and I both had Rosen as our QB1s (a position I haven't moved from by the way)...but even then I cautioned folks that judging this kid by completion percentage was foolish. Since coming back from injury Allen has accounted for 1,152 of the team's 1,422 offensive yards (81%) and 7 of the team's 9 TDs. That's absolutely absurd. He's out there doing it by himself, and the team is actually competitive. I know you're getting lambasted right now, but you might want to pull back the reins a bit on returning fire here.

I think we all support our guys, but it still makes sense to call 'em like you see 'em.

I don't think that happens much to be honest. I think that there are some guys that are clearly assets for him, like Foster and McKenzie. I also think that, by and large, the rest of his receiving targets might not belong in the NFL. Kelvin Benjamin was an abomination. Per NextGenStats, he creates less separation per route run than any other WR in the game, and has the game's highest drop rate. He's literally the worst receiver in football. Zay Jones has had his moments, but the last 2 games have shown a serious regression...not quite to 2017 form, but it's not good. Deonte Thompson hasn't looked at all like the player that was the team's most consistent deep threat in 2017. I can see why Dallas let him go.

It depends. If you have a pinpoint-accurate QB that can put the ball wherever he wants to, all the time, then it's generally the QB that makes the WR. Those guys (Brady, Brees) are few and far between, and with them, you can almost put anybody on the field and they'll be successful. The rest of the time, you're looking at guys that are just accurate enough. The league is littered with them. For these guys to have success, you need to have enough pass-catchers that are capable of creating separation consistently. If you do so, then they'll have huge success. For example: - Surround a guy like Mahomes (or Alex Smith before him) with Hunt, Hill, Kelce, Watkins, and even second-tier targets like Demetrius Harris, Chris Conley, and Demarcus Robinson and they'll put up numbers - Surround Goff with Gurley, Woods, Cooks, Kupp, Reynolds, Everett, and Higbee and he'll put up numbers - Surround Trubisky with Howard, Cohen, Robinson, Miller, Gabriel, and Burton and he'll put up numbers But the opposite is also true: - Move Alex Smith from KC to Washington, where his targets are nowhere near as good, and his TD:INT ratio drops massively, his YPA is down by nearly a yard-and-a-half, and he loses 5 completion percentage points - Move Case Keenum from Minnesota to Denver, where his targets are nowhere near as good, and he's an entirely different player With regard to Allen, he clearly falls into the second category. So I guess I'll pose a question back at you, because I genuinely am interested in your take: If Allen had Kareem Hunt, Tyreek Hill, Sammy Watkins, Chris Conley, and Travis Kelce at his disposal next season, do you think his performance would improve significantly?

Michael Thomas was an absolute beast at Ohio State (despite catching passes from JT Barrett most of the time), and Josh Gordon had over 1,600 receiving yards in a single season catching passes from Jason Campbell, Brandon Weeden, and Brian Hoyer. Like I said, it's too early to say anything definitive about any of these guys. Buffalo's WRs are largely awful though. I think it's a bit of both on the latter. Kittle was darn good in college, just under-utilized. Dante Pettis and Trent Taylor were both draft sleepers of mine as well. But, Kyle Shanahan does a really good job of only asking his players to do what they're good at, which is something that Daboll looks like he's starting to figure out.

So it's Nick Mullens that is responsible for George Kittle's performance? Is that really where you're intending to take this point?

Welcome to the board, and thanks for sharing your thoughts... ...now go get your shine box!

That's fine, but I have two thoughts on this: I would treat him like Jakeem Grant, who Miami uses as a gadget player. That shouldn't sound like a diss either; that's the same role that Tarik Cohen has in Chicago. He's really small, so you don't want him taking 40+ snaps per game. It would be a bad decision to go into the season thinking that McKenzie playing 16 games next year is a foregone conclusion. Best bet is to add a WR1 and find a complementary slot option. You don't want to be in a situation where your only slot threat twists and ankle and you don't have another guy to play that spot. I'd rather have a guy like McKenzie in a Cohen/Grant "gadget" role and have the flexibility to use him as my primary slot WR when I want/need to than having my hand forced. Just my 1 cent.

I knew you'd be fair ?

I doubt there are many that are indeed sold on him. I mean, for my part, I was a huge supporter of the top tier of the 2018 QB class. I felt pre-draft that all 5 guys had a real chance to be franchise QBs, and that all of them should be 1st round (if not top-10) picks. I see absolutely no reason to deviate from that opinion at this point. That said, there's no reason to declare a guy a franchise QB after one season. Look no further than Dak Prescott for an example of why that's not a great idea. Unbelievable rookie season, yet here we are 2 years later, and we still have no idea if he's a franchise guy.

#getbetterreceivers

Well, you also didn't think that Allen belonged being drafted in the first round, and yet he's taken the starting job. Sure, he's not 4-1, he also didn't get the benefit of learning behind Flacco (and RG3 for that matter) or playing with a cast of playmakers that includes multiple 1st-round pass-catchers and a resurgent John Brown, nor does he play behind an offensive line the caliber of Baltimore's.

Yes, all rookies go through that. And yes, some play better than others...it's almost like all of these kids develop at a different rate. Weird. And just for some house-cleaning, it's probably a bit disingenuous to be listing Jackson next to Mayfield on that list, and neither of them belong in the same universe as rookie Deshaun Watson. Daboll has really grown on me. His play designs have always been pretty good, but his play-calling has gotten much better as the season has worn on...I'm intrigued to see what he can do when he's given a whole offseason to work with players that don't belong in the CFL.

There's an important parallel to draw between Allen and Goff/Trubisky. All 3 had very similar starts, though Allen is probably playing a bit better than those guys did as rookies (not that that means anything; he's just a more talented guy is all). Both Goff and Trubisky made huge strides in year 2 because they were given a fresh, innovative offensive play-caller and got a hugely revamped set of playmakers surrounding them. For Goff, McVay came in and added Woods, Watkins, Kupp, G. Everett, Higbee, Reynolds, and Whitworth. For Trubisky, Nagy came in and added Robinson, Gabriel, Miller, Burton, and James Daniels. If Allen is given the same overhaul in offensive weapons, could we see the same jump? I don't know, but I sure hope they give him the chance.

Ok, well, what are/were your expectations of a kid that played 2 years at Wyoming? I've said this before, but it's worth noting again: most people have no idea how hard it is to be a rookie--any rookie--in the NFL, let alone a QB. When you come into the league as a rookie, you've been practicing, training, and competing from August to December as a college player. When that ends, you immediately begin training for the draft, which is a 3-1/2 month run of constant workouts, interviews, visits, studying, etc. After the draft, you have about 2 weeks to get your bearings before you start rookie camp--a process that includes finding a place to live, moving any family that will be coming with you, taking care of other life stuff, etc.. After that, you've got a week before OTAs begin, and that's when the off-season basically ends for NFL veterans. By the time a rookie completes their first NFL season in December, they've been in season-mode for about 17 consecutive months (and that's if they don't make the playoffs). Read the above back to yourself, and then stop and ask: what did you really expect from a kid that was playing at Wyoming 11 months ago?

Hmmm...assuming drop rate is calculated purely on what's considered (albeit subjectively) as catchable passes, then it seems the problem is that Allen's ball is tougher to catch for whatever reason. Probably velocity, but who knows. Good context though.