Bill from NYC Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 While I like the Giants' line, I still have to give props to the Titans' line. Not only for the way Johnson and White have been tearing up the league on the ground, but also in how they've excelled in protecting their QBs. Titans QBs have been sacked a total of 8 times all season. That's awesome. Adrian Peterson might want to discuss this too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Rich Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 Adrian Peterson might want to discuss this too. Hmm....I could dig up the stats, but I'll guess that Minny's O line, while they've done a great job of leading the way for Peterson, hasn't limited sacks to as few as 8 all year. Maybe they have, but I'd be surprised if that's so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 Hmm....I could dig up the stats, but I'll guess that Minny's O line, while they've done a great job of leading the way for Peterson, hasn't limited sacks to as few as 8 all year. Maybe they have, but I'd be surprised if that's so. 9-5 and who is the qb? I am guessing that Peterson is kissing the ground that Hutch walks on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Rich Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 9-5 and who is the qb? I am guessing that Peterson is kissing the ground that Hutch walks on. Not just Hutchinson. McKinnie and Birk are major cogs in that machine, too. One guy who doesn't get the props on that line, who should, is the other guard, Anthony Herrera. He's having a very good season for the Vikes, who have finally found that missing piece to go w/ Birk and Hutch that they couldn't get from guys like Artis Hicks. A guy you should watch and you'll like on that line is the RT, Ryan Cook. If you're a fan of Trueblood, and I know you are, you'll like the way he plays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 Not just Hutchinson. McKinnie and Birk are major cogs in that machine, too. One guy who doesn't get the props on that line, who should, is the other guard, Anthony Herrera. He's having a very good season for the Vikes, who have finally found that missing piece to go w/ Birk and Hutch that they couldn't get from guys like Artis Hicks. A guy you should watch and you'll like on that line is the RT, Ryan Cook. If you're a fan of Trueblood, and I know you are, you'll like the way he plays. Sure. Another guy that we passed up in the 06 draft. Thanks for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Rich Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 Sure. Another guy that we passed up in the 06 draft. Thanks for that. And, to think, he's the player the Vikes got in the Culpepper deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RLflutie7 Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 He was the best athlete coming out of college in '06. Freakish strength and speed for a big man. The boards loved him. Oh if only he was still on the board when the Bills picked 8th, they all said. Every mock draft had him in the top 5. The 49ers bit, and drafted him with the number 6 pick of the draft. What's he done so far to deserve that draft position? He's averaged bout 30 catches and 3 TD's. a year in almost 3 full seasons. The Bills almost get that much out of Royal. But take a look at these offensive linemen that were drafted after Davis in the first two rounds in '06: #23- Davin Joseph-G Starts for the Bucs. #29- Nick Mangold-C Starts for the Jets. #50- Marcus McNeill-LT Starts for the Chargers. #55- Andrew Whitworth-LG Starts for the Bengals. #59- Jeremy Trueblood-RT Starts for the Bucs. My point is very simple. Offensive linemen that get drafted in the first two rounds usually end up starting in the NFL. Buffalo has ignored the offensive line in the first two rounds since they struck out with Mike Williams in 2002. This franchise needs to build a new foundation. Three of the four best centers could all still be on the board when the Bills draft in the second round. If they ignore them, and draft the hot-shot tight end or another position, no way will the other three best centers still be there when the Bills' third round pick comes along. You see that is the key. Draft your offensive linemen in the first two rounds, and he will most likely start very quickly and be an impact player for you within a year or two. The days of taking a tight end or wide receiver with a #1 pick are over. Last years draft was a sign of the times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingfish Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 We need a TE, a Pass Rusher, and a C. Whatever order we get them in I don't really care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted December 19, 2008 Share Posted December 19, 2008 You're right, the difference between a two time Pro Bowler at the game's most important position and his 40 year old backup is tiny. Nice strawman. You don't even realize you're proving my point. And in 2004 the 4-12 Dolphins beat the eventual Super Bowl champion New England Patriots. Which is an example of what, exactly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertpaul49 Posted December 19, 2008 Share Posted December 19, 2008 The Bills definitely have more talent then they did a couple of years ago. However, I have to agree with Wilson that they aren't that talented yet. The first priority this off-season has got to be to get a decent backup quarterback. I don't think JP is going to take another snap. They also have to get pressure on the quarterback. The offensive line is definitely better. They could probably use a better center, but if Lynch had run like he did against the Jets, the Bills would have won more games. Also, JP held onto the Ball way too long. It was really frustrating to watch. He's been playing too long. A tight end would be nice, but I think they still need a better option as a second wide receiver. After getting a decent backup quarterback, the Bills need to get a more talented defensive end. Lastly, the Bills are going in the right direction. I just feel that the rest of the division suddenly has gotten a lot tougher, mostly through free-agency. Tom Donahue set this team back a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRC Posted December 19, 2008 Share Posted December 19, 2008 Hmm....I could dig up the stats, but I'll guess that Minny's O line, while they've done a great job of leading the way for Peterson, hasn't limited sacks to as few as 8 all year. Maybe they have, but I'd be surprised if that's so. 38 sacks allowed. LT Bryant McKinnie (1st-2002) LG Steve Hutchinson (1st-2001) C Matt Birk (6th-1998) RG Anthony Herrera (Not Drafted) RT Ryan Cook (2nd-2006) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted December 19, 2008 Share Posted December 19, 2008 38 sacks allowed. LT Bryant McKinnie (1st-2002) LG Steve Hutchinson (1st-2001) C Matt Birk (6th-1998) RG Anthony Herrera (Not Drafted) RT Ryan Cook (2nd-2006) Maybe the Vikings need to throw more 24 inch passes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lilannie Posted December 20, 2008 Share Posted December 20, 2008 Ah, so Tony Romo is the talent difference between the Cowboys beating the Rams or losing by 3 TDs? I had no idea he was that awesome. At the times the Rams beat the Washington, the 'Skins were coming off wins over Arizona, Dallas, Philadelphia, and New Orleans and their only loss was opening week at the New York Giants. But thanks for showing what a simpleton you are with that vain attempt. This is almost as stupid as when you said this- You left off: Adam Carriker -- 13th pick in the first round Dan "Super Bowl Ring" Kreider Ty Hill -- 15th pick in the first round Will Witherspoon -- Led Rams in tackles in SB versus NE. Jacob Bell -- All Rookie team with the Titans Drew Bennett -- Led the Titans in receiving yards for 3 straight season. It's not a talent issue and pretty soon it won't be a Linehan/Ziggy issue, either. The Rams have a losing culture that was turned around for one very short period in their history. Linehan brought it right back. And what exactly has all that crazy talent accomplished since beating Brad Johnson's Cowboys? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobobonators Posted December 20, 2008 Share Posted December 20, 2008 He was the best athlete coming out of college in '06. Freakish strength and speed for a big man. The boards loved him. Oh if only he was still on the board when the Bills picked 8th, they all said. Every mock draft had him in the top 5. The 49ers bit, and drafted him with the number 6 pick of the draft. What's he done so far to deserve that draft position? He's averaged bout 30 catches and 3 TD's. a year in almost 3 full seasons. The Bills almost get that much out of Royal. But take a look at these offensive linemen that were drafted after Davis in the first two rounds in '06: #23- Davin Joseph-G Starts for the Bucs. #29- Nick Mangold-C Starts for the Jets. #50- Marcus McNeill-LT Starts for the Chargers. #55- Andrew Whitworth-LG Starts for the Bengals. #59- Jeremy Trueblood-RT Starts for the Bucs. My point is very simple. Offensive linemen that get drafted in the first two rounds usually end up starting in the NFL. Buffalo has ignored the offensive line in the first two rounds since they struck out with Mike Williams in 2002. This franchise needs to build a new foundation. Three of the four best centers could all still be on the board when the Bills draft in the second round. If they ignore them, and draft the hot-shot tight end or another position, no way will the other three best centers still be there when the Bills' third round pick comes along. You see that is the key. Draft your offensive linemen in the first two rounds, and he will most likely start very quickly and be an impact player for you within a year or two. How many of the pats' o-lineman were drafted in the 1st round? Giants? And as for your quote above, you can substitute any position into that sentence. Because almost ANY players that get drafted first two rounds "usually end up starting in the NFL." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted December 20, 2008 Share Posted December 20, 2008 He was the best athlete coming out of college in '06. Freakish strength and speed for a big man. The boards loved him. Oh if only he was still on the board when the Bills picked 8th, they all said. Every mock draft had him in the top 5. The 49ers bit, and drafted him with the number 6 pick of the draft. What's he done so far to deserve that draft position? He's averaged bout 30 catches and 3 TD's. a year in almost 3 full seasons. The Bills almost get that much out of Royal. But take a look at these offensive linemen that were drafted after Davis in the first two rounds in '06: #23- Davin Joseph-G Starts for the Bucs. #29- Nick Mangold-C Starts for the Jets. #50- Marcus McNeill-LT Starts for the Chargers. #55- Andrew Whitworth-LG Starts for the Bengals. #59- Jeremy Trueblood-RT Starts for the Bucs. My point is very simple. Offensive linemen that get drafted in the first two rounds usually end up starting in the NFL. Buffalo has ignored the offensive line in the first two rounds since they struck out with Mike Williams in 2002. This franchise needs to build a new foundation. Three of the four best centers could all still be on the board when the Bills draft in the second round. If they ignore them, and draft the hot-shot tight end or another position, no way will the other three best centers still be there when the Bills' third round pick comes along. You see that is the key. Draft your offensive linemen in the first two rounds, and he will most likely start very quickly and be an impact player for you within a year or two. The Bills have long needed a TE, but I agree they badly need to focus on their lines. Despite the struggles, a lot of people think the Bills OL is good enough, will get better, etc.. Some may even see the improved running game of late and unrealistically expect that to carry over. It won't, we've seen the same thing many times before. The damning factor is their lack of athleticism. Having the biggest and tallest OL would have been great 15 years ago. Perhaps Marv hasn't watched much football since then. Nowadays defenses are quicker and athleticism is a better fit in both pass protection and the run game. Ideally, you're both big AND athletic(translate:first day picks), but Walker, Dockery and Preston are not and it's hard for the offense to get any rhythm going when they are not getting into blocks quickly and allowing the defense to be disruptive and dictate tempo. Side note, I'm watching Steve Farichild's OL at Colorado State whip Fresno's defense using counters and other athletic blocking schemes. His offense at CSU looks more like a pro offense than the one he ran in Buffalo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VJ91 Posted December 20, 2008 Author Share Posted December 20, 2008 How many of the pats' o-lineman were drafted in the 1st round? Giants?And as for your quote above, you can substitute any position into that sentence. Because almost ANY players that get drafted first two rounds "usually end up starting in the NFL." Patriots: (1) Logan Mankins, Giants: (0), first round draft picks. I never said every team had first or second round draft picks on their O-Lines. I said the Buffalo Bills have ignored their offensive line for years in the first two rounds, and since they obviously don't have the luck or talent evaluators that the Pats and Giants must have, they should draft their center in the first two rounds this season! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted December 20, 2008 Share Posted December 20, 2008 Side note, I'm watching Steve Farichild's OL at Colorado State whip Fresno's defense using counters and other athletic blocking schemes. His offense at CSU looks more like a pro offense than the one he ran in Buffalo. Yep. Obviously, Fairchild was the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted December 20, 2008 Share Posted December 20, 2008 Side note, I'm watching Steve Farichild's OL at Colorado State whip Fresno's defense using counters and other athletic blocking schemes. His offense at CSU looks more like a pro offense than the one he ran in Buffalo. Talent level and intelligence to run the offense probably play into as well. Do Peters, Lynch and Losman come across to you as the sharpest tools in the shed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibs Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 .....My point is very simple. Offensive linemen that get drafted in the first two rounds usually end up starting in the NFL....... This is a bit ambiguous & not true. I have had a good look at 1st round OL selections & it is fair to say that 1st round interior OLmen have the lowest bust rate out of any position.......in recent times every single 1st round OG & C has minimally developed into a quality NFL starter. I think one can safely assume that the 2nd round bust rate for interior OLmen would also be lower than most other positions(I will probably have a look at the 2nd round when I get some extra time after Christmas). The story is different with OTs. 1st round OTs are far more hit & miss(like most positions). Since we are looking at drafting an interior OLman and not an OT, I think your premise that we should draft one within the first two rounds holds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
/dev/null Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 Yep. Obviously, Schonert, Fairchild, Clements, Killdrive, Sheppard, ... waswere the problem. Corrected Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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