SilverNRed Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 A couple weeks ago, the Buffalo Planning Board got to see the plans for the new 600 foot, 40-story tower that Bashar Issa wants to build downtown (tentatively called the Buffalo City Tower). Plans for the tower are probably the most exciting thing to happen to downtown Buffalo in decades. The artist renderings are pretty amazing. Unfortunately, at least one member of our planning board is a complete retard. Business First For the most part, members of the planning board welcomed the concept, although one, Susan Curran Hoyt, questioned whether at 40 stories and nearly 600-feet, if the project could be scaled back by 100 feet. "It is pretty much out of scale with everything else in the city," Curran Hoyt said. Warren said BSC Development deliberately wanted the building to make a statement. "Could it be lower? It could be," he said. "But, one of our goals was to make it the tallest and make it a landmark." Sica said once Issa and his investors have enough committed interest, the building will take about four years to complete, beginning with the final design until the first tenant moves into the structure. As for the size and magnitude of the project, another planning board member embraced Issa's vision. "We can't be a five-story building downtown for the rest of our lives," said Cynthia Schwartz. "We are way behind many of our colleagues." Can we please throw Susan Curran Hoyt into Lake Erie? Maybe over Niagara Falls? This friggin' woman must be the Mike Mularkey of urban planning. "First and goal on the 1? Let's punt! They'll never see it coming." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5 Wide Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 I had seen the first rumblings of this project through the emporis site. It would be a tremendous addition to the skyline and a catalyst for further downtown investment. If this project could come to fruition (it's led by an eager, dynamic young foreign businessman) then it would be a great addition. The new health now corporate headquarters is a good step for downtown, this would be a good leap for downtown. As for the size and magnitude of the project, another planning board member embraced Issa's vision. "We can't be a five-story building downtown for the rest of our lives," said Cynthia Schwartz. "We are way behind many of our colleagues." I heart Cynthia Schwartz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apuszczalowski Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 Unfortunately, at least one member of our planning board is a complete retard. Business First Can we please throw Susan Curran Hoyt into Lake Erie? Maybe over Niagara Falls? This friggin' woman must be the Mike Mularkey of urban planning. "First and goal on the 1? Let's punt! They'll never see it coming." Say what you will about her, but she does make a bit of a point, it would look really out of place in the Buffalo skyline having such a massive building amoung a bunch of smaller ones. Shes not talking about getting rid of the idea, just scaling it back a little to fit in a bit better. If there where plans for other large towers around this one, then keeping it that size would make sense Its going to look so out of place having this huge tower near Bass Pro blocking other peoples view of the new twin span peace bridge and Beautiful new Indian Casino and Waterfront. Maybe a new Ralph Wilson Stadium will make it look better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerme1 Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 Everything looks out of place until something is built around it. In Toronto for example, Skydome. The CN Tower is kind of taller than anything around it also. I have heard some disgruntlend Cimmineli type mention that it doesn't make sense to build more class A office space when there is still some available here. I don't think Benderson heard that comment though or we surely would have 9,000 strip malls with class A office space waiting to be finished for years. Obviously I have no problem with the height. And I personally think it looks great with the Federal Courthouse in front of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 Say what you will about her, but she does make a bit of a point, it would look really out of place in the Buffalo skyline having such a massive building amoung a bunch of smaller ones. Shes not talking about getting rid of the idea, just scaling it back a little to fit in a bit better. If there where plans for other large towers around this one, then keeping it that size would make sense Its going to look so out of place having this huge tower near Bass Pro blocking other peoples view of the new twin span peace bridge and Beautiful new Indian Casino and Waterfront. Maybe a new Ralph Wilson Stadium will make it look better? Yeah, I always thought the World Trade Center and Sears Tower and Space Needle should be about 100' shorter so they didnt dwarf the skyline and buildings around them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5 Wide Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 Say what you will about her, but she does make a bit of a point, it would look really out of place in the Buffalo skyline having such a massive building amoung a bunch of smaller ones. Shes not talking about getting rid of the idea, just scaling it back a little to fit in a bit better. If there where plans for other large towers around this one, then keeping it that size would make sense Its going to look so out of place having this huge tower near Bass Pro blocking other peoples view of the new twin span peace bridge and Beautiful new Indian Casino and Waterfront. Maybe a new Ralph Wilson Stadium will make it look better? The HSBC tower is 529 feet, this would be 70 feet higher. Currently, the next tallest building in Buffalo is City hall at 378 feet. That puts the HSBC Tower at 151 feet taller than the next tallest building, does it look out of place? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marv's Neighbor Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 Go figure why an area that loves taxes would ever do anything to question/discourage significant development that would generate a whole lot of TAXES! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apuszczalowski Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 Yeah, I always thought the World Trade Center and Sears Tower and Space Needle should be about 100' shorter so they didnt dwarf the skyline and buildings around them. but they are built in areas where the skyline is filled with tall buildings so building taller ones doesn't look out of place. Buffalo has one Tall Building (HSBC building at 529' and the next tallest is the City Hall at 378' as pointed out earlier) I was just in Chicago this summer and was at the Sears Tower and took many pictures of the Skyline, and it does not look out of place because there are many other tall building around it that make the Building fit in. It would only work if Buffalo had plans for more tall buildings in the future. But so far, this is all that is lined up. Take for example Niagara falls. The New Casino built a large Hotel that would look out of place if it wasn't for the other hotels building up around it. Now it looks like it belongs. As for the Space needle,or the CN tower, those are tourist attracions that are supposed to be huge and stick out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marv's Neighbor Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 but they are built in areas where the skyline is filled with tall buildings so building taller ones doesn't look out of place. Buffalo has one Tall Building (HSBC building at 529' and the next tallest is the City Hall at 378' as pointed out earlier) I was just in Chicago this summer and was at the Sears Tower and took many pictures of the Skyline, and it does not look out of place because there are many other tall building around it that make the Building fit in. It would only work if Buffalo had plans for more tall buildings in the future. But so far, this is all that is lined up. Take for example Niagara falls. The New Casino built a large Hotel that would look out of place if it wasn't for the other hotels building up around it. Now it looks like it belongs. As for the Space needle,or the CN tower, those are tourist attracions that are supposed to be huge and stick out The Space Needle was built in 1961 as a centerpiece of the Seattle world's fair. There were no other "tall" buildings in the skyline. I have pictures of the "Seagram" tower at Niagara Falls and that was ALL that was on the Canadian side of the Falls. That was over 45 years ago! You have to start somewhere. I can't believe how excited people were about BASS PRO and then question a legitimate idea/proposal on this project. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 It would be a good place to re-install the Dancing Dogbones... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5 Wide Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 Just look at Milwaukee. Their tallest building is almost the identical height of what this proposed tower is. The next tallest building is close to the hsbc tower. After that, you have a bunch of buildings close to that of Buffalo. Just look at their skyline. It doesn't look disproportioned at all. http://www.roofingdesign.com/images/Milwaukee%20Skyline.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeFerguson Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 I was just in Chicago this summer and was at the Sears Tower and took many pictures of the Skyline, and it does not look out of place because there are many other tall building around it that make the Building fit in. Ok, so how is a city supposed to create its "tall-building filled" skyline, by building several equally tall buildings simultaneously? The person that's building it is a private developer with private money. I say let him build it as high as he wants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverNRed Posted January 18, 2007 Author Share Posted January 18, 2007 but they are built in areas where the skyline is filled with tall buildings so building taller ones doesn't look out of place. Buffalo has one Tall Building (HSBC building at 529' and the next tallest is the City Hall at 378' as pointed out earlier) I was just in Chicago this summer and was at the Sears Tower and took many pictures of the Skyline, and it does not look out of place because there are many other tall building around it that make the Building fit in. It would only work if Buffalo had plans for more tall buildings in the future. But so far, this is all that is lined up. Take for example Niagara falls. The New Casino built a large Hotel that would look out of place if it wasn't for the other hotels building up around it. Now it looks like it belongs. As for the Space needle,or the CN tower, those are tourist attracions that are supposed to be huge and stick out I don't know if this is too obvious, but the only way for Buffalo to ever become a city with skyscrapers is to build skyscrapers. And with Buffalo's population and economy, holding out until there are plans to build 3 or 4 of these towers at once is completely unrealistic. This tower won't be the CN tower or the Space Needle, but it is going to be a landmark and the building people remember when they visit our city. Scaling it down is the worst possible idea. We should be scaling it up, and thanking our lucky stars that someone wants to invest in our city this way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5 Wide Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 In order for the city and economy to improve you need to lure in companies. You don't lure companies without infrastructure. You don't re-invent a rust belt city by building more status quo buildings. There is real opportunity here to increase the critical mass of downtown. Investment spurs more investment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apuszczalowski Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 I don't know if this is too obvious, but the only way for Buffalo to ever become a city with skyscrapers is to build skyscrapers. And with Buffalo's population and economy, holding out until there are plans to build 3 or 4 of these towers at once is completely unrealistic. This tower won't be the CN tower or the Space Needle, but it is going to be a landmark and the building people remember when they visit our city. Scaling it down is the worst possible idea. We should be scaling it up, and thanking our lucky stars that someone wants to invest in our city this way. I know they have to start somewhere, but it all deepends what else is being lined up, and if there are future plans to build up the skyline. They can always build onto this building at a future date while other towers are being built. Thats what is happening in Niagara Falls right now (i'm talking the Canadian side) The Fallsview Casino Hotel was built and other building around it added on. The problem with it being a building that people visit when they come to the city, like the sears tower, empire state building, Trade Centre, etc. is that it has to be unique and different compared to other cities. The Empire state building, Trade Centre Towers, and Sears Tower are/were some of the Largest Towers in North America, and the World, this is not going to compare to them. Sure some tourists will visit it, but its not unique enough to be an attraction that will draw people to the City. its a great thing for the City and I am not against the building, I'm just saying I see the womans points when she says it should be scaled down a bit (maybe not as much as she says though (+/- 50' instead of 100'?) I just don't see this happening anytime soon, and they will probably be breaking ground as soon as Bass Pro and the New Casino do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 I know they have to start somewhere, but it all deepends what else is being lined up, and if there are future plans to build up the skyline. They can always build onto this building at a future date while other towers are being built. Thats what is happening in Niagara Falls right now (i'm talking the Canadian side) The Fallsview Casino Hotel was built and other building around it added on. The problem with it being a building that people visit when they come to the city, like the sears tower, empire state building, Trade Centre, etc. is that it has to be unique and different compared to other cities. The Empire state building, Trade Centre Towers, and Sears Tower are/were some of the Largest Towers in North America, and the World, this is not going to compare to them. Sure some tourists will visit it, but its not unique enough to be an attraction that will draw people to the City. its a great thing for the City and I am not against the building, I'm just saying I see the womans points when she says it should be scaled down a bit (maybe not as much as she says though (+/- 50' instead of 100'?) I just don't see this happening anytime soon, and they will probably be breaking ground as soon as Bass Pro and the New Casino do. Have you seen the artist's drawing of this thing? Have you seen the tall buildings in Buffalo? You WANT this baby to be the only thing seen, it looks awesome. It looks like a real 21st century building. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apuszczalowski Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 nope, only seen the renderings of the Casino Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverNRed Posted January 18, 2007 Author Share Posted January 18, 2007 I just don't see this happening anytime soon, and they will probably be breaking ground as soon as Bass Pro and the New Casino do. The Seneca Buffalo casino broke ground months ago. They work on it every day over there. I'm sure it will be providing crappy jobs and diverting money away from the Bills, Sabres, and every other local business in no time. Everything about Bass Pro is a complete disaster but that won't stop our local leaders (thanks again for voting, WNY) from doing everything they can to bend over for them. Back to the tower: In order for the city and economy to improve you need to lure in companies. You don't lure companies without infrastructure. You don't re-invent a rust belt city by building more status quo buildings. There is real opportunity here to increase the critical mass of downtown. Investment spurs more investment.Exactly. Invest in the city so that companies will actually want to put an office downtown or relocate some people here. We need to clean this city up and bring it into the 21st century in a big way. People from Buffalo think it's nice but everyone else sees a city full of old, empty buildings, a skyway, and a giant, abandoned hockey arena on the waterfront. It's a wreck. And, as Kelly pointed out, this tower is beautiful. It's not as tall as the Sears Tower or WTC but it's better looking by far. I wish it was going to be 700 ft. instead of 593 ft. I want it to stick out more. Buffalo is never going to be a tourist hub in my lifetime but I'd like people who visit to go home and tell others "Buffalo is pretty nice. They have a giant glass building downtown that looks like a waterfall." They might have something to talk about besides the sucky football team or the weather. Lastly, the planning board did give approval to the building (first of many steps): Business First This did not stop Susan Curran Hoyt (AKA Susan the Dumbass) from once again saying she wants it shorter (although now she says 75' shorter for some reason). If everything goes smoothly ( ) it could be done by 2011. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverNRed Posted January 18, 2007 Author Share Posted January 18, 2007 Here are two links with images of the tower: Buffalo Rising 1 Buffalo Rising 2 One more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yall Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 You have to start somewhere. I can't believe how excited people were about BASS PRO and then question a legitimate idea/proposal on this project. Tall buildings, NO! Bait shop, YES! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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