Crap Throwing Monkey Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 Disagree. God allows us our way, with consequences. Don't go getting secular about it. 333141[/snapback] But you said it was the "liberalization of society" that has made this commonplace. Now, near as I can tell, you're saying it's strictly a result of an individual exercising his free will. Which is it, a societal or individual problem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frez Posted May 10, 2005 Author Share Posted May 10, 2005 And you'll be a happier man for doing so. Good job! Now take a class and learn how to ride it right. 333098[/snapback] Take a class? I have been riding since I was five years old. I started out on a Honda Z-50. I received my motorcycle license when I was 16. Maybe I should give you a lesson or two? Honda Z-50 gear ratio = 3 down! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 But you said it was the "liberalization of society" that has made this commonplace. Now, near as I can tell, you're saying it's strictly a result of an individual exercising his free will. Which is it, a societal or individual problem? 333146[/snapback] A society is a collection of individuals that express a mostly common pattern of behavior. The actions of a society are what the individuals do or do not tolerate from other members. It is a changing thing, but is the creation and result of a preponderance of the preferences of the individuals. That's my theory - thousands have been put forth by folks both smarter and dumber than I. You can add your own. - I'm not going to be drawn in to a typing battle on this subject - so don't try. In our case here, the intervention of laws that champion the individual above the common goals of society has caused a disturbance, to the point that one or two anti-social people can defacate over all the rest. Don't accuse me of mind control here (I leave that to the popular media and to advertisers) - I'll accept paranoia, however - some wit once said that these days, people who aren't paranoid aren't thinking right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMadCap Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 But you said it was the "liberalization of society" that has made this commonplace. Now, near as I can tell, you're saying it's strictly a result of an individual exercising his free will. Which is it, a societal or individual problem? 333146[/snapback] I think it more likely that this type of thing has always been happening, and the media is just getting better at reporting it, we hear about it more often these days, hence, we become more desensitized to it.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 Take a class? I have been riding since I was five years old. I started out on a Honda Z-50. I received my motorcycle license when I was 16. Maybe I should give you a lesson or two? Honda Z-50 gear ratio = 3 down! 333152[/snapback] I've ridden with alot of people who have experience. Virtually everyone of them finds out how many bad habits they've gotten from taking either or both ABATE classes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 How can anyone do this? 333090[/snapback] I see you've convicted him already. I mean the police accused him so he MUST be guilty! I get nervous when police charge the people who notify them about a crime. It's true most murders are committed by people who the victims know, but it strikes me as too convenient that it's always the person reporting the crime who becomes a suspect. Especially in the case of this Hobbs guy, who apparently just got out of jail for assault. Keep in mind Mr. Runaway Bride, the guy who notified the police of his missing fiance, became the #1 suspect in her disappearance! I'm not saying this Hobbs guy didn't do it. He may well be a monster. But how sad would it be if he DIDN'T do it and gets convicted? He loses his kids and gets put to death for a crime he didn't commit. PTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 We have gone from the murder of innocents to motorcycle lessons. Short Attention Span Threater has nothing on TSW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frez Posted May 11, 2005 Author Share Posted May 11, 2005 I see you've convicted him already. I mean the police accused him so he MUST be guilty! I get nervous when police charge the people who notify them about a crime. It's true most murders are committed by people who the victims know, but it strikes me as too convenient that it's always the person reporting the crime who becomes a suspect. Especially in the case of this Hobbs guy, who apparently just got out of jail for assault. Keep in mind Mr. Runaway Bride, the guy who notified the police of his missing fiance, became the #1 suspect in her disappearance! I'm not saying this Hobbs guy didn't do it. He may well be a monster. But how sad would it be if he DIDN'T do it and gets convicted? He loses his kids and gets put to death for a crime he didn't commit. PTR 333170[/snapback] I'll bet the police have overwhelming evidence on this scumbag. I underrstand your point but I'm betting they have the right guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renfruzetz Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 but since we have <a brain>, the liberalization and relaxation of societal morality in the past 40 years or so that have <changed>people's beliefs, what was once un<mentionable> has now become commonplace. The chickens are coming home to roost... 333136[/snapback] This kind of thing happens everyday. 40 years ago you couldn't read about it on the internet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 This kind of thing happens everyday. 40 years ago you couldn't read about it on the internet. 333197[/snapback] It does now. I understand your point, which I assume is faster and more widespread communication. However, 40 years ago, if such things were commonplace it would not have possible to bury it. The press was just as hungry for a story then as now. One thing, these days, is that a good number of folks have little or no knowledge of how things were. - time marches on, the young replace the old. To many, crudity, confrontation, mistrust, etc. are simply components of what they grew up with. I was born in the early fifties. Here is a list of some things that were not prevalent then: security cameras anti-theft packaging carjacking kidnapping divorce obscene phone calls the studying of martial arts unlisted phone numbers school killings (even though we boys invariably carried jack knives to school with us) locked doors credit cards incessant screams about "my rights" snotty store clerks drugs vicious dogs in residential neighborhoods obscenities on radio and tv gratuitous blood and gore on tv children insulting strangers grade inflation in school workplace shootings and killings. I could go on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fezmid Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 I was born in the early fifties. Here is a list of some things that were not prevalent then: I'm going to disagree with a lot of these... Re: Divorce Probably true; however, lots of people in unhappy mariages but not leaving because of the stigma. Re: obscene phone calls Didn't realize this was prevalent now... I've never gotten one. school killings (even though we boys invariably carried jack knives to school with us) Again, it's not exactly prevalent now either, just because it's happened a handful of times in the past 10 years. credit cards And this is a bad thing...? incessant screams about "my rights" Right... Nobody ever cried about the rights of blacks... Or women... Nope, none of that. drugs Could've fooled me. From what I hear, the 60s and 70s were pretty drug-filled. Maybe not crack and meth, but still. icious dogs in residential neighborhoods Again, prevalent now? All I see in my neighborhood are dogs that are about as big as my cats... workplace shootings and killings. Again, how prevelant is this? A handful of occurances does not mean it's prevalent. However, 40 years ago, if such things were commonplace it would not have possible to bury it. The press was just as hungry for a story then as now. 40 years ago, we would never have heard of 99.999% of the things happening in Iraq or Afganastan. We would not have heard about the school masacre in Russia by the Czhekyans (sp?). We wouldn't have heard about the North Korean nuclear testing (heck, the US in general probably wouldn't have even known it was going on). And that doesn't even include the stories that happen domestically. Not a flame, but I'm still trying to see your point on some of these... CW EDIT: Apparantly you can only have so many quotes in a post (10). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 I'm going to disagree with a lot of these... Re: Divorce Probably true; however, lots of people in unhappy mariages but not leaving because of the stigma. Re: obscene phone calls Didn't realize this was prevalent now... I've never gotten one. school killings (even though we boys invariably carried jack knives to school with us) Again, it's not exactly prevalent now either, just because it's happened a handful of times in the past 10 years. And this is a bad thing...? Right... Nobody ever cried about the rights of blacks... Or women... Nope, none of that. Could've fooled me. From what I hear, the 60s and 70s were pretty drug-filled. Maybe not crack and meth, but still. Again, prevalent now? All I see in my neighborhood are dogs that are about as big as my cats... Again, how prevelant is this? A handful of occurances does not mean it's prevalent. 40 years ago, we would never have heard of 99.999% of the things happening in Iraq or Afganastan. We would not have heard about the school masacre in Russia by the Czhekyans (sp?). We wouldn't have heard about the North Korean nuclear testing (heck, the US in general probably wouldn't have even known it was going on). And that doesn't even include the stories that happen domestically. Not a flame, but I'm still trying to see your point... CW EDIT: Apparantly you can only have so many quotes in a post (10). 333209[/snapback] Wow, that WAS a lot of work! Why do parents fret about their kids playing outside these days, let alone about being out after dark? Why is it if you tried to help a lost or crying child these days, the SWAT team mayl be called out? Things have changed, CW. Years ago, folks attending football games never would say or do the cruelties that occur now. Back in the "good ol' days", people deported themselves better in general society - if only because if word got back to their friends, they would be ostrasized and if word got back to their employer, they would be fired. Today, we are all so precious. If our electric power goes out for 1 hour, it's a catastrophe of the first order. We go and double-check our door locks. After a couple of thousand years of people agreeing that 2 parents are what's needed, we now feel in our arrogance that one will do, and chuckle at such anachronisms as "for better or for worse, in sickness or in health". My sun is setting. It is your world now - I enter into no debate about that; I only wish to impart that when I grew up, general tranquility was the rule rather than the exception. We didn't demand endless proofs like today from 3rd party sources (reliable or not) about every single aspect and problem and situation. We had a trust amongst us. I miss that - how could I not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMadCap Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 My sun is setting. It is your world now - I enter into no debate about that; I only wish to impart that when I grew up, general tranquility was the rule rather than the exception. We didn't demand endless proofs like today from 3rd party sources (reliable or not) about every single aspect and problem and situation. We had a trust amongst us. I miss that - how could I not? 333216[/snapback] All great empires must fall, ususally by erosion from the inside. Our society is likely no different... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 All great empires must fall, ususally by erosion from the inside. Our society is likely no different... 333223[/snapback] Yes, I suppose that is so. But one must hope. I really have more confidence in this generation than my (sometimes or oftimes, your pick) maudlin words say. But I admit to a certain enjoyment in knocking young folk's opinions about a bit - builds character. That's what old men are for, ya know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fezmid Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 My sun is setting. It is your world now - I enter into no debate about that; I only wish to impart that when I grew up, general tranquility was the rule rather than the exception. We didn't demand endless proofs like today from 3rd party sources (reliable or not) about every single aspect and problem and situation. We had a trust amongst us Old people ( ) have been saying that for years. "Back when I was a kid, everything was great!" Watch some old reruns of "All in the Family" and you'll see it there as well. The show as taped in the 70s, and Mike (aka "Meathead,") says on multiple occasions, "This world sucks, there's so much polution, hatrid, etc, etc, that I don't want to bring a child into this world!" The show also had main characters raped, mugged, beaten, etc. It showed the times. Bad things have always happened, and I don't think they're really that much worse than they were before. CW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crap Throwing Monkey Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 It does now. I understand your point, which I assume is faster and more widespread communication. However, 40 years ago, if such things were commonplace it would not have possible to bury it. The press was just as hungry for a story then as now. One thing, these days, is that a good number of folks have little or no knowledge of how things were. - time marches on, the young replace the old. To many, crudity, confrontation, mistrust, etc. are simply components of what they grew up with. I was born in the early fifties. Here is a list of some things that were not prevalent then: security cameras anti-theft packaging carjacking kidnapping divorce obscene phone calls the studying of martial arts unlisted phone numbers school killings (even though we boys invariably carried jack knives to school with us) locked doors credit cards incessant screams about "my rights" snotty store clerks drugs vicious dogs in residential neighborhoods obscenities on radio and tv gratuitous blood and gore on tv children insulting strangers grade inflation in school workplace shootings and killings. I could go on. 333203[/snapback] Actually, the incidence of quite a few of those has been relatively constant since the '30s (drug use, vicious dogs, rude children, even school killings and workplace shootings). The prevalence of media coverage was vastly different, however. For the most part, though, there's always been sick and stupid people willing to do sick and stupid things... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 Old people ( ) have been saying that for years. "Back when I was a kid, everything was great!" Watch some old reruns of "All in the Family" and you'll see it there as well. The show as taped in the 70s, and Mike (aka "Meathead,") says on multiple occasions, "This world sucks, there's so much polution, hatrid, etc, etc, that I don't want to bring a child into this world!" The show also had main characters raped, mugged, beaten, etc. It showed the times. Bad things have always happened, and I don't think they're really that much worse than they were before.CW 333242[/snapback] CW, sometimes I dispair of you. I have it on good authority that you are a decent sort. But please realize that the time comes in human endeavor to understand that opinions differ, and that there is little to be gained by insisting that your view is the only one out there. End of lecture. Being disputatious is not an endearing trait, and in practical terms, it doesn't get you invited to parties. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan in San Diego Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 Some bleedin heart Canadian Liberal let him out early just to commit more crime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polar Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 This guy is a parasite. Cant be human when something like this happens. May he be destined for hell. God Bless those 2 little girls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 It does now. I understand your point, which I assume is faster and more widespread communication. However, 40 years ago, if such things were commonplace it would not have possible to bury it. The press was just as hungry for a story then as now. One thing, these days, is that a good number of folks have little or no knowledge of how things were. - time marches on, the young replace the old. To many, crudity, confrontation, mistrust, etc. are simply components of what they grew up with. I was born in the early fifties. Here is a list of some things that were not prevalent then: security cameras anti-theft packaging carjacking kidnapping divorce obscene phone calls the studying of martial arts unlisted phone numbers school killings (even though we boys invariably carried jack knives to school with us) locked doors credit cards incessant screams about "my rights" snotty store clerks drugs vicious dogs in residential neighborhoods obscenities on radio and tv gratuitous blood and gore on tv children insulting strangers grade inflation in school workplace shootings and killings. I could go on. 333203[/snapback] Things that did go on in the early 1950's: Emmitt Till gets murdered for looking at a white woman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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