dorquemada Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 modnote: I did a cursory review of open topics and didn't see this specific thing being discussed. If I missed it, please delete this or merge it. Thanks I had a thought after watching the tape on the pats game. Is this team actually worse from a holistic perspective, with MD back in the lineup? He's obviously a super talented guy, and earned his big paycheck, but it just seems like the front 7 isn't playing nearly as well with him back in there, and for that matter, since he started practicing again after his suspension. I want to state that I'm a fan of his and want nothing more than for him to succeed within the context of Bills success. I went to Alabama, and cheered when the Bills took him, so this isn't some kind of agenda against him. As we observed earlier this season, before the bills reverted back to form the last 2 weeks, Rex can piece together a good to great D with mostly midrange players, with some right out of the parts bin. It seems counter-intuitive that adding MD into the mix would lower overall performance, but that's been directly observed, so either there are confounding variables that are causing the Bills D to be worse, or something about MD's presence is causing the decline in play. Realizing that we don't have much of a body of evidence to work with at this point, it'll be interesting to see over the next few weeks which Bills D shows up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 (edited) Actually I thought the DL looked very good with him back in there and he made a huge difference vs the run. DL not the problem and I see it as a strength going forward. The front 7 played well with him back, IMO. Did you not think they played well? Edited November 1, 2016 by YoloinOhio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jms62 Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 modnote: I did a cursory review of open topics and didn't see this specific thing being discussed. If I missed it, please delete this or merge it. Thanks I had a thought after watching the tape on the pats game. Is this team actually worse from a holistic perspective, with MD back in the lineup? He's obviously a super talented guy, and earned his big paycheck, but it just seems like the front 7 isn't playing nearly as well with him back in there, and for that matter, since he started practicing again after his suspension. I want to state that I'm a fan of his and want nothing more than for him to succeed within the context of Bills success. I went to Alabama, and cheered when the Bills took him, so this isn't some kind of agenda against him. As we observed earlier this season, before the bills reverted back to form the last 2 weeks, Rex can piece together a good to great D with mostly midrange players, with some right out of the parts bin. It seems counter-intuitive that adding MD into the mix would lower overall performance, but that's been directly observed, so either there are confounding variables that are causing the Bills D to be worse, or something about MD's presence is causing the decline in play. Realizing that we don't have much of a body of evidence to work with at this point, it'll be interesting to see over the next few weeks which Bills D shows up. I think we have to throw Sundays game out and look at this going forward. Miami game was the killer IMHO and Dareus should have helped stop the run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 modnote: I did a cursory review of open topics and didn't see this specific thing being discussed. If I missed it, please delete this or merge it. Thanks I had a thought after watching the tape on the pats game. Is this team actually worse from a holistic perspective, with MD back in the lineup? He's obviously a super talented guy, and earned his big paycheck, but it just seems like the front 7 isn't playing nearly as well with him back in there, and for that matter, since he started practicing again after his suspension. I want to state that I'm a fan of his and want nothing more than for him to succeed within the context of Bills success. I went to Alabama, and cheered when the Bills took him, so this isn't some kind of agenda against him. As we observed earlier this season, before the bills reverted back to form the last 2 weeks, Rex can piece together a good to great D with mostly midrange players, with some right out of the parts bin. It seems counter-intuitive that adding MD into the mix would lower overall performance, but that's been directly observed, so either there are confounding variables that are causing the Bills D to be worse, or something about MD's presence is causing the decline in play. Realizing that we don't have much of a body of evidence to work with at this point, it'll be interesting to see over the next few weeks which Bills D shows up. after 1 game? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 No way...the pass rush was very good on Sunday, as was the run defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 modnote: I did a cursory review of open topics and didn't see this specific thing being discussed. If I missed it, please delete this or merge it. Thanks I had a thought after watching the tape on the pats game. Is this team actually worse from a holistic perspective, with MD back in the lineup? He's obviously a super talented guy, and earned his big paycheck, but it just seems like the front 7 isn't playing nearly as well with him back in there, and for that matter, since he started practicing again after his suspension. I want to state that I'm a fan of his and want nothing more than for him to succeed within the context of Bills success. I went to Alabama, and cheered when the Bills took him, so this isn't some kind of agenda against him. As we observed earlier this season, before the bills reverted back to form the last 2 weeks, Rex can piece together a good to great D with mostly midrange players, with some right out of the parts bin. It seems counter-intuitive that adding MD into the mix would lower overall performance, but that's been directly observed, so either there are confounding variables that are causing the Bills D to be worse, or something about MD's presence is causing the decline in play. Realizing that we don't have much of a body of evidence to work with at this point, it'll be interesting to see over the next few weeks which Bills D shows up. Front seven had a very good game, actually. Not sure what you saw to suggest Dareus was an issue. Would have been nice to have him in there vs. Miami. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 No way...the pass rush was very good on Sunday, as was the run defense. The front seven as a whole was good on Sunday. The secondary play OTOH, was not up to the level that's needed to win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abc Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 Is it possible the opposing team had something to do with the defense allowing 41 points? They did stuff the run and sack the QB 5 times. Perhaps against a lesser team the defensive line will not be a problem. Besides, we all know the Bills issues stem from Tyrod Taylor's play. I've seen that in numerous other threads so it must be true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorquemada Posted November 1, 2016 Author Share Posted November 1, 2016 Front seven had a very good game, actually. Not sure what you saw to suggest Dareus was an issue. Would have been nice to have him in there vs. Miami. I'm not sure we can say anyone played "well" given the result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 (edited) I was actually going to start a thread about bright spots and talk about the front 7 with the addition of Shaq and Dareus and how good they looked vs Brady as compared to last year's game, and how it's one area of the team I'm pretty excited to watch the rest of the year. But I figured it would get trashed with negativity so I didn't. Hard to have positive threads after a loss, which I understand. Edited November 1, 2016 by YoloinOhio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Fong Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 Dude, they played the Patriots. I don't think you can draw any conclusions based on that game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorquemada Posted November 1, 2016 Author Share Posted November 1, 2016 Is it possible the opposing team had something to do with the defense allowing 41 points? They did stuff the run and sack the QB 5 times. Perhaps against a lesser team the defensive line will not be a problem. Besides, we all know the Bills issues stem from Tyrod Taylor's play. I've seen that in numerous other threads so it must be true. I'm trying to figure out what changed. Obviously playing the Pats is always going to be a problem for the Bills as long as brady is around, he's far too much man for them. I do a lot of work with statistics and will at some point start feeding data into an old model I built to predict games, once MD has been back for a few games and tweak it until something pops out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blokestradamus Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 I'm not sure we can say anyone played "well" given the result. 23 carries for 72 yards (including 15 to !@#$ing Brady!), five sacks, 10 total TFLs. I think it's safe to say the front seven did an outstanding job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 Front seven had a very good game, actually. Not sure what you saw to suggest Dareus was an issue. Would have been nice to have him in there vs. Miami. How his addition to the defense can be seen as anything other than a positive is simply beyond me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 I'm not sure we can say anyone played "well" given the result. Why not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorquemada Posted November 1, 2016 Author Share Posted November 1, 2016 Dude, they played the Patriots. I don't think you can draw any conclusions based on that game. Which I did point out. here's the thing, Seattle is a good team too. Do we ignore whatever data comes out of that game? When can we judge what's going on, only when the Bills play sub .500 teams? 41 points is the most the pats have scored on the bills since 2012, and the 4th most given up since 1990. I'll agree that the backfield was the real problem, but that doesn't mean the front 7 were effective, overall Why not? I guess im not as much a homer for the bills as I used to be because I see 41 points given up, and I'm not looking for bright spots, but see a systemic failure of the D. I'm sure glad they got 5 sacks though, looks good on the season ending stats sheet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 I guess im not as much a homer for the bills as I used to be because I see 41 points given up, and I'm not looking for bright spots, but see a systemic failure of the D. I'm sure glad they got 5 sacks though, looks good on the season ending stats sheet. Either that, or you believe in looking only at the box score and not the game. They hit Brady consistently, stuffed the run, and generally did their job. Brady made throws anyway, which is the fault of the secondary. This isn't that hard to understand. It's not homerism, it's diagnosis. If you can't recognize the problem, then you can't fix it (not that it's really our job to fix it, but hey, we like to know). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 (edited) Which I did point out. here's the thing, Seattle is a good team too. Do we ignore whatever data comes out of that game? When can we judge what's going on, only when the Bills play sub .500 teams? 41 points is the most the pats have scored on the bills since 2012, and the 4th most given up since 1990. I'll agree that the backfield was the real problem, but that doesn't mean the front 7 were effective, overall I guess im not as much a homer for the bills as I used to be because I see 41 points given up, and I'm not looking for bright spots, but see a systemic failure of the D. I'm sure glad they got 5 sacks though, looks good on the season ending stats sheet. it has nothing to do with being a "homer" but rather about evaluating the play of certain units. Do you also think that everyone obviously played "well" for the Pats, since they won and scored 41? I don't understand why, when asked to explain your position so I can try to understand it, you simply respond with the "homer" card meaning you have no interest in trying to understand mine. Enjoy your statistical analysis. It's near impossible to have a real back and forth discussion on this board about football sometimes. Edited November 1, 2016 by YoloinOhio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blokestradamus Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 it has nothing to do with being a "homer" but rather about evaluating the play of certain units. Do you also think that everyone obviously played "well" for the Pats, since they won and scored 41? Just from the broadcast, it sure looked like my boy Joe Thuney got taken to the wood shed a few times by Kyle. But 41 points, Joe was superb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 Just from the broadcast, it sure looked like my boy Joe Thuney got taken to the wood shed a few times by Kyle. But 41 points, Joe was superb. he wouldn't be the first rookie to be overwhelmed by Kyle. It's tough to overcome his quickness off the snap, strength and technique. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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