L.EvansHands Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 (edited) Just wanted to share this conversation between my brother and myself and let ya'll chime in on it. Brother to me: this is tough to read.. http://www.buffalone...two-bills-drive Me: I will reserve judgement until the year is over and see the stats. Also, a bit unfair to compare people receiving passes from Aaron Rodgers or anyone 150% better than the Orton and EJ combo. Besides if you think of it like this it isn't that hard to swallow: In the last twenty years the Bills have drafted total at the QB position 5 players, in ANY round of the draft. EJ Manuel JP Losman Levi Brown Trent Edwards Todd Collins Even when they do draft QBs they aren't smacking it out of the park here. So if they know of ANY player that is a sure thing, we might as well bundle two picks and do it. Of our first round picks in the last 11 years, 5 are not on the team, 2 are on IR, one is EJ, the other three are Stephon Gimore, Marcel Dareus and of course Watkins. The jury is out on Gilmore so the only sure fire awesome guy left from our first round drafts is Dareus. So, if Watkins is awesome, then eating that first rounder next year where we would have drafted someone like Ebron or Aaron Maybin most likely anyway, doesn't hurt so bad. Brother to me: Except, the failure of the Bills to draft well is the number one reason we have not been to the playoffs since teddy roosevelt was banging whores on his african hunting trips.. Me: Well that won't change is my point. So if we are to continue to swing and miss in first rounds, and they know this guy is awesome, what do I care if it took two first round picks instead of one lol. Chances are 80% of failure on our first round pick anyway. Brother to me: I wish we were born in new england sometimes Edited November 18, 2014 by L.EvansHands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Cubed Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 I'll just leave this here: "The Bills should have cut Dareus on Saturday and been done with him...." http://www.buffalone...ten-up-20140603 oh and this too: http://www.buffalonews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?aid=/20121003/sports/121009696/1082 Jerry Sullivan would make an excellent GM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.EvansHands Posted November 18, 2014 Author Share Posted November 18, 2014 I'll just leave this here: "The Bills should have cut Dareus on Saturday and been done with him...." http://www.buffalone...ten-up-20140603 oh and this too: http://www.buffalone.../121009696/1082 Jerry Sullivan would make an excellent GM. Haha Love it. In fairness, Evans was one of the picks and he was pretty good for a stretch. CJ is another one and he did have that one monster year too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cleveland Rocks? Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Funny, we get these same articles in the Cleveland paper with the opposite viewpoint, that the FO didn't have any urgrency to win now by passing on Watkins and it will cost them the chance to make the playoffs because they decided collecting future picks was a better idea than adding elite talent to a roster that has a chance to win this year. He is the one guy who could have made a difference in the four losses. When you don't have a deep threat and can't run the ball, you can't do much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.EvansHands Posted November 18, 2014 Author Share Posted November 18, 2014 Funny, we get these same articles in the Cleveland paper with the opposite viewpoint, that the FO didn't have any urgrency to win now by passing on Watkins and it will cost them the chance to make the playoffs because they decided collecting future picks was a better idea than adding elite talent to a roster that has a chance to win this year. He is the one guy who could have made a difference in the four losses. When you don't have a deep threat and can't run the ball, you can't do much. Yeah, also you have to figure we would have 2-3 more losses without Watkins too. I guess his point (the article) is that any of those top receivers could have filled that void and made up those losses but that is assuming a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cleveland Rocks? Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 (edited) Yeah, also you have to figure we would have 2-3 more losses without Watkins too. I guess his point (the article) is that any of those top receivers could have filled that void and made up those losses but that is assuming a lot. Doubt that. The stats are one thing, but watching those other rookies play there is a visible (even to me, an average fan) difference in the ability to gain separation, run routes, acceleration, and make clutch, off-target catches. Edited November 18, 2014 by Cleveland Rocks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Doubt that. The stats are one thing, but watching those other rookies play there is a visible (even to me, an average fan) difference in the ability to gain separation, run routes, acceleration, and make clutch, off-target catches. Hopefully, for the Browns sake, Gordon is ready to play on Sunday... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.EvansHands Posted November 18, 2014 Author Share Posted November 18, 2014 Doubt that. The stats are one thing, but watching those other rookies play there is a visible (even to me, an average fan) difference in the ability to gain separation, run routes, acceleration, and make clutch, off-target catches. Agree. Sammy is getting banged up a bit though which is probably my bigger concern, but it is not exactly unusual for a rookie WR to need to adjust to NFL hits and body stress. Hopefully, for the Browns sake, Gordon is ready to play on Sunday... I hope he has a mountain of rust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cleveland Rocks? Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Agree. Sammy is getting banged up a bit though which is probably my bigger concern, but it is not exactly unusual for a rookie WR to need to adjust to NFL hits and body stress. I hope he has a mountain of rust. Watkins is the #1 WR on the Bills, right? I think only a couple of those others guys are in that role. Makes a bit of a difference in who is covering them as well. I dont think they is much doubt as to who is the best WR out of that group. Gordon should make a difference in how defenses need to game plan, even with some rust. If we can get Cameron back too that should help, but right now that is a week to week mystery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.EvansHands Posted November 18, 2014 Author Share Posted November 18, 2014 Watkins is the #1 WR on the Bills, right? I think only a couple of those others guys are in that role. Makes a bit of a difference in who is covering them as well. I dont think they is much doubt as to who is the best WR out of that group. Gordon should make a difference in how defenses need to game plan, even with some rust. If we can get Cameron back too that should help, but right now that is a week to week mystery. Every time there is a Gordon highlight reel on ESPN it is a touchdown grab against the Bills last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Every time there is a Gordon highlight reel on ESPN it is a touchdown grab against the Bills last year. This is the case with every highlight, regardless of player. At least it seems that way! And has for years! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibs Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Just wanted to share this conversation between my brother and myself and let ya'll chime in on it. Brother to me: this is tough to read.. http://www.buffalone...two-bills-drive Me: I will reserve judgement until the year is over and see the stats. Also, a bit unfair to compare people receiving passes from Aaron Rodgers or anyone 150% better than the Orton and EJ combo. Besides if you think of it like this it isn't that hard to swallow: In the last twenty years the Bills have drafted total at the QB position 5 players, in ANY round of the draft. EJ Manuel JP Losman Levi Brown Trent Edwards Todd Collins Even when they do draft QBs they aren't smacking it out of the park here. So if they know of ANY player that is a sure thing, we might as well bundle two picks and do it. Of our first round picks in the last 11 years, 5 are not on the team, 2 are on IR, one is EJ, the other three are Stephon Gimore, Marcel Dareus and of course Watkins. The jury is out on Gilmore so the only sure fire awesome guy left from our first round drafts is Dareus. So, if Watkins is awesome, then eating that first rounder next year where we would have drafted someone like Ebron or Aaron Maybin most likely anyway, doesn't hurt so bad. Brother to me: Except, the failure of the Bills to draft well is the number one reason we have not been to the playoffs since teddy roosevelt was banging whores on his african hunting trips.. Me: Well that won't change is my point. So if we are to continue to swing and miss in first rounds, and they know this guy is awesome, what do I care if it took two first round picks instead of one lol. Chances are 80% of failure on our first round pick anyway. Brother to me: I wish we were born in new england sometimes You forgot Eric Wood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plenzmd1 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 I'll just leave this here: "The Bills should have cut Dareus on Saturday and been done with him...." http://www.buffalone...ten-up-20140603 oh and this too: http://www.buffalone.../121009696/1082 Jerry Sullivan would make an excellent GM. these are great. I really don't read Sullivan much, just because of this react to last game and last game only. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.EvansHands Posted November 18, 2014 Author Share Posted November 18, 2014 This is the case with every highlight, regardless of player. At least it seems that way! And has for years! Haha I always say that You forgot Eric Wood. I absolutely did! But that same year we drafted Maybin before Wood...so again two picks to get it right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metzelaars_lives Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Evans, whitner, lynch, wood, spiller, dareus, mckelvin, gilmore, watkins... we've probably gotten more out of our last 11 first round picks than most teams have. WE NEED A G*****N QUARTERBACK. To quote metallica, nothing else matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 I wish we were born in new england So do I... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.EvansHands Posted November 18, 2014 Author Share Posted November 18, 2014 Evans, whitner, lynch, wood, spiller, dareus, mckelvin, gilmore, watkins... we've probably gotten more out of our last 11 first round picks than most teams have. WE NEED A G*****N QUARTERBACK. To quote metallica, nothing else matters. I suppose. Whitner, McKelvin, Spiller, and Gilmore -while getting a lot of mileage in Bills uniforms, I'm not sure I think were great 1st round selections (yet - holding out hope for a CJ revival and for Gilmore to develop) Would be an interesting analysis for which I don't have the time, to slate the last 10 years of all playoff caliber teams and their 1st round retention + success rate versus how the Bills stack out. It was a bit shocking to me to see that we only had 5 draft picks at QB over the last dozen years and how underwhelming they were when placed in a row like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 I'll just leave this here: "The Bills should have cut Dareus on Saturday and been done with him...." http://www.buffalone...ten-up-20140603 oh and this too: http://www.buffalone.../121009696/1082 Jerry Sullivan would make an excellent GM. It seems like only yesterday when Sullivan felt like this team was proving to be a serious contender to make the playoffs. If it weren't for Tim Graham, he'd be the biggest fool reporting on the Bills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metzelaars_lives Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 (edited) I suppose. Whitner, McKelvin, Spiller, and Gilmore -while getting a lot of mileage in Bills uniforms, I'm not sure I think were great 1st round selections (yet - holding out hope for a CJ revival and for Gilmore to develop) Would be an interesting analysis for which I don't have the time, to slate the last 10 years of all playoff caliber teams and their 1st round retention + success rate versus how the Bills stack out. It was a bit shocking to me to see that we only had 5 draft picks at QB over the last dozen years and how underwhelming they were when placed in a row like that. agree that we should have taken more qb's but find me another team that had 9 of its last 11 first round picks become solid starters in this league. To your initial points, yes we need a qb and no, our last 11 first round picks have not been abysmal. If we had a franchise qb we wouldn't be having this conversation. The patriots and colts have had laughable drafts for years. Edited November 18, 2014 by metzelaars_lives Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.EvansHands Posted November 18, 2014 Author Share Posted November 18, 2014 agree that we should have taken more qb's but find me another team that had 9 of its last 11 first round picks become solid starters in this league. To your initial points, yes we need a qb and no, our last 11 first round picks have not been abysmal. If we had a franchise qb we wouldn't be having this conversation. The patriots and colts have had laughable drafts for years. Can't really argue with either of those statements. But my initial point is more about Sammy not being a whiff or a "folly" because it is not like our first round picks have yielded franchise stalwarts in any case. In some cases we had two 1st round draft picks to get the one "good player" we did get, such as McCargo and Whitner (Whitner being the chicken dinner) and Maybin and Wood. I could even make an argument that we do better in the second round for whatever reason. Since 2007 we grabbed: Poz Byrd, Levitre Aaron Williams Cordy Glenn Robert Woods, Kiko Alonso In the second round when we have two chances we hit better than when we had two chances in the first round. Not sure what that means if anything but it is interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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