Sisyphean Bills Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 He would be if winning was a franchise priorty. Given that players are being quoted as saying their teammates aren't playing hard or doing their jobs, you have to really wonder. It only stands to reason that if you wanted to be a successful then you wouldn't keep putting the guys that are half-assing it on their shifts in the critical jobs, no? Now, there might be other reasons to leave the boss' kid in the plum job even if he does spend all his time flirting with the secretary instead of doing anything constructive... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2003Contenders Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 (edited) There certainly is some merit in what you say about talent evaluation, which has been a problem dating back for a decade now. Here is my addendum to that: 1. I give the current regime a pass for their "first" draft in 2010, as Modrak was still primarily calling the shots, and the I-am-smarter-than-conventional-wisdom mind-set that was a trademark of his years as the chief college scout were on full display in that draft. 2. Part of the problem is that the scheme has been so back-and-forth. When Nix/Gaily took over in 2010, the Bills were running a 4-3 Cover-2 scheme. Edwards comes in and shifts to a 3-4 that is about as different as can be. After 2 years, he gets canned and Wanny comes in with his own version of a 4-3. Not only is there a serious learning curve involved, but the personnel required to run each of these defenses is starkly different. 3. On a related note, the last 3 years has really displayed some of the worst defensive coaching that I have ever seen. Edwards was simply in over his head. Meanwhile, Wanny is so resistant to change that he still insists on running a style of defense that is 20 years old and poorly suited to the players we have on the current roster. A good coach (like Wade) finds a scheme that best suits his existing personnel rather than the other way around. A perfect illustration is the utter misuse of Aaron Williams. His greatest strength coming out of college was his physicality and ability to play strong inside the box: great in run support and blitzing the QB. If his cover ability had been better he would have been a top 10 pick. So how is he being used? Well, we obviously see him getting torched almost every week. Has he blitzed at all this year? Edited October 25, 2012 by 2003Contenders Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaattMaann Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 wade has, and always will run his same 3-4 defense....so I get what your saying in general, but a "good coach like wade" has not really altered his approach to defense much in his career....hes just a dam good defensive coach and always has been Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 Yes, Spiller, Dareus, Glenn & Gilmore worked out so far, but out of 27 Draft selections, 5 is not good enough! The later rounds are where you find system players or "right fits". But it hurts when you go from a 4-3 to a 3-4 for 2 years than back to a 4-3. WTF. When Chan Gaily was brought on he was noted as a person that adjusts to his players. We had a 4-3 and he wanted to go to a 3-4 with no personal in place. That was a huge mistake. but even if he wanted to go to a 3-4. You have to get the personel and commit to it. not bail after 1-2 seasons. Look at New England and Pittsburgh. They get the system in place, get the players that compliment the system and game plan. They stay with the game plan, That is why they have always been to the playoffs. We do not have an identity on Def. other than a bad one. If you want to run the 4-3 you need the line. Yes, we have that. but in todays vertical game the DB's and LB's have to be fast and be able to take on a bull rush. Our LB's cannot cope. Other than Nick Barnett, our LB's lack the speed and strength to keep up with The Jets and The Patriots. You have to figure out a way to beat those two teams before anyone else. They are division rivals, and have dominated us for over 10 years. Why do you think that happens? They know our system and can exploit it. The problem is, I think Gaily has the right system in place on offense and has the right people, besides a good 2nd receiver and a QB, but that is the guy we should have looked for when he got here. Do you think that 100 Mill on a defensive end is more valuable than your team leader on offense? It would not have put this franchise back, if we grabbed a good spread offense QB over the years. Colin Kapernick would have been the perfect fit. The problem is our talent evaluation and the need to fill the crucial positions like QB, LB and DE. Nix has to be accountable. Bottom line. No offense...But there is no way, under any possible definition, that we can say Dareus has worked out so far...Unless of course we were looking for an average, over-weight, DT that has limited impact in most games...If that's what we were looking for when we Drafted Marcell, then it's worked out just fine... He was the 3rd overall pick...He was Drafted to be an impact DT...He was Drafted before 5 of the most talented young players in the NFL (AJ Green, Patrick Peterson, JJ Watt, Julio Jones, and Aldon Smith)...Dareus has had his moments, and he has completely disappeared too...More importantly he has been in the middle of a D-Line that has been historically bad for 23 games now...He's a part of that...A BIG part of that...And there is no way that has worked out to plan whatsoever...Just saying... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 There certainly is some merit in what you say about talent evaluation, which has been a problem dating back for a decade now. Here is my addendum to that: 1. I give the current regime a pass for their "first" draft in 2010, as Modrak was still primarily calling the shots, and the I-am-smarter-than-conventional-wisdom mind-set that was a trademark of his years as the chief college scout were on full display in that draft. 2. Part of the problem is that the scheme has been so back-and-forth. When Nix/Gaily took over in 2010, the Bills were running a 4-3 Cover-2 scheme. Edwards comes in and shifts to a 3-4 that is about as different as can be. After 2 years, he gets canned and Wanny comes in with his own version of a 4-3. Not only is there a serious learning curve involved, but the personnel required to run each of these defenses is starkly different. 3. On a related note, the last 3 years has really displayed some of the worst defensive coaching that I have ever seen. Edwards was simply in over his head. Meanwhile, Wanny is so resistant to change that he still insists on running a style of defense that is 20 years old and poorly suited to the players we have on the current roster. A good coach (like Wade) finds a scheme that best suits his existing personnel rather than the other way around. A perfect illustration is the utter misuse of Aaron Williams. His greatest strength coming out of college was his physicality and ability to play strong inside the box: great in run support and blitzing the QB. If his cover ability had been better he would have been a top 10 pick. So how is he being used? Well, we obviously see him getting torched almost every week. Has he blitzed at all this year? Let's say you are buying groceries for your restaurant. Your place serves Italian cuisine, so you go out and stock the freezer with all the pasta, sauces, etc. you think you'll need. Two days later, someone says you'd do better if you served English fare. So, you hire a new chef and go back to the wholesalers and buy up the liver pudding supply, and toss all the tomatoes in the dumpster. Your customers come in and scratch their head, but the food critic is going to give you a bit of a free pass because you keep changing? How the !@#$ does that work? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All_Pro_Bills Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 (edited) Let's say you are buying groceries for your restaurant. Your place serves Italian cuisine, so you go out and stock the freezer with all the pasta, sauces, etc. you think you'll need. Two days later, someone says you'd do better if you served English fare. So, you hire a new chef and go back to the wholesalers and buy up the liver pudding supply, and toss all the tomatoes in the dumpster. Your customers come in and scratch their head, but the food critic is going to give you a bit of a free pass because you keep changing? How the !@#$ does that work? To take your analogy one step further - everybody needs to be on the same page. Teams that are successful in sports and business, generally have some form of management system in place that serves as the foundation for how the organization operates and behaves. All employees are expected to embrace the system and work within its rules and parameters to assist the organization in meeting its goals. There are many examples, the Patriots, Steelers in football, the Red Wings in hockey, Walmart, UPS, and Apple in business. Just to name a few. They all started with a single vision of the leader whether an owner or a top manager inside the organization. The Bills do not have this leader or visionary in charge since its leader is a 94 year old owner of failing health that needs to be concerned about his own well-being at present vs. the needs of the organization. You can't blame him for that. In many situations such as this it would be prudent to step aside and turn over control to somebody more capable of focusing on the challenges ahead but that is not happening here for reasons undisclosed. So it would appear the Bills are not playing from the same sheet of music. If you asked everyone from the owner on down to the cashier at the consession stand what the Bills 'system' was you'd probably get a 100 different answers, or maybe a rather insightful and honest answer that they do not have one. If you did this in Pittsburgh I suspect you'd get a handful which would more or less be descriptive of the same thing. Edited October 25, 2012 by All_Pro_Bills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bring Back Kelly Posted October 25, 2012 Author Share Posted October 25, 2012 Nice reference about the restaurant. I agree. About Marcel D. I do think he is a good player. Even though he is still relatively young, I see a lot in him. the way he gets through his blocks is impressive. He is shorter than the average Dt, and his leverage is not great, but he is like a Bull dog. short, strong and nasty. You have to look at the space that is covered in this defense. the LB's need to jump into run support. when they do, the space closes and Marcel holds his space. now if you look at where the rbs are going against our def, they don't hit the gaps near marcel unless a fb double teams him. the problem I see is that we cannot get through on passing downs. not sure why either. The QB has a lot of time. I think that we make a lot of mental miscues. we call a passing def against their run. This happens way too much. Wanny makes those calls, and thats why he sucks right now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEAST MODE BABY! Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 This team looks like it has more holes then it did 3 years ago. QB was an issue, LB was an issue, pass rush was an issue, all are still an issue. Now, 2nd top WR is now an issue, Safety is now an issue. The Bills are really missing Poz & Whitner, and need a Lee Evans. I never thought the defense could get worse then Jauron's Tampon 2, especially with a 100 million dollar DE...but it did! 3 drafts and no top LB, more importantly no franchise QB. Bills missing Poz and Whitner? What are you, smoking crack? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 You look at the Pats and Jets in our division and see what happens when ownership changes. The Patriots recent success coincides with Bob Kraft taking over. And while Jets fans would probably say Leon Hess was a great guy the team has recently changed course with Woody Johnson. Although the jury is out with this rendition of the team and whether you like them or not they did go to 2 consecutive AFC title games. Other exampes, the Falcons with Blank, change of the guard with the Colts and Cardinals. The steady hand and system of the Rooney's in Pittsburgh. Nothing is really going to change until the owner leaves the scene and the team is autioned. Then we will know whether the team will remain in the region. What a lot of people don't understand is that in the franchise estate sale the process can take up to two years before it is finally determined who owns the team and what the financial considerations are for the new owner. The auction certainly isn't a quick process. The league has to review the the financial ability of the prospective bidders and then what happens if someone legally challenges the outcome? That is what happened with the Redskins and the Milstein bid. The current owner of the Redskins was a minority owner in the Milstein bid. When Milstein was not approved as a buyer by the league Snyder reformed the group and became the winning bidder. It was a very messy and challenging process. In my view it makes absolutely no sense for the state and county to put up any taxpayer money for a major renovation of the current antiquated stadium, especially since the present fading owner is not willing to commit keeping the team when he passes. In other words the status quo will remain in place until there is an ownership change. When Lerner decided to sell the Cleveland franchise it was done seamlessly. When Modell sold the Ravens he had a buyer within his own ownership group who had the first option to buy. Not with Ralph. He is going to squeeze the franchise to the max without giving a dam about anyone else. It's a shame. http://www.oleantimesherald.com/sports/article_d2543262-1eb0-11e2-b9e2-001a4bcf887a.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FitzShowUsYourTitz Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 It's not just about which players are drafted/acquired...a big part of how personnel moves translate to performance on the football field is how these players are utilized. Employing a good defensive scheme and putting players in positions to succeed is important. I don't think that is happening with this team right now....especially on the defensive side. Switching schemes and firing DC's doesn't help either and can be blamed on the FO as well. Unfortunately, it looks like it's gonna be a while until the D is actually good. Probably bring in another HC and or DC and then go through this process all over again. I REALLY wish there was Hockey = The only thing that get's me through the NFL offseason. Damn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 Bills missing Poz and Whitner? What are you, smoking crack? Are you blind, can't watch the games ? The Bills have a much worse defense then when those two were in Bills Uni's. Whitner was there to make all the tackles missed by the front 7, so yeah I'd say they miss him. Poz was better then anyone the Bills currently have at MLB Currently the Bills are 31st in total defense and last against the run Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterpan Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 Look on the bright side guys, we finalyl have an offensive line! First time since the early 90s we can say that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 There certainly is some merit in what you say about talent evaluation, which has been a problem dating back for a decade now. Here is my addendum to that: 1. I give the current regime a pass for their "first" draft in 2010, as Modrak was still primarily calling the shots, and the I-am-smarter-than-conventional-wisdom mind-set that was a trademark of his years as the chief college scout were on full display in that draft. As a NFL GM, you don't get passes on drafts during your tenure. Given Nix's activities now as the highest guy on the football side of the house, is there any question that he was scouting players from the time he was hired as national scout in early 2009? He knew the draft prospects for the 2010 draft and simply saying because Modrak was present the draft was bad is absurd. And how does this explain drafting Levitre, Byrd, and Wood in 2009? Dumb luck? Nix was heralded by many here as a "top five talent evaluator" from his days in SD. Many were quick to praise him for the Charger's good moves and not hold him accountable for others. It was simply a way for many here to proclaim this guy something different than previous individuals not qualified to be GM's like Levy and Brandon. The reality is, Buddy's rebuild is very close to failing if it hasn't already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterpan Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 No offense...But there is no way, under any possible definition, that we can say Dareus has worked out so far...Unless of course we were looking for an average, over-weight, DT that has limited impact in most games...If that's what we were looking for when we Drafted Marcell, then it's worked out just fine... He was the 3rd overall pick...He was Drafted to be an impact DT...He was Drafted before 5 of the most talented young players in the NFL (AJ Green, Patrick Peterson, JJ Watt, Julio Jones, and Aldon Smith)...Dareus has had his moments, and he has completely disappeared too...More importantly he has been in the middle of a D-Line that has been historically bad for 23 games now...He's a part of that...A BIG part of that...And there is no way that has worked out to plan whatsoever...Just saying... Sad but true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 JJ Watt, or Aldon Smith would be nice to have.......Julio Jones would be another TJ Graham just too fast to play with fitz baby arm Patrick Peterson is a great return guy......Cant say hes a great DB Stevie wore him out the other day could have had a career day pending soft qb play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dutmost Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 (edited) It's amazing how inept the organization has been over the last 10 years in the 1st 3 rounds of the draft .Hell they trade up to get JP Losman after drafting Lee Evans in the 1st Round when they simply could've traded up to get Big Ben in 2004. The team would've been better off just trading away their 1st three picks the last 6-7 years and stocking up on mid round flyers. 15 players have went to the Pro bowl from the 1st round of that 2004 Draft. Bills missed with both picks in 1st round imagine that. Bills always seem to reach in the 1st 3 rounds for their needs when simply upgrading an avg player to an above avg player helps the team just as well. If you don't have the player graded out that high then simply trade the damn pick if you can... Since 2004 the Bills best 1st round pick has probably been Marshawn Lynch in 2007 (wanted Willis but didn't fall). 2006 Whitner over Ngata, 2008 McKelvin over Roger-Cromartie, 2009. Maybin- Orapko/Cushing. 2011 (spiller) and 2012 (dareus) have been much better drafts.. Edited October 26, 2012 by dutmost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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