Receiver Depth Chart

[tbonestake]

I believe the initials I used were SJ and we haven't been talking about Spencer. We need a guy who's going to be productive opposite Lee, not a guy who will occupy a S in a preseason game. Also, it could've been anyone running the crossing route you speak of, he surely was not biting because they were scared of getting burnt by Steve Johnson. Jackson is better running routes and is better on his cuts that SJ. As for being convinced? Not my job, but if you are not convinced by actual on the field production I can't help you. Like I said, Sam Aiken part deux(slower version of course).

 

then why did he bite if you know what he was thinking?

 

Who is to say that SJ will not be productive now that he is ON THE FIELD!!! Chad Jackson runs better routes?! What is your basis for this? His hands are brutal and he will contribute but he will not be counted upon. The basis of your argument is dogging Steve Johnson and saying that he has not produced. You are saying that you would rather have a rookie who hasn't done anything in the NFL yet OR a Never WAS with terrible hands start in place of a guy who the coaches trust with the responsiblity of being a #2 type WR. This is all an unknown at this point so we have to agree to disagree. Besides, hopefully they will be using all sorts of alignments and motion so the #2 WR position could be a moot point. Let neither of us pigeon hole the number 2 WR as just that.

 

I'm a basketball guy. If you strictly rely on your PG to handle a press, you're screwed! You need your SG and SF to be able to hold their own and be strong against the press. Sometimes your 4 man needs to step up and possess the ball vs a press. Bottom line, we need SOMEBODY other than Lee to catch some balls. I think we can both agree that with Roscoe's increased role and the use of David Nelson/Chad Jackson/Steve Johnson, we may be looking up in terms of alternative production.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

other than the interference, that was a good play by the defender.

 

Other than the assassination, how was the play Mrs. Lincoln?

[JPS]

I love your enthusiasm bro but why would you want to LIMIT Spiller's ability by making him a #2 WR? The best thing about Spiller is that he is dynamic! He can play different positions on the field. He can run and catch but you CANNOT limit him by making him a # 2. He isn't a route runner. He is a guy who will go over the middle or out of the slot. I cannot stress this enough. DO NOT PIGEON HOLE SPILLER AS A #2 WR!!! MOVE HIM AROUND ALL OVER THE FIELD!!!! KEEP OTHER TEAMS GUESSING!!!!

Echo that. Even great WRs touch the ball 10 times a game. I think Spiller should be AT LEAST in the 15-20 range.

 

I think Donald Jones has had a respectable pre-season. Without looking at the preseason stats, I'd bet he was closer to the middle in receptions than the bottom. Decent size. He's a return guy. If he could be a gunner, you maybe surprised when they keep a guy like Jones. Somebody has to play ST.

[DIE HARD 1967]

Who is Stevie?

[Big Turk]

Now that training camp is over and 75% of the preseason, the conversation at receiver is even more interesting. For purposes of rank, I will put Stevie ahead of Roscoe just because he plays on the outside opposite Lee. I personally think roscoe will put up bigger numbers.

 

1 - Lee

2 - Stevie

3- Roscoe

4 - David Nelson

5- Chad Jackson

6 - James Hardy

7 - Roosevelt

8 - Donald Jones

 

5-8 were tough. How would you rank them?

 

I think Hardy is getting cut. No need to keep him around when we have a better player with almost the same height and weight in David Nelson. Amazing to think the undrafted guy is better than a guy picked in the 2nd round.

[MyHorseAteTheKid]

Now that training camp is over and 75% of the preseason, the conversation at receiver is even more interesting. For purposes of rank, I will put Stevie ahead of Roscoe just because he plays on the outside opposite Lee. I personally think roscoe will put up bigger numbers.

 

1 - Lee

2 - Stevie

3- Roscoe

4 - David Nelson

5- Chad Jackson

6 - James Hardy

7 - Roosevelt

8 - Donald Jones

 

5-8 were tough. How would you rank them?

 

 

 

Not much there to rank.. lol

[Speedy G]

I say Nelson starts over Steve Johnson, who over the last 3 years has done absolutely nothing to earn a starting job. True, neither has Nelson, but he's looking very promising right now. Give him a shot.

 

David Nelson is rookie and he looks like a starter, he's performed very well. Shaun Nelson on the other hand hasn't done much since the TD in the opening game against New England last year, and now he's suspended for the 1st 4 games. Shaun has the ability, along with stupidity, that suspension wasn't very smart.

[since'62]

As much as I want Roosevelt to make the team, it seems that the coaches are preparing Nelson and Jones for the back-up roles and for special teams. They are the gunners on the punt coverage team as well as kick-off returner (Jones) and kick coverage (Nelson). Nelson is the extra receiver in 4-wide formation with the starters. Jones has always been no lower than second team in camp and in the preseason games. I watched Roosevelt for four years at UB and think he could play well if not star in the NFL. Galley and the coaches don't seem to make depth chart changes unless they are trying to keep things a secret.

 

1. Evans

2. Johnson

3. Parrish

4. Nelson

5. Jones

6. Jackson/Hardy

 

PS. Roosevelt

cut - Jackson/Hardy

[San Jose Bills Fan]

The "quickie" analysis is that the Bills have a bona fide top two receiver in Lee Evans (some like myself believe he's a bona fide number one, others don't). It's immaterial.

 

The rest of the Bills wide receivers are probably number three types with the caveat that some of the young guys might have enough upside to be considered number two receivers someday. But not right now.

 

I think Chan and co. are hoping to make up for this deficiency with the bounty of riches we have at running back.

 

Clearly, tight end is not a situation which is going to offset the weakness at receiver very much, if at all.

 

The team lacks the second outside threat which would make the offense formidable.

 

Ironically, re-signing T.O. might have been a good decision…but I understand the rebuilding argument and how he doesn't fit in from that standpoint.

[sharper802]

CJ is not going to be the # 2 WR.

 

Why is it assumed Roscoe won't be the second outside WR? He has more experience and more productiviy even at the WR than all the other WR's not named Evans. That is where the Bears play Devin Hester a significnat amount of time.

 

I think it is way to simple to say Roscoe is going to play in the slot all the time. In fact there will be times Evans will be in the slot a yard off the line of scrimmage. Defenses often adjust to this and move their best corners inside. I think the only given is that Hardy won't be lining up in the slot unless it is a bunch formation and he is used as a screen.

 

By simple body size and potenital red zone threat I think Hardy makes the team. If there was a Tony Gonzalez type TE on this team maybe not, but Hardy is the only legit jump ball option in the red zone.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

By simple body size and potenital red zone threat I think Hardy makes the team. If there was a Tony Gonzalez type TE on this team maybe not, but Hardy is the only legit jump ball option in the red zone.

David Nelson.

 

He's 6'4" with soft hands, a 38-inch vertical leap and a broad jump of 10 feet, four inches.

Edited September 1, 2010 by San Jose Bills Fan

[Kelly the Dog]

CJ is not going to be the # 2 WR.

 

Why is it assumed Roscoe won't be the second outside WR? He has more experience and more productiviy even at the WR than all the other WR's not named Evans. That is where the Bears play Devin Hester a significnat amount of time.

 

I think it is way to simple to say Roscoe is going to play in the slot all the time. In fact there will be times Evans will be in the slot a yard off the line of scrimmage. Defenses often adjust to this and move their best corners inside.

On the TD pass to Roscoe, he was actually on the line of scrimmage. Evans was lined up outside of him, but a yard off the line and then went in motion inside of Parrish when the ball was snapped. Parrish delayed a bit as Evans ran his pattern. It worked perfectly and the DB didnt really cover either of them for a second. Roscoe then slid across the middle where he was picked up by a LB he easily ran past, Edwards hit him on the run and it was an easy TD. Great designed play, and something we never would have seen from previous coaching staffs.

 

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d81a1665f/Parrish-TD-ties-game

[H2o]

1. then why did he bite if you know what he was thinking?

 

Who is to say that SJ will not be productive now that he is ON THE FIELD!!! 2. Chad Jackson runs better routes?! What is your basis for this? 3. His hands are brutal and he will contribute but he will not be counted upon. The basis of your argument is dogging Steve Johnson and saying that he has not produced. 4. You are saying that you would rather have a rookie who hasn't done anything in the NFL yet OR a Never WAS with terrible hands start in place of a guy who the coaches trust with the responsiblity of being a #2 type WR. This is all an unknown at this point so we have to agree to disagree. Besides, hopefully they will be using all sorts of alignments and motion so the #2 WR position could be a moot point. Let neither of us pigeon hole the number 2 WR as just that.

 

5. I'm a basketball guy. If you strictly rely on your PG to handle a press, you're screwed! You need your SG and SF to be able to hold their own and be strong against the press. Sometimes your 4 man needs to step up and possess the ball vs a press. Bottom line, we need SOMEBODY other than Lee to catch some balls. I think we can both agree that with Roscoe's increased role and the use of David Nelson/Chad Jackson/Steve Johnson, we may be looking up in terms of alternative production.

1. Defensive responsibilities to cover the underneath route and the knowledge of Trent not throwing deep (usually).

2. Have you watched his route running in the preseason? He's better coming out of his cuts and gettin separation.

3. Everyone drops a pass at one point or another, even one's deemed "crucial", unless your first name is Jerry and last is Rice.

4. IMO, both have looked better than Johnson. Both.

5. I was a basketball and football guy. I understand what you are saying and agree. We just see things a bit different as to who should be second in line handling the rock.

[Cugalabanza]

On the TD pass to Roscoe, he was actually on the line of scrimmage. Evans was lined up outside of him, but a yard off the line and then went in motion inside of Parrish when the ball was snapped. Parrish delayed a bit as Evans ran his pattern. It worked perfectly and the DB didnt really cover either of them for a second. Roscoe then slid across the middle where he was picked up by a LB he easily ran past, Edwards hit him on the run and it was an easy TD. Great designed play, and something we never would have seen from previous coaching staffs.

 

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d81a1665f/Parrish-TD-ties-game

Yes!

 

Intelligent plays, designed to create mismatches and find openings in the D. Amazing how absent that has been the last couple years.

[The Dean]

Yes!

 

Intelligent plays, designed to create mismatches and find openings in the D. Amazing how absent that has been the last couple years.

 

 

A thing of simplistic beauty.

 

Of course, if this staff is anything like the last, they will never call t his play again.

[tbonestake]

1. Defensive responsibilities to cover the underneath route and the knowledge of Trent not throwing deep (usually).

2. Have you watched his route running in the preseason? He's better coming out of his cuts and gettin separation.

3. Everyone drops a pass at one point or another, even one's deemed "crucial", unless your first name is Jerry and last is Rice.

4. IMO, both have looked better than Johnson. Both.

5. I was a basketball and football guy. I understand what you are saying and agree. We just see things a bit different as to who should be second in line handling the rock.

 

 

I believe literally its translated as "A whale's vagina"

[Hplarrm]

CJ is not going to be the # 2 WR.

 

Why is it assumed Roscoe won't be the second outside WR? He has more experience and more productiviy even at the WR than all the other WR's not named Evans. That is where the Bears play Devin Hester a significnat amount of time.

 

I think it is way to simple to say Roscoe is going to play in the slot all the time. In fact there will be times Evans will be in the slot a yard off the line of scrimmage. Defenses often adjust to this and move their best corners inside. I think the only given is that Hardy won't be lining up in the slot unless it is a bunch formation and he is used as a screen.

 

By simple body size and potenital red zone threat I think Hardy makes the team. If there was a Tony Gonzalez type TE on this team maybe not, but Hardy is the only legit jump ball option in the red zone.

I actually have been fairly impressed by the work in a couple of years during Parrish as a Bill despite the fact that many fans have always had the long knives out for him. Yes, it was disappointing that he got hurt so quickly in his career, but the fact I was disappointed by this event does not mean he is also disappointed as a player.

 

RP has not produced like we would have wanted him to, but I attribute much of this to how badly designed and implemented the Bills O has been in his short career and feel he has demonstrated some very good talents which causes me not to be surprised at all about the enthusiasm Gailey has stated for him.

 

1. Obviously the punt return ability has been superb (though spotty at times but again this appears to be a miscoaching and mismanagement of a variety of Bills player assets which have gone on during the playoff drought.

 

2. I have been extremely impressed with his willingness to go over the middle in his slot work and he has even bounced up quickly after a tough slot hit which surprised me after his early injury,

 

3. Despite Don Beebe making a nickel off it it really it is hard to teach speed, Parrish has it.

 

However, though I do like his speed, elusiveness, moxie, and openfield running abilities, his small size and the quick injury give me pause for using him as a heavy duty starter at #2 WR.

 

Its just hard for me to see relying on him surviving a whole season with this as a central part of the O.

 

Ample use of him as the slot WR in 3 WR sets, making an interesting choice between, him, McKelvin, Spiller (and heck McGee made the Pro Bowl due to his production on KR), and sometimes end a round are what I think may be the best use of a player who can be a difference maker.

[Hplarrm]

Echo that. Even great WRs touch the ball 10 times a game. I think Spiller should be AT LEAST in the 15-20 range.

 

 

 

What do you think is the plan for getting the 15-20 touches you dictate for Spiller with him being the 3rd RB on the depth chart (When asked about this Gailey flat out emphasized this was in fact true).

 

From my outside observation, Gailey likes Jax as his starter and he has demonstrated that the determination he has displayed which got this Coe College guy to the NFL was shown to be real by his production as our #1 rusher, top receiver, and even return guy last year. My guess is that it is going to be a great problem but DeHaven is going to have to parcel out the return touches between

 

McKelvin- (got a little excited a couple of times and left the ball on the carpet but I think the most talented and lethal return guy on the team last year).

 

Spiller- you are right that the man must touch the ball if the Bills are to succeed and the open field running ability he has already shown points to trying to get him some of the touches on returns.

 

Parrish- a proven return threat who Gailey has publicly identified as someone he expects big things from him this year.

 

Jax- demonstrated an ability to be a reliable and solid performing return guy but the potential of the three above to take it to the house anytime they catch the ball mean Jaxs sits on returns.

 

McGee- He is our #1 CB so is a full time position player but it speaks as much to the incredible depth we have at return even more than his need to focus on pass pro that a former Pro Bowl returner is not even in the mix.

 

This calculus becomes important as in the quest for 15-10 touches it seems unlikely to expect more than a couple a game will come to Spiller from kicks.

 

My sense is that Spiller as a rookie and while by no means a smurf he is not not a huge man either. Both Lynch and Jax have done well in the type of game which historically has run (though historically he has had no depth at RB) which is to run the ball 20+ times in a game and wear down the opponent.

 

Gailey seems to have presented buddies Jax and Lynch a plan where the two of them seemed quite comfortable with co-existing as RBs. Many felt that for sure Lynch was gone this off-season as though he deserved the Pro Bowl reserve nod he received the brain farts with the law make him a bad bet even though he has starter ability.

 

My guess is that Gailey let them know he planned to use 2 RB simultaneously (FB McIntyre is for specialty goaline and sometimes max protect. Either Lynch or Jax has the ability to go into the pass route in motion or even be split out wide. Lynch in beast mode has the ability to be the smashmouth blocker for Jax as well.

 

The great play by Spiller augments and fits in well with this plan, but if you divide the two RB starts among three people it gets to be a little tight for getting touches and for playing consistently.

 

I am just looking for a way for us to get all three players on the field at the same time

[Cugalabanza]

The great play by Spiller augments and fits in well with this plan, but if you divide the two RB starts among three people it gets to be a little tight for getting touches and for playing consistently.

Keep moving the chains = more offensive snaps = more touches to go around = everybody happy

[Trader]

Hardy ran a 4.47 at the combine. Thats pretty good for a big man. He is also the only receiver on the bills that can rebound like a basketball player. His scouting report said he has a knack for getting to the ball at its highest point. I think easley going on ir opens the door for hardy.

 

It is likely to come down to Chad Jackson or Hardy. As far as athletic ability I will take Jackson. He ran a 4.32 at the combine with a 38.5 vertical (source Football's Future) He also weighs 222 lbs. Both Jackson and Hardy have had concentration and ball skill problems Jackson does well coming out of his breaks and gets separation. Hardy never got separation even in college. One additional factor is Hardy's ACL, 4.47 is not a great 40 time for a receiver it's just Ok. That time was prior to his ACL injury. I wonder what his 40 time is now? Yes there are good receivers who run a 4.47 or higher but they are great route runners Hardy is not. I am betting that Jackson gets the nod over Hardy. I doubt they keep both. I am open to Hardy winning the job though but I want to see him win it on a football field against Defensive Backs not on Stats and the Height chart. I think it will come down to which of them stands out tonight.