LynchMob23

The Panthers radio guys just said and I quote, "Kelly Holcomb throws like a girl."

We've got to get a Running back into the Endzone at some point during this game. And Losman has to look better than this. Or, I'm going to have to call my sponsor....

Bill, I think that was a very big problem last year, and a good reason for the lack of a TE presence. However, when JP was first in as a starter (and when Holcomb became a regular) I wondered to myself why he didn't use the TE more on shorter routes for either A) JP to get some confidence prior to some longer throws or B) Give Holcomb more options that were "safe" and quick. I can also see your point about the RG situation. Even if he was healthy, Chris V is getting older and even this year had a few comments in one of those arguments saying something to the effect of he missed the days when you could just man block and maul a guy. Though I'm sure it's just him being honest, if you're not playing in that system and you have 4/5 of a line that is built (at least on paper) for it, you may wanna not air that out too much.

Bill, In all fairness, on this board right now there are articles detailing: an ESPN conspiracy against the Bills how Kelly Holcomb / JP Losman starting will bring about the end of the franchise various freaking out regarding Madden stats for Bills players. After posting my article, the first thing I expected was "hey, this guy thinks he's Lombardi reincarnate" or something like that, which I don't.

Well I'll probably be on a lot 'til school starts again at the end of the month, so I'll be sure to "peek my head in" on a few convos. I'm watching the Cardinals game on the NFL Network and my goodness - if our single back set can play like theirs has against the Steelers, I think we'll all enjoy the year! Granted, it's pre-season, but I like seeing 2 first team tds for any team.

Thanks much, I'll try to be more active over here - I usually would read the articles on the front page and post every now and then, but then the QB comp started and the insults began to fly and personally, I have better things to do than to get all bent outta shape on something someone says when we're rooting for the same team.

Simon, I'm not big on arguing a point, but I am big on discussing football. With that said: 1. Homer Alert - I am a Bills fan. I spent 40 minutes writing that for a Bills fan message board. I'm a homer, guilty as charged. But I am also a realist. I'm not saying that we have the second coming of the K gun on offense. In practice, one of the plays that made me say "quite good" was a pass play in which Gandy blocked in and Reyes kicked out and blocked the sweeping Outside LB. I made of note of that because of the fact that sort of pass block was shown on National Television when it (while being performed by Bennie Anderson) failed to contain McGinest if memory serves from sacking-stripping Holcomb of the football. Holcomb was in on QB at the time of this play as well. From practice, practice mind you they looked good. 2 - Inconsistencies with Dropbacks and routes - From the Te and Slot position I saw a lot of Z-outs, which were typically associated with the 5 step drop. Evans would do the post -fade from time to time, Peerless a 15-17 yard square in. All of these were from 5. Out of 3 steps, there were a number of screen/1 step hitches that became go routes if the corner jumped. Other than that, as you said there isn't the time for multiple routes, though many of the third string three steps became scrambles to find people open. 3. Blocking out of the wideouts - if they're doing their job, for the most part they are going to be engaging a corner at the line and/or assisting someone on the second level. I'm not saying they're stopping Julius Peppers, but I am saying they looked good engaging corners. Again, sorry if my "homerism" prevented me from objective analysis. How's this - "They got in the way well." 4. Mularkey, run game and preconceived notions - First off, Mularkey's got what? 20 years of coaching, several years of being a great OC and 2 years of Head coaching experience. I'm not doubting the man knows his stuff. But, riddle me this then: For a guy that was a former NFL Tight End and someone who has all of the aforementioned accolades, why didn't he use the tight ends more in his offensive gameplan, either when Clements was calling the plays or when he took over? With respect to my comments on Willis and the run game - "Willis McGahee is not Jerome Bettis" - that is what Offensive Coordinator Matt Cavanaugh said to me whenever I would ask about some Bills runs we would look at in the past off-season. While Willis may not have been the most willing of runners at times last year, why was that? Was it because he had to bulk up to take a heavy run game up the gut? And why would Mularkey take out a run that was so successful for the Bills (the HB Sweep out of Shotgun) in his second year when it was a good one for him in the first? I wasn't in the Bills locker room last year. But I do know some things about football - and when you play in a zone-based run game and you have a center who cannot engage a defender pre-double team with the guard, you will not have an interior run game that is consistent. When you have a zone run game and you tell your running back not to make a decision to bounce it out, you are not helping yourself out. Look at the game vs the Jets last year. If memory serves, Willis' longest run during the game was because he decided that since the middle (where he tried to pound it) was not open he should bounce it out to the right. 20 some odd yards later, first down Bills. Am I giving Willis a pass for not listening? No. But I do know if your line coach and rb coach are saying one thing and your head coach is saying another (in addition getting into arguments with the OC and other coaches) you have a failure to communicate. 5. Actually, you got me there. Why would I lump Joe Gibbs, Mike Martz, Al Saunders and Steve Fairchild together? They're all in the lineage of the "true" west coast offense, as designed by Sid Gillman. Don't believe me? Here's an article that proves it: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/inside_ga...nside_football/ They ARE related. Some ideas have been changed by each coach, wrinkles and such - but the same overall principles. In fact, that's why it was so easy for Gibbs to give up Offensive responsibilities to Saunders - he knows the playbook and has "updated" it. Or in the case of Coach Cavanaugh at Pitt while under Billick - when he became OC, Denny Green told him to utilize the West Coast Offense (the Walsh variety) while keeping the playcalls and terminology of the team (which had been the "true" west coast offense). If you'd like the notes on those I can see if I can scan them and send them to you, if you don't want to take my word for it. I'm saddened that you found me to be self-aggrandizing, as I intended to try and take a bit of what I know and have learned in the past year and a half to my favorite football team. But if you want to infer that some of the things (most notably the coach listing issue) is something I just "threw in" I believe you are quite wrong.

One thing I will warn you about with non-Bills fans; if this starts to work the way it should, we're going to hear a lot of guff about injuring people with the sheer number of cut blocks that will occur. A lot of the runs had no holes inside in practice because linemen weren't cut blocking people. Also, as far as "vanilla" - I think Jauron put it best - I think we're going to see a good bit of it, but some of it will stay locked away (like the Reed end-around, the onsides kick drills and stuff I included in my first post over there about camp - which I'll include below): Greetings Bills fans one and all, BillsFann here to give you a bit of a hodgepodge of camp reporting fun. I will warn you ahead of time – I can be quite long-winded and will mention a lot of things that may interest, or may not. Also, I don't have BLM's flair for bringing you "there", but I'll try! Bottom line – I’m a Bills fan that wants to give a little insight into some of the things I saw in and out of camp. Today, I’ll focus on more of the psychological things I saw in and out of camp, tomorrow I’ll put a ton of technical stuff up (including more pictures and a few clips of some great technique I saw during camp) and my thoughts on the camp while I was there. As always, comments, critiques, etc are welcome! Part I: If Buffalo’s TC was a Reality TV Show… I figure since BLM had suggested this, I would start with a few of the notes I’d made he specifically asked I mention to you, the message board community. To start, I noticed a great trend throughout training camp: alliances. They were everywhere. Takeo and Crowell. JP and a good portion of the line. Willis and Holcomb. I figured I’d get this little nugget out of the way first, as it is the most “controversial” so to speak. For those of you who attend camp – watch where JP and Holcomb line up for opening stretches. For those of you who can’t, I’ll tell you where they lined up each day I was there, and what I think it means (though, really what do I know?). Imagine 5 rows of all the Bills players, lined up for individual exercises (sprints, karaokes, side shuffles, etc). Every day, for every exercise Kelly Holcomb and Willis were about 5 ft or so apart, or roughly a row at best. And after every exercise, they’d banter – in fact I remember Willis congratulating Holcomb on winning his sprint group once (but more on Willis later) and Holcomb giving him a pound in reply. Meanwhile, JP was always within five feet of: Jason Peters, Aaron Gibson and Chris V. I think that JP has been listening to the advice Jim has been giving him – talk to your line and focus on your TE when things aren’t going right, which he’s done all three days I’ve been here. In fact, two of the incompletions he was credited with Wednesday were throws to Royal instead of going to a “slightly open” deep option. What do I think this means? While this QB battle may not have much acrimony, both are smart in how they’re interacting with their teammates: inclusive without forcing them to choose sides. Some may not like it; I do. It’s realistic – how many of us do not talk to all of our coworkers at our jobs, yet we always find time for the people that are the “go-to” people when things go “wonky”? As Wyo said, another tandem at camp has been Peerless and Roscoe. In fact, they’re buddy-buddy even off the field, as they were quite cool inside of the local Best Buy after the Monday practice. At every practice I attended, it was almost guaranteed that after a play Peerless would be in Roscoe’s ear (and most of the wideouts for that matter) giving little tips on form. One more thing about the double P: he seems to find ways to get open that the others haven’t (or can’t yet) figured out. He’s another coach on the field and with these youngins’ we could use the help. With the “new” Peerless on the Bills I am reminded of an old phrase: “Young horses run fast, but old ones know the way.” Finally, I wanted to comment on Willis and a few of the relationships he’s fostered during the camp. First of all, during any sort of team exercise you can almost always hear Willis challenging some random person on each line to beat whoever “won” the previous exercise. In addition, Willis seems to be adapting to a leadership role I don’t think I’ve seen out of him to date. Case in point – the night practice. After practice, the guys were all tired and just wanted to shower and relax I’m sure. But not Willis. He chatted with Peters for like 3 minutes and then said “Y’all ready?” and a second later Willis, Preston, Geisinger, Peters, Fowler, Gandy and a few other linemen start doing suicides the width of the field, full speed. How do I know it was full speed? When Willis did the first with the group, he tried to turn for the return trip and sprawled flat out on his back. For a second I was scared, as I thought he twisted his knee. But he got up, laughed it off and caught up to the linemen. They did this for about 5 minutes, then the line was noticeably tired and left. That is when the “Willis Show” began. Willis sprinted several times from the middle of the field to the sidelines, signing autographs and then returning to midfield to go where the most cheers for him were. Toward the end, unless you were a kid, he wouldn’t sign unless you knew some Willis-related trivia, like when he was born. Quite funny and he was quite amused by my friends and I calling the University of Pittsburgh “The U” vs Miami calling themselves “Tha U”. I told him “it’s all about grammar baby” to which he laughed. Random Notes: At the end of the night practice, Nall was practicing with the Man-Beast known as Neufeld, when a throng of fans in the far corner of the stadium began to chant his name psychotically. Eventually, he trotted over to these uber-fans, who elicited a cheer that made me think Jim Kelly just threw his HOF jacket into the crowd. Everyone has a fan base during Training Camp! One technical note I want to sneak in as I love it: In light of the recent rules changes regarding the onside kick, the Bills ST unit practiced a really neat way of going for the ball. Lining up four on each side, three players were positioned behind the four on the right. When Lindell kicked the ball, they (the three) acted as wedge busters to clear out the path for Coy Wire, whose sole job was to recover the kick Lindell aims toward the sideline high (no bounce that I saw) essentially making it a pass via feet to Wire. Over the 3 days I saw onside kick practice once and Wire was the only person who got reps on it, though the lines would occasionally change. I think he’s going to stay. Anyhoo, that’s it outta me tonight. God Bless and I hope you got something out of this report. If not, the “techies” on the board’ll get a kick outta installment two! Pictures are at the following address, with more coming: http://community.webshots.com/user/BillsFann

It seemed to me in camp that the other two were in for the I back sets, but those weren't used nearly as much as the single back sets. I think there are a few shots of them in the I in my album and if not I'll upload some in a few minutes. http://community.webshots.com/user/BillsFann It'll be in an album entitled "I Backs and Slot Motions"

I am really glad you guys enjoyed it too - I've been quite worried that if I ever posted something like that I'd be construed as knowing more than the coaches or something like that. MadBuffaloDisease, I got your second message so feel free to post it. For those of you who aren't on the BB.com msg board here's some videos I took while at camp to show how Denney and Nance are helping in the run game: God Bless and Go Bills!

I've been out here since Sunday BGIM and will most definitely be there tonight. Should be a good time. I'll be sporting a Pitt Cap and prolly my training camp Tee.

Lucky 13...Go USA!

Quick point of reference: Curtis Martin has said numerous times (in fact on a dvd I own called "Athletes in Action: Breakfast of Champions" available on aia.org I think) does not like football, and when he retires will most likely go into the hall of fame. So, for those who think liking football (or any job) means you can't be good at it, I believe you're mistaken. Also, if being eloquent was a prereq for being a football player, Willis should have been an UDFA and Denzel Washington's kid shoud've gone 1st overall... That being said, continue with the lynchin'. I'll get outta the way of the pitchforks and torches...

The only thing I thought was "cheeky" at best was when it coaches (and Losman) mentioned that he was correcting coaches on the play terminology and what was supposed to be run during a camp. Now in hindsight that might be because he knew what he was talking about and they didn't, but the fact that a relative rookie was correcting the HC or OC is something that is quite uncommon. Personally, I think the kid is trying hard to be the best QB he can for the Bills and is getting a crapload of drama for it. And as for Leinart...I didn't like him when he was on USC, because unlike Palmer he never made me think he could be much outside of USC's vunder team.

For everyone who think this defense won't work against the cold and the run-game of the AFC East think about this: when Dungy assembled this defense, it wasn't predicated on where you play it, but on how you play it. Here's his 98/99 Playbook if you want to take a gander at it: http://mav.homeftp.net:5080/GP/defense/Oth...s%20Defense.pdf The key to me is the 5th point of the Defense as he sees it: Quickness. "The quicker the defense, the harder it is for the offensive team to score. it only makes sense if your defense has overall team quickness the better the opportunity to swarm and gang tackle. The best of both worlds is size and quickness but if something has to give, take the quickness. What is more important than size is strength and that is why your weight program is important".

While I agree with the sentiment that the new players, particularly the top three picks are a cut above in terms of the aforementioned qualities, I also find it to be unfair to dismiss Roscoe and the previous picks. Just because Roscoe may speak with a "Florida Boyz" Miami/Southern twang does not disqualify him from being able to communicate with his fellow players. Heck, I enjoyed his interview last year when he mentioned that he felt like as a new player out of the loop, and was depending on the assistance of Kein Everett (and Kevin him) to help with the learning process. Did he say it in a manner which made it difficult for some to understand? Sure. But the effect was the same - he wanted to get better for the TEAM. Even his injury was something that seemed to me to signal he's going all out for the team - diving for a catch in camp and freakishly injurying his arm/forearm. It takes all kinds I guess is the point to me long-winded diatribe...

A bend-but-don't break 3-4 under Walt Corey.

“I tell the offensive guys, ‘You guys can hate me, but I’m going to push you guys as much as I’m going to push myself,’ ” he said. ^From the Article Above If we get rid of a guy because a few of our vets couldn't take him trying to do what they so desperately wanted last year (win now) and couldn't seal the deal because of inexperience...God help this team. If this is going to be the way things go, just go the Al Davis way and sign a re-tread every couple of years for a quarter century and don't worry about drafting a freaking QB. This is sickening...

His contract's up this year, and the Colts have essentially placed a 'for sale' sign on his house for him...

Dave, Peterson just signed a 55 mil contract with the Seahawks...so I think the interest was there, just on the low. In terms of Takeo, I think it'd be better for him to take as long as he needs - if it's mini camp, if it's september. That way he reduces the risk of re-injury and will be able to go out on the field and digest the plays without going nuts.

Sure, why not...The Eagles did that with T.O. on some plays last year (pre suspension) and the year before which amazed me...they'd line him up in the backfield, motion him out and then run the play. You run stuff like that enough, people will be thrown off when you actually use the person to run/block and motion someone else. But I think at the moment we may stick with more "traditional" formations til Fairchild gets an idea of what's going on.

Cool! We usually play around 2:30 on the Cathedral lawn (by the Chapel) every Saturday. Feel free to stop by! I also second Tipster's request for more info on "P-Funk"....

While I'm thinking about it, I just thought of another (more funny than informational) situation where this knowledge helped out: in pick-up football I play with my residents here at Pitt on Saturdays. Usually, there's about 20+ of us, so we can play a full 11-on-11 game with subs. From about early Jan or so, when I play with em, I usually run the defense and a little of the offense of our side. On D, which shocked the heck out of me, we ran a cover two in the tampa mode we want to run here. I was quite amazed to see that with a bunch of 18 and 19 year olds we were able to not only run it effectively (with relatively balanced teams against each other) and get a number of turnovers that "just happened". After the first week we ran it I thought it was just coincidence, but since we've used it the games went from being lopsided depending on who got the "good qb" out of the 20+ of us, to my team winning 4 straight with a revolving qb. Now, this is just silly backyard football with a bunch of kids (me at 24 being the oldest) messing around and enjoying a sport we love. But I can now imagine how well an "offensive" defense like that can work for a lean mean fighting machine like TKO, or Fletch or heck even Posey (though I think Crowell may be more of a better fit should we use more zone than last year) will look in this. Or for someone like me with only marginal speed being able to play safety or mlb because I can read where the Qb's going to throw. I think on Defense, once the coaches finish looking at each player and then evaluating how they fit or who they need to get to fit, we'll see a very fast, very aggressive team like Marv's been saying. The only problem as I see it is over-aggressiveness, or like Gray used to say "trying to do someone else's job". If our safeties play smart and don't bite on the playaction, that goes a long way to stopping the plays that make Brady (and Manning) thorns in the side of defenses, either over the middle or deep.

Well Tipster, thanks much for the well-wishes! I can give you one that jumps right out at me - the Pitt / ND game from last year. Essentially it was the Patriots' O vs the Dolphins' old D. Throughout the game, Charlie Weis and his staff kept Pitt reeling with screens and draws, that we had not a clue how to defend against. Or so I thought until I met with these guys. I can't say entirely for the NFL, but for college the following were obvious to me: 1) Preparation - These guys have awesome technology at their disposal. With that tech, we were able to dissect the game from 8 or so different angles, focusing on everything from the play itself, to how the refs were situated, to what hand signals were being called out. The main facet of this prep was the labeling of plays - before each video we knew (based on the various abbreviations) what formation ND started out with, any formation shifts/motions that were performed and their final set formation before the snap. We also knew how many times they called a play out of said formation, based not only on that game, but three games prior to that game (since it was ND's first game, we looked at the AFC Divisional, Championship and Superbowl - which, let me say was sweet!). Which may lead one to ask, if you have all that data, how the heck do you let the same play go on over and over? Well, this part coincides with the Bills, so you guys'll love this: 2) In-Game Adjustments - DC's like our former DC Gray and Pitt's current DC Rhoads enjoy "being in the trenches" with their players. As a result, they're on the field and cannot see offenses to the level that you can in the booth, as in the booth you see things much like you see coach-cam video - with a heck of a lot more detail. As a result, there are at least 6 or 7 voices chattering over the headsets, giving him an idea of tendencies, formations and situational play calling, which the DC then has to interpret on the fly and call a play. While I can see the morale boost this would be to your players, having that many voices at once in your head while a game is going on has to be a bit daunting. Coupled with a Defensive Minded HC that tunes in and out of that system like Wannstedt (or Jauron in our case) that's got to be even worse. Finally, 3) TV vs Coach Cam: I think this is the biggest thing, which I've alluded to in both 1 and 2. For a great idea of the difference between TV and Coaches' views of plays, I'd refer to Rod Marinelli's PC on the Lions' website, which I now see in hindsight as very astute. To put it simply (as he did), "the film doesn't lie". Sure, we complain about Josh Reed's drops or Gandy being out of position (particularly in that NE game with the Sack of Doom), but to see that Gandy actually had his man blocked and Anderson stumbled in his read of blocking or Reed dropped it not because of a bad throw but because he a DB made a very sophisticated bump right before he caught it is amazing. It's one thing to make an excuse with tv footage - but when you look at the overhead and sideline coach cams you see who jumped offside, who missed a block, who indicated that it was a run or pass and who doesn't break out of their routes quick enough. For an example that also pertains to us, as some would like him drafted by the Bills, we looked at Spencer from Pitt and his play at guard. When coaches say someone graded out as the best player on the line I understand what they mean now - as there are 2-3 (or tons more in the NFL) assistants that go through every snap the player is in and grade them based on those factors. As I'm learning all of this myself, it is changing how I view players - I am trying not to rely solely on people just saying "Josh Reed has terrible skills at WR" I want to see the plays he's in, in particular that TD he got vs NE when he ran around like 5 or 6 people. Sorry for the long wind and lack of humor, but feel free to ask anything else! Hope I helped!

None yet, but I am in a course at my school (Pitt) where I've worked with the coaching staff and have been able to pick their brains involving plays in the NFL and NCAA. God-willing, I should get a grad spot with an SEC school either this summer or next spring. I'm also attending a conference with the Steelers and Panthers at the end of the month. That said, it's amazing to see the difference in film footage on television and from a coach's perspective.