JP-era

But you skipped the trade Travis plus picks for a stud LT thought. I think Tra isnt available.

Dude, agreed its not proven that he can play LT only speculated. And I wont comment on how much, I think we all are virtually clueless on this. I would throw out a figure and you would say no way, my point is that TD manages to get the guys he wants and then everyone seems happy with the contracts. So, its pointless to debate contract terms if we all end up fairly happy with what he does. But fine, I would grab Wahle for 3 mill per + a signing bonus totaling a cap hit of say 3.5 in 2005 which escalates and has incentives if he starts at LT. 3 Mill for a stud G is better than average pay, 3.5 mill that baloons to say 5 mill per if he starts at LT is fairly cheap in my mind if he plays like a top 10 LT.

If your version of conservative mean think things through I am on board, if it means never sign a top flight anything, I dont agree. I see your point on Philly, and I think the Bills are in a similar situation. They have depth in most spots. They are weak on the o-line, this should be addressed through the draft (depth) and FA for starters. I think they have decent depth and a developing CB starter in McGee at corner. S we are set, LB we are set, DE's we have lots of youth and although we could use a stud, it would have to be a FA not another draftee (too mnay already here). At DT, we ares et with Sam, have some depth, but may be missing a starter with Pat set to leave, Id like a draftee or yound guy with potential. TE, way have depth but need an upgrade, WR we are set at #1 and #2, may need another 3 but have depth, RB set at #1 and probably #3, need a #2 (draft). QB, we are set at #1, maybe #2 with Mathews (maybe the draft or a cheap vet), and can always get a #3. I guess, to be specific, Id like to take advantage of the Travis situation to add a stud at a spot where we could sorely use one, LT. I dont know who or how, Pace, Jones, Thomas, Ogden all have very good RB's. It would have to be a guy who is on the verge of stardom. I dont see that from Shelton, just me. Maybe a Gallery trade. I guess I would be willing to give up Travis and picks to land him, It could mean so much for us. Maybe its, dare I say it, McKinnie (ugg I hate the guy but he can play). Maybe Gross, Panthers were interested in Henry at one point I thought. I guess I feel this is our shot to really make a big push and to grab a few studs. Id love for us to make some big trades, the Travis for Shelton thingy is a ho-hummer to me (ho-hummer... I like it ).

So, because he can play LT and is already an outstanding G we should now discard him because he is expecting some more money? That doesnt make sense to me. Anyways, TD has always done a great job of getting the guys he wants at a very decent price and to be honest, the so called capologists that claim we cant or shouldnt afford ____ player tend to be full of it, if TD wants them, TD gets them and signs them to a reasonable contract. I think the same can apply to Wahle and Id love to have him.

Hey, you just keep plugging away until you hit a home run. You dont trade into the 1st to draft a QB and then not give him the reigns. Sorry, thats a waste of a pick. But, you probably felt that way about them drafting a 1st round QB anyway so this is a moot point where you are just continuing to vent your frustration with them getting JP. Ohh well, doesnt matter, hes here, hes starting, so you will just have to deal.

agreed. The only guys I have seen rumors about the Bills looking at is Nugent, Baas, and Clarett (all guys I like) are there others? Ohh, I see the response on Barnes...interesting...time to investigate.

What in your mind is more important for a franchise that is on the verge of the playoffs/SB? Is it draft picks? a) Grabbing a few of the best available players? b) is it building depth with trades down or many picks? Is it FA? a) Grabbing bets available players regardless of position? b) is it trading picks or players for specific stud players? Do you go conservative or aggressive? I lean toward aggressive. It is certainly a boom or bust proposition where teams like NO trade there entrie draft for Ricky, or teams like the Giants trade so many picks for Eli, or on the flip side, teams grab Randy Moss when they already had Jake Reed and Chris Carter. Do I like Randy Moss, no, but I like the move and it has paid of in terms of on the field production. As far as FA, look at Philly, they grab 2 big name players (Kearse and Owens) and make the jump to the SB. And then you have Indy who grabs players like Burress, and lets Peterson go. As far as the draft, what is a 4th round pick really worth? how about a 3rd? even a 2nd? Dont dismiss it until you really think about it. Chances are very good its a bust (probably better than 50%). Chances are also very good that its a player who wont be a solid starter for several years. Does a team thats right on the verge benefit from adding young players that they wont get value from for several years? Why not trade several of these picks for a proven stud who will start day one at a position of need? Do I think NO was smart? absolutley not. Do I think we would be smart to trade say a 2nd and 4th plus Henry for Pace if STL needed a RB? Yes I do. What has Reed and Wire (3rd not 4th) brought to us that isnt replaced from the current roster? What would Pace mean to this offense? What did grabbing a transition tag player like Spikes mean? What could adding a franchise player in a trade mean? And then there is the conservative approach. We could simply sign cheaper versions and hope for them to overachieve or become better than they currently are. Can it happens, yes and it often does. The Pats have made a living from this and have also went the route of stockpiling picks to build talent through the draft. I choose to believe that they are an enigma and not a model to follow. So, my opinion is to be very aggressive and make some serious trades for a few big name players. I believe that will propel us to the upper tier of the league. Just my 10 cents.

Flutie Hansen Cowart McGahee (hell yeah)

I heard an interesting tidbit, they can only interview 60 players on each team.

Baas? Clarett I heard Nugent?

Well, I havent looked at this angle. Truth be known, im not opposed to that. My hang up is in taking a risk on Shelton, who appears to be a risk based on overweight issue and demotion, at LT. We need an UPGRADE to Jennings at LT with a young QB at the helm. Its too important of a position to take a risk. Could Shelton turn out to be a pro-bowler, sure. Could e turn out to be a liability, sure. I guess Id just prefer to have someone who is more solid at the LT spot. Its not a sure thing that the Bills intend to play Shelton at LT either, several people have commented that Shelton should move inside to G, maybe they have that in mind. I dont think thats the case, but who knows, we will have to see. Now, if Wahle can truly play LT or LG, and Shelton can play T or be moved to G, I see no problem in adding both. We again add to versatility and can let McNally sort out where they fit best. Is it Wahle at LT, Shelton at LG or vice versa. Is it Mike Williams at LT, Wahle at LG and Shelton at RT (my favorite), who knows. I dont mind this option. What I am concerned with is getting Shelton and a G who can only play G and then forcing Shelton to play LT with no backup option if he fails.

Get a pick from Travis and skip Shelton. Grab Mike Wahle instead, at G he is a stud and GM's are thinking he would make a better LT prospect than Jennings http://www.ffmastermind.com/quickbits.php I like this move better. Id sign Wahle and then draft a David Baas type who can play G or C, this adds the versatility to let McNally figure out who is best where and fill sour LT need with aguy who may be a better prospect than Jennings, something Shelton is NOT IMO. So, Sign Wahle. He can play either LG or LT. Get a draft pick for Travis and draft David Baas who will start day one at LG or C and then Wahle can move to LT or stay at LG and move Teague to LT. Lots of options and we add the best available o-lineman in FA and one of the best o-lineman from the draft with LOTS of versatility as to where they play.

No interest in any of the listed players or the opinions of the responding posters..Thanks anyways.

Height: 6-4 Weight: 325 lbs. Pos: Defensive Tackle Age: 26 Born: July 25, 1978, Lake City, FL Drafted: 2001, 1st Round, 3rd Pick by Cleveland Browns. Experience: 4 years College: Florida DEFENSE STATS YEAR TEAM G GS TOT SOLO AST PD SACK FF REC INT YDS TD 2001 CLE 15 15 61 52 9 6 5.0 0 0 0 0 0 2002 CLE 16 16 40 32 8 2 2.0 2 2 0 0 0 2003 CLE 16 15 32 25 7 1 5.5 0 2 0 0 0 2004 CLE 13 13 19 15 4 0 4.0 2 0 0 0 0 CAREER 60 -- 152 124 28 9 16.5 4 -- 0 0 0 2004 Scouting Report - Football Scouts Inc. Name: Gerard Warren Position: Defensive Tackle Grade: 72 | Key Alert: None Comment: Warren has everything you are looking for in a DT including size, athleticism, outstanding speed and quickness, and when focused, he can be an extremely active penetrating DT. He can play with good leverage at times, he will use his hands well and maintain good separation from the offensive linemen, and knows how to get off blocks, but he doesn't always do it. He is a little bit of an undisciplined player in terms of reading and reacting but that's really not his game. Needs to be on the move, he needs to have the ability to beat the offensive lineman with one step quickness, and he has the skills to be an outstanding interior pass rusher. Doesn't show a lot of interest in playing the run, while he can stack at the point of attack, he does not always shed with consistency, and he simply does not like to mix it up inside. Overall, Warren has a tremendous upside and should gradually improve if he stays healthy and maintains good physical conditioning. This is his write up going into the 2004 season. he is on the verge of double digit sack seasons when not hurt and his numbers seem good, plus he is 26.

There is a total of 2 people on my ignore list. I have no problem with disagreement, but I think a select few have a problem with it and then resort to childish responses. Tolerance is a virtue, dont like my posts, dont read. Save the nasty cracks and sarcasm.

NFL Offseason, players being released, Bills board meant for football related talk, throwing names out to see what people think. Yeah, all that sounds inappropriate.

Its coming back to me, wasnt it a QB he was gunning for?

I dont remember the specifics of what he said or did, something around destroying a players career?

welcome to the ignore list, I hope you enjoy your stay here.

Pat is probably gone and Warren is probably the Browns best player, Henry to the Browns?

Already commented on this a few months agao, YES, I believe the Bills would take him in the 5th round, 4th may be a bit high. Hes a high risk, high reward kind of RB, and when you dont need a starter it would be a great move.

Is that a challenge on my fanhood? I an agreeing that a LT is a tough spot to play for sure. I think its tough to find a really good one. Lets hope Shelton is worthy of all of your admiration.

yeah, dont you have a sharp-as-a-bowling-ball quick and short retort to lay on some other post like a big fat rotten egg?

Ahh, name calling sounds like the AOL IM server is down. Grow up, kid. Once you do you will be removed from the ignore list.

Apparently theres no shortage of posters whos best days are behind them either!