1billsfan

Matt Cassel replies, “Why would he do that?”

You can be sure that Kaepernick and his 19 million a year contract will probably be cut outright when they finish around 4-12 and have a very long rebuilding road ahead of them. That's probably going to be one QB name on the list of potential veteran QBs the Bills will look at if none of the current QBs are the answer this year. Other potential QBs available through trade or free agency could possibly be Wilson, E. Manning, Bradford, Brees, Rivers, RGIII. Some are obviously long shots, but those QB contracts have got out of hand. Eventually a team will do the unthinkable and move on instead of paying one player, franchise QB or not, 20 million a year. I looks like the Bills won't see the same vast wasteland in the QB market that they did this past offseason if it comes down to that (hopefully the answer at QB is here though!).

No, "too raw" was only meant regarding why he wasn't considered a first round pick. EJ was always a "boom or bust" type of QB prospect. Some never believed in him at all, some have closed the book after two years and some still believe he may develop into a winning franchise QB. I'm in the latter group up until around mid season this year. That's the point where he should have the playbook down pat and the experience to where the game slows down and he's becoming a consistently productive and winning starting QB.

You just pointed out the reason why he was considered too raw to pick in the first round. If he looked great in all those games than the Bills would have never had a shot at him. I was just showing a full college game example of him making the type of plays that transfer to the NFL level. It wasn't meant to be proof that he's ever going to make it. Just that there's hope he could.

IMO if EJ isn't starting, making plays and winning games by mid season than that will be very disappointing because this truly is the "make or break" year we all should start seeing consistent signs that he's well on his way to becoming the long term franchise QB for the Bills. There really should be a big jump in his level of play this year.

Sorry my bad, by "emotionally" I meant that he just did not seem to have the authenticity of being the leader yet. He just seemed like a man-child who would always say the right things but you knew he was just saying what people wanted to hear. I think now that he's turned 25 he's probably naturally grown out of that stage just being a couple of years older.

EJ’s last game in college (has all his passes I think)… :54 unfreaking real play fake 5:40 great scrambling ability 6:30 very impressive scrambling w/ TD pass to the corner 9:32: sick QB draw TD from 10 yard line EJ was always a guy who should have had two or three years on the bench to learn the NFL game because he was just plain raw (mentally, emotionally and mechanically). If an NFL team did this then they could very well have a bonified franchise QB on their hands because he is someone who would apply themselves to the fullest to get the most out of his abilities. If we start seeing EJ get a handle on things then look out, it's on. The EJ haters sadly continue to play a very silly and simple game of “See, I told you he doesn’t have it!” with a QB who needed actual, old fashioned DEVELOPMENT. Imagine when EJ will be able to comfortably apply those sick skills he showed in his last college game in the NFL. Will he always have a few clunkers and probably never be considered an all pro passer? Sure. But there’s so much more a QB can do to win ball games. EJ has those kind of intangible 4th quarter, go win the game skills that helps negate not having the gleaming top passing stats.

While that may have been true last year, I think that the now older and wiser Manuel gives the Bills just as good of a chance as Cassel. Cutting to the chase, Cassel doesn't have that big, fast mobile QB x-factor that Manuel provides. Is Cassel slightly more accurate? Sure, but Manuel will force the opposing defense to defend the whole field plus the QB in red zone situations if Manuel does indeed have trust from his coaches and in himself to start using his legs with semi-regularity and with success. The Bills were a joke in the red zone whether it was with Manuel or with Orton. IMO the red zone issues don't change that much with Cassel in there and the record isn't any better with him either. As for Taylor, I see him as a real wild card and if he's the surprise winner then I'm all in because like EJ, he would provide that x-factor in the red zone. The Bills offense will be scary if either Manuel or Taylor becomes a successful running threat to go along with being at least an average NFL passing QB. The Bills need to see what they have in either Manuel or Taylor this year because IMO there will be at least two and maybe even three big QB names available next year through trade or free agency. Wilson, E. Manning, Brees, Kaepernick, RGIII are QBs who their current teams may move on from given how crazy the salary cap comes into play and whether a teams just wants to move on with that 20 million in their pocket to rebuild with a younger guy. Let's first see if the guy is here already.

You do realize that these two back to back sentences are completely opposite to each other? You clearly aren't being "open minded" if you think that all indications are that EJ is incapable of stepping up. That statement was so biased. It sounds like you are squarely in the "all MC or nothing" group to me.

Or it could be a quid pro quo. Bills give him premo stuff during the season in exchange for him being used as a motivational tool for the Bills players that they need answers on this season. If the Bills are doing this then I think they should stop it. They have a lot of good will now and it seems like NFL players want to play here. Why mess with that? It's either true or it's not true, and if it's not true then the obvious reason is for motivational purposes.

EJ Manuel might be traded or cut. Cordy Glenn might become a back up. Anyone see a pattern of bs here from Carucci? Is he really this gullible, or is he knowing being used like a tool.

Matt Cassel is a one dimensional QB and Roman (with Harbaugh of course) has already proven that he prefers a multi-dimensional QB over a one dimensional QB (Smith/Kaepernick). So expect either Taylor or Manuel to win the starting job, whoever doesn't win it will be the backup and Cassel will be the 3rd string QB in case of an emergency meltdown of both athletic QBs ahead of him. Rex isn't afraid of letting coaches and players be free to do what they do. There's no doubt in my mind that Greg Roman plans on a triple option offense where the defense has to make split decisions in accounting for Watkins, Harvin, McCoy, Clay and either Manuel or Taylor running the ball in the open field. Cassel doesn't have the speed or athletic ability to execute it (his joke about being "catlike out there" might be a tip off that the QB has to be athletic and mobile in this new offense). Now if this new offense doesn't work by mid season, then you are talking about the Bills possibly going to the traditional ground and pound with Cassel entering the picture as the starting QB. BTW, if both Manuel and Taylor look horrible in training camp and preseason games then the Bills would probably go straight to starting Cassel. So that is a valid option where Cassel would become the starter and they would just pretty much scrap the triple option offense all together. I just don't think that either Manuel or Taylor will look bad enough to scrap it.

That's the thing though, Sammy and Woods are babies in NFL career timeline-wise, not personal attack-wise. They're kind of clueless in that respect. These two WRs do not yet know that the NFL is not a Madden football video game. That it takes actually time to develop as an NFL QB. Do they know that Orton sucked much worse than Manuel in his early career? That Brees sucked too? So to did Eli Manning? Kurt Warner wasn't good until he was 28 years old? Tony Romo got to have two years of development time? And on and on and on... The transition from college QB to NFL QB is huge. It's been said so many times, but I think that there is a contingent of fans here that just want to bury their heads in the sand and pretend that you're either good or you're not at the QB position. That there is simply no way you can get better once you have played and it did not go smoothly. Exhibit A is right on our team and his name is Jerry Hughes. Was he always this great or did he need a few years to make the transition to the NFL game? Think that Indy wished they had patience? Sammy and Robert were kind of being young clueless kids not understanding the fact that the vast majority of QBs take time. Turnabout is fair play though, because if Manuel does win the job and plays very well, he will have every right to rip into both Sammy and Robert on the field if they screw up. If they think they are good enough to make grand jesters during a game towards the QB, then they are good enough to take it from the QB.

Are you on something? Simms is obviously replacing Tuel as the fourth QB. If they ever kept Matt Simms over one of the other three (baring any injury reasons) then it's truly time for the Buffalo Bills franchise to admit they don't know what they are doing and call it quits.

These threads are getting ridiculous. Simms is a camp arm who's only other NFL training camp option other than the Jets was the Bills. If Simms makes the team over Manuel, Taylor or Cassel then I'm done with the Bills until a new GM and coaching staff is in place.

You talking about practice? Practice? I hate to tell you (actually I really don't), but you find out almost nothing about an NFL QB's prospects in practice (or preseason games for that matter). Whaley is going to keep Manuel around to see what he does if or when he does get his chance to start in real games. He's not dumb enough to think young QBs have no shot at getting better after only 14 starts into their careers. Even if there's only a 5% shot, Whaley is taking it.

You changed my reply from the word "known" to "speculated". I gave you video proof of Whaley saying that he was integral part of drafting Manuel. Even if he's lying as you suggest he is, he is the current GM and he took big time ownership using the word "integral" in drafting Manuel. I don't think he was lying, I think that he was just being respectful to the outgoing GM Nix. So Whaley has indeed tied himself to Manuel that can't simply be walked back. He can't dump Manuel and say that he was Nix's pick all along and that he's looking forward to drafting his guy. Good, bad or ugly, EJ Manuel is forever tied to Whaley's resume because of what he said at the time. I don't think there's any chance that Whaley risks Manuel flourishing with another team in 2015. Another thing, if Manuel actually does become a great franchise QB for the Bills and they win a Superbowl with him as their QB, then Whaley is suddenly looking like he's on a legendary GM path. The Manuel dream is probably not such an easy dream to give up on for him. I think that he wants to see Manuel's third full year with the Bills before he's ready to give up and Rex and Roman know and accepted that deal.

I didn't have an issue with the pick either. I was at first relieved it wasn't Nassib, and then I was happy that they were taking a flyer on Manuel who I saw play in a few FSU games and thought he looked like a play making QB with a lot of potential given his size and athletic ability.

So EJ Manuel's head coach was so bad he only had one good move, and that move was to bench EJ Manuel? Seems logical. BTW, in his rookie season EJ Manuel had the Atlanta Falcons on the ropes twice before Stevie Johnson and Scott Chandler fumbled the game and the season's hopes away. Manuel looked like a real NFL franchise QB in the fourth quarter and OT of that game.

Eli Manning 14 games into his career: 50% Comps 16 TDs 14 INTs 12 point lower QB rating than Manuel 0 vs 3 rushing TDs compared to Manuel Did the Giants cut or trade Manning? Did they even consider those options for a nanosecond? Did they throw stuff out there to reporters to let it get out to the public that he's on the outs? One thing the Giants do much better than the Bills and that's trusting and not wavering on their big decisions like QB. The Bills have looked very bush league with the leaks and whispers about Manuel being on the outs. If it's true, then the Bills deserve whatever punishment Manuel dishes out to them in his future career playing on another team. If it's not true then the Bills are acting a little classless playing mind games in hopes it fires up their QB. Doug Whaley in particular has looked very weak in all of this. If I were him I'd start firing the people who are leaking the info and if it's Rex or Roman tell them that they have been officially warned to either cut the crap or take a hike. There will be big names wanting this job, they don't have to beg for great coaches to come here anymore. I think that for the longest time the Bills have been run like a small minded organization which always seems to defer to "safe mode" because they live in constant fear of being embarrassed. Wouldn't it be ironic if they let EJ go and he crushes it with Chip Kelly and the fearless Eagles while the ultra-cautious Bills are starting Matt Cassel and his bottom of the barrel starting QB stat lines and wondering "what if" they kept EJ Manuel on the team and trusted him enough to let him play his game.

Awesomely funny, coming from you.

7th round pick vs the gamble of possibly watching a genius like Chip Kelly quickly develop Manuel into a successful QB while the Bills still have nobody and are starting to look towards the 2016 rookie draft class. Oh sure, that 7th round pick is so darn worth that kind of gamble! There's no way that Whaley is dealing Manuel this year IMO. These guys just don't want to believe it until it's official. It should be crazy around here if Manuel is actually named the starter a couple of weeks before the season begins.

No one here is denying that EJ has serious faults in his game. Having said that, me and others are looking forward to seeing what he does being coached by both a successful NFL head coach and offensive coordinator. Coaching is truly EJ's last possibly valid excuse. There's no denying how bad Marrone and Hackett were because Kyle Orton looked just about as bad as EJ in their offense after his first few starts with the Bills. The beauty is that this is actually going to happen. Opinions will either be vindicated or they won't be.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-total-access/0ap2000000202160/Doug-Whaley-s-vision-for-Bills-future

EJ could lose the QB competition in camp/preseason games, then start during the regular season either because of injury or poor play from the starter and win back the job through his play on the field. Football is a funny game. From the reports, EJ looked horrible in last year's training camp, yet he played well in the first two real games against Chicago on the road and at home against Miami. The only real judge for whether a guy is an NFL QB worth anything is in regular season games. There seems to be an accelerated timeline for Manuel. What was once a normal three year window for QBs, has now become only two years for this one guy all of a sudden. I just don't get the rush to see him leave.