Bob in STL
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Posts posted by Bob in STL
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Cardinal Sin .. but we will let it go.
Let not forget that Sestak is our Best Ever at DT, Hull our Best Ever at Center. For WR it it tough to mix eras but I go in this order
1. Reed
2. Butler
3. Moulds
4. Dubenion
I am talking about play "as a Bill".
We have many honorable mentions at this position, such as Lofton, Chandler, Rashad, JD Hill. Lofton and Rashad did a lot with other teams too.
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You guys are forgetting the 60's, we have Billy Shaw in the HoF and several on the all-time AFL team!!
My picks in order, by positon:
QB- Jim Kelly, Joe Ferguson, Jack Kemp.
HB- Thurman Thomas, O.J. Simpson, Cookie Gilchrist
FB- Jim Braxton
WR- Andre Reed, Jerry Butler, Elbert Dubenion, Eric Moulds
C- Kent Hull
G- Joe Delameillure, Billy Shaw, Jim Richter
T - Will Wolford, Stu Barber, Howard Ballard
TE- Pete Metzelaars, Ernie Warlick
DE- Bruce Smith, Phil Hansen, Ron McDole, Aaron Schobel
DT- Tom Sestak, Fred Smerlas, Ted Washington
OLB- Cornelius Bennett, Daryl Talley, Mike Stratton
ILB - Chris Spielman, Jim Haslett, Shane Conlon, Harry Jacobs
CB- Butch Byrd, Robert James, Nate Odomes
S- George Saimes, Tony Greene, Henry Jones
P-Brian Moorman, Paul McGuire
PK- Steve Christie, Pete Gogalak
HC- Marv Levy, Lou Saban
Many on the honorable mention list.
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BS - The cap was not a 6 year problem. TD cleared out the cap issue in two years, just like any other GM could do. Cutting expensive players and playing rookies is not hard or ingenious, but all teams get to that point sooner or later.
It is unfair because Butler sacrificed the cap to keep a team of veteran players together for one more run at the Super Bowl. The last legitimate run was the year of the "homerun throwback". Ralph was desperate for a title if you recall and Ralph was on board with the direction. Ralph tried to re-sign Butler to a new contract but Butler was evidently pissed about Ralph's interference with Wade, and also the Flutie-Johnson debacle. That is why he left. He did not run away from the cap.
Butler could have gutted the team and stockpiled draft picks just like TD did. That was not the directed that managemnent wanted to go.
I look at Butlers drafting and scouting record over his entire career and I say he was one of the best. I don't think he was a great GM in all aspects of the job, but he was excellent at judging talent. Ask Polian, Levy, Smith, etc.
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RIP Mr Hunt - a true visionary.
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I often wondered why Hunt did not support Ralph more in Ralph's recent crusade for the small market teams. Could it be that Mr. Hunt was very ill and had no fight left?
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Ralph spent 5 years riding the rough seas with that ass Tom Donahoe, How much longer was he supposed to ride it out with the guy, 5 more??
It was Tom Donahoe that created all of those problems, it was Tom Donahoe that had total free reign to call the shots and it was Tom Donahoe that sent Drew packing after the one O.K. season that he actually had.......
Of course you will tell me how great these guys are. They were such good people, but actually you have nothing to base that on, other than the words spoken about them in the media by some other
great guy working in the league..........Since when does anybody in the NFL actually come out and say, hey that guy is a total ass, I worked from him in bla bla bla and he was a total ass......
Everyone in the league, is always washing each other's ass ..
Tom Donahoe the great, has yet to be mentioned for any postion in the 30 other NFL cities......
Gee I wonder why, with that stellar reputation and all, one would think he'd be a hot prospect for something other than, Sirius NFL Network, Hey Pat Kirwin look out, Tom the great Donahoe is lookin for work........... Or wil it be ESPN Draft Coverage, didn't they have Jerry the great Glanville workin there for awhile.........
Spare me the Great People got fired for no reason lecture....it is tiresome.
Oh by the way, Marv didn't seem to have any trouble getting good people to return his calls about a coaching vacancy........
I agree. I can't handle people that blame Ralph and call him cheap. He is not perfect but give me a break. This crap about Bills fans being mean to Mularkey and his family is a joke. Buffalo is one of the most benign places for a celebrity to live in.
And what about TD calling out fans about the treatment to Gregg and Meathead? Ralph treats the fans like paying customers, something TD never did.
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In late 2002 / early 2003, after two years of Butler, I had read an article where there were concerns with the Chargers salary cap. The article noted that in about 1-2 years, unless something was done, the Chargers were going to be in trouble with their salary cap.
As gruesome as it sounds, the best thing that happened to San Diego is Butler died, thereby turning over control to Smith.
Yes, not all of Butler's moves were great ones. The same can be said for any GM. Your comment on the salary cap is completely unfair.
Smith has done a great job, and so did Butler before him. Lets leave it at that.
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Butler saw the writing on the wall. He was the GM here for 6 years after Polian was sent packing. He built a team with veterans and knew that 1999 would be his last shot. He did not want to face the cap mess that he had created. He kept dodging requests by Wilson to negotiate a contract. Ralph being cheap to pay his GM was conveniently used as an excuse to get out of Buffalo and he had the opportunity at San Diego where he could start over again. A.J. Smith was Butlers right hand man and he moved on when Butler did.
Also, look at some of the help the chargers have received. In a 5 year span during the Butler/A.J. Smith regime, they got to PICK #1 TWICE. And in both those years they were able to parlay that #1 pick into multiple first rounders due to the guy that was available #1. In 2001, they traded the rights to Michael Vick and moved down 3 spots to get L.T, as Running back was a big need for them. It is not like Smith had vision of LT being the greatest RB ever and picked him at #1 spot. Then in 2004, luck stuck again, as Eli Manning refused to play in SD and wanted to play in New York . This pushed another bunch of 1st round picks into the lap of the chargers when they all along wanted to pick the more complete QB in Phillip Rivers. To make it even better, their starting QB who had stunk up the joint for 4 years, forcing them to go QB with their #1 pick suddenly became a super star in the league allowing their new QB to sit on the bench and learn.
In that same period we picked once in the top 5 (#4) and we could neither trade up nor trade down to pick an impact player. All we got for that was Mike Williams. Talk about fortunes swinging towards San Diego.
.... and he and AJ did not miss on a single pick. Trading the Vick pick was awesome, give credit. Picking LT, was also an awesome move. Then they drafted Brees and stuck witrh him. Call it luck but these guys did not make a mistake either. SD was the worst franchise in the league until Butler showed up!
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Good article. I met John Butler once and we talked football for a good 30 minutes. What a great guy. He loved football and he loved the Buffalo fans.
I wish Butler would have stayed in Buffalo, gutted the team that was in cap hell, and then rebuilt it with AJ Smith at his side.
I do believe we would have seen better football then we did in the TD era. I don't even want to hear about Butler's last draft, I am looking at his entire career when i make these statements.
The Butler-Smith connection makes me pull for the Chargers in the playoffs.
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Somehow that meathead has managed to take one of the very worst OLines in the entire NFL, a crappy WR corps and 2 bad quarterbacks and come up with an offense that is in the top half of the AFC.
Good thing we have SFairchild leading us to the NFL's 30th ranked offense. Maybe you ought to reconsider which sideline you'll be throwing crap at from a safe distance while you hide behind your buddies.
Come on now, so you miss Meathead?
Pittsburgh won a Super bowl without him and with essentially a rookie at QB. Buffalo's offense has improved without him, despite the 30th ranking. Maybe Miami's talent is better than you think?
I sure don't want to see anyone throw things at Meatmeat. I just want to win on the scoreboard.
cheers!
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There have been some positives this season, like reasonably hanging around the Colts and Chargers, and making the final scores of those games look closer than they really were, but on the other side of the equation is needing the last play of the game to beat Houston, losing to Detroit, and coming up with a ridiculous pass-happy gameplan against Chicago.
Ultimately, though, in this week's game Dick Jauron made lots of little mistakes that made an already-tough game even harder for the Bills to win.
1) On 4th and inches, Dick Jauron decides to not go for it, down by 10. (I also wonder if the play might not have been challengeable - I thought that we got a bad spot.) O.k., reasonable people can disagree on this one - especially since he's been burned on some bad 4th downs earlier this season. Dick Jauron also, for whatever reason, chose not to challenge a possible fumble early in the game as well.
2) After the big sideline catch, Dick Jauron took a timeout, and then decided during the timeout to conduct a challenge. That's pretty bad. What is absolutely unacceptable is that Dick Jauron did not have anyone on his staff in the coaches box who KNEW THE NFL RULES!!!! This play had an absolutely crystal-clear replay angle with it, and Dick Jauron's staff had a full timeout to look at the replay - at minimum, all they had to do was watch the CBS feed of the game. It is essential for his staff to be able to make an accurate "red flag" recommendation to him when they have a full timeout to review the play. It is sad to me that the Bills beat writers are slow to criticize Dick Jauron for this, since most sportswriters don't know the rules - but Ralph Wilson is spending hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of our ticket revenues on Dick Jauron's staff. Is it really so much to ask that Dick Jauron hire a staff who KNOWS THE NFL RULES??!!!!????!!!!??? Ed Hochuli knew the rules, surely the Buffalo Bills can hire someone who knows the rules.
3) Speaking of not knowing the rules, at the end of the first half, the Bills were stopped just shy of a 1st down deep in their own end, and San Diego quickly called a timeout. The referees, however, decided to conduct a measurement, and so San Diego was not charged a timeout. What the Bills inexplicably forgot, however, is that after this measurement, the clock starts again!!! Instead, the Bills went ahead and snapped the ball for the punt without thinking - giving the Chargers just enough time to score a touchdown before the half in a game that they ultimately won by three points.
Yes, this is just a little thing, but little things win football games - and right now, I am not convinced that Dick Jauron is doing them....
JDG
I am tired of this commentary.
Yes -- Jauron made a mistake with the challenge after the time out. OK. There was confusion and indecision. Name a coach who has not made a few mistakes over the course of a season. Head coaches make hundreds of decisions every game. Even the great Bellichek makes some questionable moves from time to time.
The Bills problem is talent and youth in key positions. They are making good and steady progress but they still have a ways to go to be a strong playoff team.
I think the Bills are very well prepared. Other than maybe two games they have been very competitive and could easily have have a few more wins.
Jauron is doing fine, and so is his staff. Give them time. It took Levy several years to get the Bills winning and he had far more talent to work with.
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he was late getting to almost every hole yesterday. i honestly think we need to bench him. better crowell, fletcher and ellison or wire. has to be an upgrade.
i know, he is injured, a leader, yada, yada, yada....he needs to go the way of Vincent and ride off into the sunset. he has all the explosion of your grandmother.
He does not stink, he is still not fully recovered. It is still way to early to give up on a great player like TKO. Have you no loyalty and honor?
Crowell is out for the season.
I will take half a TKO over a whole Ellison and two Coy Wires combined.
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This writer has been around for a long time. He has some interesting takes on AFL history.
http://www.signonsandiego.com/sports/nfl/m...-1s3nflcol.html
Nice article but I found an error in this quote ... "It also was the game in which the Bills' Tom Strattong delivered what became known as “the hit heard 'round the world,” shattering Keith Lincoln's ribs. Two weeks later, Lincoln played in an AFL All-Star game. Damn, he was tough. "
The writer is referring Mike Stratton who is on the Bills Wall of Fame and is also on the All Time AFL Team (second team).
There was lots to love about the AFL. That league gave opportunities to black players that were not always given in the NFL. There were so many great and exciting players, a wide open game, and most teams had really nice looking uniforms. After the merger the AFL teams were dominating the NFL for several years.
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Jerry Sullivan's article today is right on the money. The Bills are 5-7. going 3-2 since the break with close losses to the two best teams in football. Of the 7 losses thus far, 5 have come from teams with 9 or more wins and one with 7(Jets). The only bad loss was against Detroit.
So Levy/Jauron are on track in turning things around. Losman is making progress, the O-line is better though only average(which is better than well below average as it has been for years) and the D-line still needs a stud tackle. But the team is young, and these needs and some other lesser ones manageably can be addressed in the off-season.
If the Bills can win 2 of the final 4, they would go 7-9. Given a year with the new regime under our belts, a solid off-season acquisition-wise, and a little luck, 10 wins next year might be doable. That would be an excellent turnaround after 5 years of gross mismanagement. I at last have some hope for the future--a precious commodity indeed as a Bills fan...CD
Good post.
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Your correct and incorrect. In Canada, Australia, and in the UK, "defense" is spelled defence. Maybe the fan who posted this is from Canada.
So lighten up Francis.
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Jauron. I'm starting to question his ability as a coach (when to use timeouts). He's way too conservative at the end of the game. (Let me clarify what I'm saying. I like Jauron. I think he's a great coach and has made Bills fans comfortable in coaching staff for once. It's just the timeouts. I hope he coaches for year to come, but he needs to know when and where to use the timeouts.)
Also the refs. You can't forget about them.
The main reason why we lost!Why must you blame someone every time we lose?
Jauron and Co. did a fine job getting this team ready for a much more talented opponent. They made some good adjustments at halftime too.
As for the refs, I think they missed a pass ineterference on Reed and that hurt us. Still, the Bills missed many plays on their own.
Blame the team. We had no running game, too many 3 and outs by the offense, too many turnovers, we gave up big yardage on the ground, and we could not cover Gates at all. That is your answer. The team lost as a team.
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I just read JP's entry on Wikipedia and was fascinated to find out that he was half Mexican. In all honesty, the only nationality I ever assumed was that shared by Robert Zimmerman and Adam Sandler...
Is there a precedent of ANY kind of Mexican quarterback in the NFL?
Ole, JP! Y en este domingo, vaya con dios!
Jim Plunkett. Tom Flores.
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I can't figure out what our troubles are against the run, because it seems like there's too much talent in the front 7 to let it happen. Schobel, Spikes, Crowell, and Fletcher are unquestionable, starting-caliber players. Triplett, Williams, and Hargrove aren't playing badly. What's missing?
What is missing?
1. First of all Schoebel is average against the run. Fletcher and Crowell can make tackles if the DT's eat space and take up some blockers. For that we need more stout DT's. Hargrove usually only plays DT on passing downs. Williams is getting tired as the season goes on and is getting handled by older, bigger, stronger opponents. He will be better next season. Anderson is marginal. We need a true run stuffer to replace Anderson.
2. Sometimes the LBs are not staying in lanes, then they get seal off.
3. Spikes is a shadow of himself and has only 2.5 assists in the past two game, no solo tackles.
4. Whitner is not playing the run very well. Arm tackles, misses, and over pursuit. He is doing OK for a rookie but his tackling needs work. Ditto for Ko Simpson.
That explains the run defense.
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I was very very impressed with the O-Line, which has me doing a double take. I know we can improve this line this offseason and have to do so, but right now each of these five is doing a nice job and exceeding reasonable expectations. It's an understatement to say that Jauron's bye week shuffle has really worked out.
Jauron's move was the right one at the right time. Peters is an improvement at LT, Gandy is an improvement at LG, and Pennington is holding his own RT. Heck, I see no reason to play Villareal ever again, let Preston keep the job.
All the Gandy bashers need to admit that the middle of our OL, which has been a sieve for years, is much better with Gandy at LG.
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1) Forget the stats for this game. I cannot imagine why any Bills Fan would not want to keep London Fletcher on our football team in 07.
2) What I am telling you is that Jason Peters played at a pro-bowl level today. Can you even begin to imagine what he could do in 07 playing next to a true left guard?
3) It is hard to come up with words to say just how bad Tim Anderson is. As for Williams, horrid games are to be expected from a 5th round rookie but make no mistake about it, he was God awful, and I am being kind.
4) You see, Lee Evans is turning into a superstar before our eyes. Time for an extension? That's right......a !@#$ superstar.
5) OK, he was a guard, but a player named John (Hog) Hannah used to block superstar DT Randy White, and then kick the living snot out of a defensive back. What I am trying to illustrate is just how good Jason Peters has the potential to be.
6) In the "credit where it is due" dept., Whitner played well today.
7) You people worry too much about qbs in general. That said, JP got lucky today, but he also showed that he can make it in this football league.
8) Honestly, I never thought that I would see the day that Roscoe Parrish could win a game for the Buffalo Bills Football Team.
9) By the way, Jason Peters looks like a player.
10) GO BUFFALO BILLS FOOTBALL TEAM!!!!!!!!!!GO BILLS FANS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
1) Agree. Fletcher is one of the best players on the team.
2) I am not ready to anoint Peters with a Pro-Bopwl, but he is getting better. Gandy is doing a great job at LG. He was a guard in college and should stay at there.
3) you must get better TV angles than we do to see that detail on the DL? I could not make that assessment. Williams took a bad panalty. Anderson is a limited player and may be gone next season.
4) OK
5) So now your comparing Peters to a Hall of Fame Guard from the 70's? FYI --- Playing for NE, how many games do you think Hannah actually played against Randy White?
6) Whitner was a non-factor against the run.
7) JP made his breaks too.
8) Why not?
9) Peters for State Senator!
10) Rah Rah!
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Another Article About John Butler...
in The Stadium Wall Archives
Posted
yeah right, give them no credit.