Logic
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Posts posted by Logic
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11 hours ago, GunnerBill said:
They have done a lot for their CB depth this offseason.
Suddenly I think we have 4 viable boundary corners. This time last year I wasn't convinced we had 2.... and my fears on Vontae were well founded.
Agreed.
It starts with the fact that McDermott and Beane identified and drafted (or signed via UDFA) what appears to be a high quality starting trio in White, Wallace, and Johnson. This allowed them to then roll the dice on two injury prone but extremely talented cornerbacks in Gaines and Johnson. If one or both of them stay healthy, the Bills have outstanding depth in the secondary for the first time in a long time. It's impressive how quickly they turned over the secondary and turned it from a question mark into a major strength.
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17 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:
They didn’t take one last year until the 4th... or 2016 (former regime) they waited until the 6th.
That's true.
In continuing to think about this....I also think that Levi Wallace has a chance to be damn good. Ditto Taron Johnson. If my feeling is correct, the Bills have a starting three locked in on cheap deals for the next 4 years. There simply isn't space for a high draftee at corner to get significant snaps. I suppose the only way you feel good about it is if you think the draftee would be an upgrade over Wallace, which would push him out of the job and relegate him to "1st off the bench" status. Personally, though, I want to give Wallace a chance to shine as CB2. And it's not as if they're not going to make him earn it. He'll have serious competition from EJ Gaines (who we already know can be a good CB2 for this team) and Kevin Johnson (a guy with 1st round pedigree). And even IF one of those two guys beats out Levi Wallace, what's top stop the Bills from re-signing them and STILL having their top 3 locked in?
At the end of the day, if a cornerback is truly the no-doubt-about-it BEST PLAYER AVAILABLE when their 2nd or 3rd round pick came up and they decided to take him, so be it. I'm not gonna freak out or anything. I realize the importance of cornerbacks to football in the year 2019. I just think there are better avenues to take this year. -
16 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:
I wouldn’t say I’m “for it”, but I can see them taking a corner in the 2nd or 3rd. From a roster building standpoint it does make sense to me, because these draft picks are theirs for 4 years. The draft is not just for this year, they are building the team for now and for the future. They don’t seem sold on Levi yet, and that won’t change before the draft. As a UDFA they will be thrilled if he’s good enough to earn that job but they aren’t handing it to him nor are they overly committed to him having not spent a pick on him. Kevin Johnson and EJ Gaines are the only other starting caliber outside corners and they are both incredibly injury prone and both on 1 year deals. Taron Johnson is strictly a slot guy. Other two strictly depth at thus point. If their pick comes up in the 2nd or later and the BPA on their board is a corner I don’t see them passing just because it’s a corner. I don’t see that happening in the 1st though for a number of reasons.
Normally I'm tooootally with you, Yolo. I even think there's a decent chance they WOULD draft a corner early...say, a Rock Ya Sin, for instance. But like I said, for just one year...just ONE YEAR, I'd like to see them not take a corner high. If they want to take a flyer in the 4th or later, I'm all for it. I just don't see the sense in bringing in what would in all likelihood be the 6th corner on the depth chart. You want to draft guys you're sure can make your roster. I know Johnson and Gaines are injury prone, but it's hard for me to envision a 2nd or 3rd round rookie beating one of them out for a job. So you say "well what about NEXT year and the year after that?"...but we have a DRAFT next year, not to mention $100 million in cap space.
Typically I'm a "take a corner every year" guy, but the way they've set up their roster this year, they're rock solid from the 1-5 spot, in my opinion. Even the 6 and 7 spots, with Lewis and Pitts, aren't so bad. Those guys played real snaps for us last year and weren't liabilities.
4th or later? Take your shot. In the first three rounds, though, when the Bills NEED a TE, DT, Edge, OT, WR, RB, and Strong side LB? I just don't see it as the best use of resources THIS YEAR. -
Rashan Gary makes me nervous for some reason.
Any cornerback before the 4th round, because White, Wallace, and Johnson seem to be the locked in starting trio. If the answer is "for competition and depth!", I say: Why did we sign Kevin Johnson and EJ Gaines and hang on to Ryan Lewis and Lafayette Pitts, then?
Normally I'm all for drafting a corner every year. After solidifying our starting three and signing Johnson and Gaines, though, I'm against using a day 1 or 2 pick on a corner this year. It just doesn't make any sense from a roster building standpoint, and the Bills have too many other needs.-
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1 hour ago, JohnBonhamRocks said:
First-Pick. I moved around a lot.
Round 1 Pick 11 (CINN): Oliver, Ed, DT, Houston
Round 1 Pick 22 (BALT): Hockenson, T.J., TE, Iowa
Round 2 Pick 13 (ATL): Allen, Zach, DE, Boston College
Round 3 Pick 10: Lindstrom, Chris, OG, Boston College
Round 4 Pick 31 (LAR): Gaskin, Myles, RB, Washington
Round 5 Pick 20: Jennings Jr, Gary, WR, West Virginia
Round 6 Pick 22 (HOU): Cheevers, Hamp, CB, Boston College
Round 7 Pick 11: Mustipher, Sam, C, Notre Dame
How did you get a second 1st round pick without giving up either your 2nd or 3rd round picks? Seems impossible. -
44 minutes ago, HappyDays said:
That's pretty wild. Also I googled Baker Mayfield and April 9. April 9 is the day he visited the Bills. Maybe that picture is legit.
It IS legit. It's all but verified. And given that the person who shared the picture of the employee forgot to black out his employee bar code, I'd venture to guess that this action got the leaker fired.
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1 hour ago, MichaelAbdallah said:
The Bills have had 1,000+ yard rushers for 30 of their 59 seasons of existence. I believe that is the highest percentage of all 32 NFL franchises. And only the Bears (31) and Rams (33) have had more total seasons with a 1,000+ yard rusher. Also, thirteen different Buffalo RB's have rushed for 1,000+ yards: Gilchrist, OJ, Terry Miller, Cribbs, Greg Bell, Thurman, Antowain Smith, Henry, McGahee, Lynch, Jackson, Spiller, and McCoy. 10-15 years from now, the Bills may very well have 5 RB's in the Hall of Fame and among the top 30 RB's of all time: OJ, Thurman, Lynch, McCoy, and Gore. I'd put Gore at 99%, McCoy at 75%, and Lynch at 50% chance (if he doesn't retire this year) of the Hall of Fame right now. Since 1960, this franchise has always prioritized the RB position because of the idea that the weather here makes it difficult for QB's to throw with any consistency. This mindset should have become less relevant after the emergence of West Coast offenses and the modern passing game in general, but it hasn't. Jim Kelly altered this mindset a bit, but then the idea was that you needed to be a physically big QB with a very strong arm to have any success here. So for almost 25 years, management threw 1st round picks away chasing the big arm (RJ, Bledsoe, Losman, Manuel) at the expense of the more cerebral aspects of the QB position. Even now, Josh Allen is sort of a continuation of this philosophy. Although he is actually very bright and hard-working, so he definitely has a chance to buck the trend of failed Buffalo QB's since the mid-90's.
Oops...sorry for the QB rant...lol...
Getting back to the OP, I think an emerging consensus here is one between Jim Brown vs. Barry Sanders for greatest RB ever. I'm leaning toward Sanders at the moment for three reasons:
1. Fumbles per touch. Sanders (once per 83 touches) beats Brown (once per 46 touches) by a decent amount. Turnovers are the most important determining statistic in the outcome of football games (next to the obvious of points).
2. Quality of teammates. Football is very much a team sport. Sanders had a lot less (OL, QB, coaching, defense) to work with than Brown throughout his career.
3. Running style. A lazy analysis of the RB position might divide it into two types: the between-the-tackles north-south power back (Brown's style) and the outside-the-tackles elusive tailback (Sanders' style). Both have value to an offense. Both are incorporated in every offensive playbook. I would argue that the talent gap between Sanders and the rest of the great RB's that ran his style is much larger than the gap between Brown and the rest of the power RB's in pro football history. Furthermore, it's a lot harder to maintain elite ability as an outside-the-tackles tailback because of what the aging process and the wear-and-tear of tackle football does to the human body. Although Barry Sanders had such a low center-of-gravity (5'8", 200 lb) to complement his speed and agility that made him better suited to absorb or simply avoid the kinds of hits that wear down a RB.
Outstanding post! Thanks very much for this! -
11 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:
Doug Whaley is such an idiot for trading up in the draft.
McBeane are geniuses for trading up for the 3rd time in 3 years!
You are such a model of consistency. Like a McDonalds or a Tim Horton's. -
25 minutes ago, TPS said:
Thanks. Would you have a link to a story? I'd love to read more about it.
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11 minutes ago, TPS said:
Hmmm...so they somehow let a pic get posted on Twitter showing Allen #1--Did the picture get posted before or after they drafted Allen? Obvious answer.
Albright I'm sure was told that the Bills contacted Denver about a trade, as everyone knew the Bills wanted to move up to grab a QB. And he probably heard or was fed they liked Allen, as he got info on Peterman the year before (Beane wasn't there). He also had the Browns taking Darnold. And guess who was pushing the Paradis to the Bills rumor?
So, I'm not saying they're infallible, but this regime runs a much tighter ship than any in recent memory. I have one minor contact to the Bills, and last year he said they had things absolutely shut down compared to how things were in the past.
In the case of the Allen leak, it was an intern that took a picture of the white board on which they had written their QB rankings. Said intern then put the photo on Twitter for the world to see, and he did it BEFORE the draft.
The best laid plans of mice and men... -
Changing out of wet clothes.
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4 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:
I love Allen, but I also loved the pick on draft night and was relieved we didn’t take the one guy I hated...Rosen.
I can’t wait until Camp
I was an "anyone but Allen" guy.
Once Mayfield and Darnold were off the board, I wanted Rosen to be the pick. When it was announced that "The Buffalo Bills select Josh...", the 1 second between the words "Josh" and "Allen" took 10 years off my life. I wanted it so badly to be Rosen.
At this point -- with the caveat that its still too early to say and will be for another year or two -- it looks like I was wrong, and the Allen folks were right.
If that turns out to be the case, it will be the most excited I've ever been in my life to be completely wrong.-
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Reading through the thread, the main thing that strikes me is how QUICKLY most of the members in this thread (and Bills fans at large) did a 180 on Josh Allen.
That thread is just full of heartbreak, people saying "I'm gonna be sick", swearing off Bills fanhood forever, calling for the firing of Beane, etc, etc...
Fast forward a year, and now?
For the most part, Bills fans LOVE Josh Allen! Call it stockholm syndrome, call it wishful thinking, call it a survival tactic...at the end of the day, Allen won people over pretty quickly. The biggest reason, I think, is his heart. I mean, we all saw what he could do PHYSICALLY, sure. Running around Kiko Alonso all day and hurdling over Anthony Barr didn't hurt...but it's the way that he lays it all out there on the field and isn't afraid and does absolutely everything within his power to win that has endeared him to so many, so fast. A credit to Josh, his character, and his play as a rookie.-
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19 hours ago, Shaw66 said:
Joe Cribbs reminds me:
The Bills are definitely in the running for best all time stable of running backs. OJ, Thurman, Cookie, Cribbs, McCoy, Lynch, McGahee, Henry, Bush, Antowain Smith, and now Gore. Just about every team in the league would kill to have Fred Jackson be their EIGHTH best all time running back.
Think of this: 32 teams in the league, each team should on average have four running backs in the top 128 all time. The Bills have 11!!! And that doesn't include Gilchrist, who could very well be in the top 10 best running backs in pro football history. Okay, drop out Bush and Gore and count Lynch, McGahee and Smith as one instead of three. That's still 7 of the top 128, plus Gilchrist. There is an incredible rushing legacy in Buffalo.
I agree with the "all time running back stable" superiority of the Bills. I made a similar post earlier in this thread.
The Bears (with Sayers and Payton and Bronco Nagurski), The Cowboys (Tony Dorsett, Emmitt Smith, Herschel Walker), and the Browns (Brown, Little, Kelly) all have an argument, but the Bills win this one. -
59 minutes ago, Brianmoorman4jesus said:
On draft night I was livid about the Allen pick. He was the 1 QB I didn’t want. I can’t say I watched him in college but from everything I read and saw of him leading up to the draft, he was the QB I was most afraid of.
Eventually I started telling myself “he is on the Bills now so i might as well try to embrace it.” I wasn’t happy about it but I needed to at least give the guy a chance. From that point on, little by little the guy won me over. By the end of the season I was very happy to admit I was wrong. He certainly has flaws and he will never be the best passer but he does a lot of things very well and he is impossible to dislike. Allen plays with incredible fire and heart and clearly wants to be here. The guy is almost exactly like Cam Newton but with a way better attitude and probably bette accuracy. If we build around him create an offense to take advantage of his skill set, I think this can work. I’m not sure that he’s going to be good but I’m not sure that he won’t be. Thats a lot more then we usually get from a Bills QB. I am to the point now where I am happy about having him and excited for what the future brings. Regardless of how it turns out, I was wrong about him and I have no issue admitting it. We are in a place with our future that we haven’t been in a very long time. Id say it’s pretty exciting. Go Bills!
Pretty much the same for me.
It's too early for me to say that you or I were COMPLETELY wrong and that Josh is a guaranteed success.
At the very least, I can say I'm glad he's a Bill, I'm glad the Bills picked him over Rosen, he's a hell of a leader and a hell of an exciting player to watch, and I think his chance to be a great QB outweigh his chances of being a total bust. His floor is much higher than I thought. His ceiling remains to be seen. -
2 hours ago, billspro said:
Metcalf has 1100 yards this season if he doesn’t get injured. Moss played in a much easier conference. The Hill comp is just a joke, the are not even in the same league as prospects.
Except that they really, really ARE in the same league. They produced about the same college numbers (in spite of your unprovable hypothetical about non-injury). They're both between 6'4 and 6'5. They both run a 4.3ish 40. They both have/had less than desirable change of direction skills. They both ran an extremely limited route tree. They both look dynamite in shorts and a t-shirt.
I'm not saying they're identical prospects, but the comparison to Hill is WAY more accurate/reasonable than your comparison to RANDY FREAKING MOSS.
I mean...What am I missing? -
1 hour ago, billspro said:
AJ Brown was utilized better in college and was a better fit for their QB. Metcalf is the perfect fit for our offence and has a better chance at becoming Randy Moss than Steven Hill imo. There is some risk but it is probably worth taking.
DK Metcalf had 1,200 yards and 14 TDs across three college seasons. He ran a 4.33.
Stephen Hill had 1,200 yards and 9 TDs across three college seasons. He ran a 4.36
Randy Moss had 1,800 yards and 26 touchdowns in ONE COLLEGE SEASON ALONE. He ran a 4.25.
The Randy Moss comparisons are ludicrous to me.
Just like Stephen Hill, Metcalf is a huge, fast guy with limited change of direction who never produced big numbers in college and whose defenders say "it wasn't his fault his offense used him poorly!"
I see more of a chance of Metcalf becoming Hill than Moss, but that's just me.
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2 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:
Rosen did ok on an awful team with zero NFL caliber coaching.
AZ is about to jettison decent shot at a franchise QB for a mediocre MLB prospect.
Am I the only dude alive who thinks Arizona should keep Rosen AND draft Murray?
A QB competition between two high-potential 1st rounders? That sounds like the best way I can think of to be as sure as you can that you've found a franchise QB.
You can still trade whoever loses the competition later on. You don't HAVE to trade Rosen now.
The only way this wouldn't make sense is if they sense Rosen is going to be a disgruntled turd about it. If that's the case, then he wasn't worth the 1st to begin with.-
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31 minutes ago, BillyWhiteShows said:
I worry that Eddie has bust potential
Everybody has bust potential. -
9 minutes ago, BuffAlone said:
I thought about this weeks ago. With 10 picks, and a good depth roster, it wouldn't surprise me if we moved up. There is only one ( maybe two)player(s) I'd move up for in this draft..Quinnen Williams. Id make a trade right now with SF or the Jests, and listen to critics for the next 10 years. Other than that, maybe a few spots for Ed Oliver. But I'd damn near sell this year's draft for Q Will. I'd give up this years 2nd,4th, and 5th. Maybe more. He's that beastly. I look forward to watching that kid play wherever he ends up
Really? THAT sold on Quinnen Williams? Interesting. -
7 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:
This doesn't add any intrigue for me at all.
The Cardinals are taking Murray. Everyone knows it.
Even with that being the case, they're not gonna NOT do their due diligence and at least MEET with the two or three other candidates for the top pick. It would be grossly negligent to just NOT meet with a Nick Bosa if you have the top pick. It would be more newsworthy in my eyes if they DIDN'T meet with him.
It's gonna be Murray. It was always gonna be Murray.-
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"Guy who was hired based on offensive trends bemoans the hiring of young coaches based on offensive trends"
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AJ Brown was the better college WR and will be the better pro receiver.
DK Metcalf is just Stephen Hill to me.-
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8 minutes ago, section122 said:
I missed this!
For anyone interested according to the picture rankings were:
1. Allen
2. Darnold
3. Mayfield
4. Rosen
Also had a notation of 12, 22, and 53 to denver for #5 and a mark after mayfield that said 5-9 most likely that they would draft those 3 at any of those spots.
Pretty interesting tidbit that i missed thanks for mentioning it!
I actually missed out on it last offseason, as well. I didn't learn that it had happened until THIS offseason.
I'm so glad I saw it, though, because it put my curiosity on this issue to bed: Namely, I strongly suspected that Darnold was #1 on the Bills board and they had to "settle" for Josh Allen. Instead, I now know that he was their #1 choice all along. I like knowing that in the famed "Great QB Draft of 2018", the Bills got the player they had ranked 1st all along.
Was Ryan Groy released?
in The Stadium Wall Archives
Posted
Remember when the Rams tried to sign him to an offer sheet, but the Bills matched and kept him?
Now he's just sitting out there without a job.
I wonder what the heck happened.