HappyDays
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Posts posted by HappyDays
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not sure if you are being obtuse on purpose but clearly the point is that instead of just having a bunch of players with individual talent, they want to build a winning team where the players complement each other. Not that they don't have talent, they actually can win with that talent. Whaley took the opposite approach. He could evaluate talent but he could not put together a winning team. I think they have the same issue in Jax and LA Chargers.
Remember the Eagles "dream team"? Same problem. The Seahawks secondary wasn't just a collection of talented players, that's why they were the Legion of Boom and not the Random Talent Collection of Boom.
When do teams ever try to just assemble random talent without projecting how they fit into the team's vision? I get it, people are sad to see Sammy go, but we can be realistic.
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The Bills should hold onto Tyrod until a QB goes down like Bridgewater did last year then trade him for a 2nd rounder and a player on an expiring contract like the Watkins and Darby trade. Let Petermen play and either seeing if he is a Franchise QB or he is not and draft one in 2018. PERIOD.
If we are hovering just below .500 after 6 weeks I would support this.
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talking about the fans being losers and having "little jobs" while putting up average numbers for a #1 then talking about how you're next contract is going to set the market is a low key prima donna?
Don't forget complaining to local media he doesn't get enough targets. He's very immature and doesn't understand the team-first attitude McDermott is trying to instill. And I still don't believe he really wanted to come back.
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Sounds like a shot at Sammy to me but I guess it depends on what the question was.
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You don't know what year is going to be your year. You are supposed to try to win the championship every year. Isn't that what you are telling your players? Not trying to win is friggin nonsense.
If every team was truly trying to win the Super Bowl every year, every team would spend to the salary cap every single year. What you're asking for isn't realistic. Of course you try to win now but not at the expense of the future. This isn't the Ralph regime, we aren't being cheap for no reason. They're making sure we don't end up in the bad cap situations Whaley always put us in.
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Randy Moss had what should have been the game winning catch in February 2008. And even on the Pats very final possession, he cleanly (and shockingly) beat the guy covering him for what would have been an 80 yard TD pass if Brady hadn't underthrown him. So, no.
Okay I don't know why Randy Moss keeps getting brought up as if he has anything to do with Sammy Watkins. When has Sammy ever looked as good as Moss? Also this was 8 years ago. Look at recent championships. Julio Jones is the exception, the best teams are not paying their top receivers the kind of money Sammy will likely command.
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But Belichick saw the need for Moss are you saying McDermott is a smarter coach than Belichick?
If we ever find ourselves with the greatest QB of all time playing on a well below market value contract, and we have a chance to sign a top 5 all time receiver with the production to prove it, and McDermott declines to, then you can ask me this question. Right now it's comparing apples to oranges.
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By that logic if Randy Moss were in his prime and available the right move would be to pass?
Not at all. You can make exceptions for elite talent with elite production. The only player on our roster with that description is Shady McCoy. If we trade him I'll agree we are tanking, or if we're not then it's just a poor move. But not Sammy.
I also don't know if McDermott sees a need for a Randy Moss which does make sense considering he never got that ring... elite receivers don't win championships.
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The list of reasons to trade Sammy right now is WAY shorter and less meaningful than the reasons to NOT trade him.
I'll stop there as this isn't a Sammy trade thread. But I had to say it since you brought it up.
If the coaches don't value top talent at the receiver position (that is already on the team instead of having the draft gamble) then fine. It still isn't a reason to ditch one of your top 3 offensive threats, especially when the guy was dirt cheap this year and in a contract year where he is expected to give 110%. And then pretend that having a second round pick next year is somehow better for this team than having an already proven top tier receiver - It's just stupid.
If Sammy isn't in the plans for next year and the Bills don't realistically think Super Bowl is happening this year, trading Sammy is the logical move. You can argue that Sammy should have been in the plans, or that the Bills are a Super Bowl contender with him on the team. You can't argue we would have been better off renting him for a year and letting him walk for nothing. That just isn't sensible.
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If you are complacent with Peterman, you are complacent with losing. We have a QB already, let's see how the pro bowler does first.
What if I like Tyrod and also like how Peterman has been developing?
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I know what he meant by it.
It is just my opinion that Sammy was more of a team player than either Hughes or Dareus has been or is. So that excuse rings hollow with me. Very poor excuse. He is grasping at straws for an excuse to justify downgrading at WR this year when they certainly didn't have to.
He isn't just talking about character. He's trying to build a team which means some positions are valued over others. He doesn't see elite WRs as necessary to win a championship, the money can be better spent elsewhere. Plus QB is the most important thing and he added picks that make it easer to draft a good one. There are multiple reasons it made sense to trade Sammy.
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I already ordered his jersey.
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Apparently a team devoid of talent is the plan.
McDermott: "we're building a team not accumulating talent"
What if I told you there are talented players with high character? Not everyone is Sammy Watkins complaining to local media about his targets and claiming his draft class will change salaries around the league. Maybe McDermott doesn't like players that care more about their targets and their money than winning.
Hughes and Dareus play positions that we seem to value, though Dareus' contract may be the only thing actually keeping him here. Seems like we want front 7 players on D and QB & LT on O. If you look at Carolina's roster and the people they decided to pay it's QB, MLB (QB of the D), DL. They didn't have much luck at Tackle, but they tried through FA. They didn't seem to prioritize WR much.
I agree, I think Dareus is only still here because of his contract. He doesn't fit the mold of player that McDermott looks for. But as it stands his contract makes him impossible to cut and he's talented so might as well keep him here.
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Well I hated Paxton Lynch as well but I think the "pro style" thing is the most overrated scouting cliche in modern NFL scouting. Cam Newton's offense wasn't "pro style", Derek Carr wasn't running a true "pro style" scheme either. While people like to argue that the college game and the pro game are drifting further apart in offensive styles I think something quite different. I feel like whilst the schemes might be different the concepts are actually converging. When I was scouting Trubisky and Watson for this year's draft there was a knock on both that they were not in "pro style" systems but there were plenty of concepts within those offenses that are NFL staples... they are almost always run from the pistol or the gun and receivers are generally running specified routes (whereas in the NFL they will have more routes with reads in them..... "IF" the defender does X break the route off at this point etc) but they are trying to attack defenses in similar ways.
I'm not as convinced as you seem to be on Peterman's accuracy either. It was spotty on tape. I feel like "accurate and smart" are the first two adjectives that get applied to limited Quarterbacks without top level arms. Can he have a career as a backup? Sure. He has some Fitz about him to me when I watch him. I remain in the camp that would be stunned if he became a true NFL starting Quarterback.
Do I hope I am wrong? I do for as long as he is on the Bills. But I don't revisit what I thought watching guys just because we draft them. I think Blokes was even more down on Peterman than me...... think he had him as an UDFA.
Good post, thanks.
Pro system isn't the first thing I look for. Trubisky played in a spread but he's deadly accurate and reads the whole field. He was easily the best prospect in the draft. As opposed to someone like Mahomes who not only played in a spread system but also needs to revamp his mechanics.
But I think the bigger cliche than "pro system QB" is "drafting QBs is a crapshoot." I don't think that's true. You can at least whittle down the available prospects. It's easy. You avoid prospects whose scouting profiles read like this:
Strengths:
Dual-Threat Quarterback
Powerful arm
Excellent mobility
Size & strength
Escapability
Experienced
Quick release
Weaknesses:
Not a natural passer
Decision-making
Field vision
Struggles to work through progressions
Runs to quickly
Spotty accuracy
Can panic at times
Didn't play as well against good defenses
Strengths:
Strong arm
Can make all the throws
Great size; well-built height/weight
Capable of brilliant throws into tight windows
Good mobility
Athletic
Can throw a beautiful deep ball
Throws well on the run
Flashes pocket presence
When comfortable, sees the field well
Can be tough to bring down
Toughness
Has played hurt
Hand size (10.25 inches)
Capable of picking up yards with his feet
Weaknesses:
Raw
Streaky as a passer
Inconsistent field vision
Has to quicken the process
Can be slow to work through his progressions
Needs lots of development for a pro-style offense
Will need to learn working under center
Questions about off-the-field maturity, professionalism
Those are EJ Manuel's and Paxton Lynch's draft profiles. Cardale Jones is the epitome of this type of QB and I'm struggling to think of a time when one has worked out. This year it's Deshone Kizer. Everyone likes him based on one preseason game but his mechanics and spotty accuracy will catch up to him. Pat Mahomes is a weird one because he has a big arm and he's even generally accurate but his mechanics are a mess, and he's not as accurate on the deep ball as his tape would have you believe. He's one of the few "strong, big arm" QBs I could see actually making it but he's more likely to become Jay Cutler than Brett Favre IMO.
And I don't agree when people say "1st round QBs are more likely to succeed." In recent years that hasn't really been true, because GMs keep taking the same crap prospects with "big arms" or guys that win the national championship as if that even remotely matters.
The success rate seems to still be about 50% for the top 2 picks, and everything else in the 1st round is well below 50%. I remember looking into this, and I found Derek Carr was the only QB taken between pick 3 and 35 that has any sort of success, since Aaron Rodgers was drafted in 2005. But these QBs keep getting taken. How can someone say it's a crapshoot when the statistics are right there? Don't waste mid-1st round picks on strong arms or "proven winners." Find decent accuracy and decent mechanics, that's the pool of QBs you should draft from. That's where the real crapshoot is, it's near impossible to tell which QBs from that pool will rise to the top. But you can literally just read draft profiles of some QBs and know they're not going to make it.
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I think he will play the season out with the Rams and either get tagged or hit FA. A tag and trade is even possible. All around a great deal for the Rams for just a 2nd rounder.
If he hits FA that is a horrible deal, historically bad even. Especially because him hitting FA likely means the Rams sucked which means it's a high 2nd rounder and they have multiple positions to fill.
If he plays as advertised and Goff takes the next step then it was a good trade for them. I don't think that's likely but we'll see.
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How is it that you thought so highly of Peterman before the draft but only gave him a high R3 grade?
Without the benefit of hindsight I would have been fine with the Bills taking Peterman with their 2nd round pick but would have thought it was a little early. Maybe that gives it a little better perspective. Whatever grade you have on a QB, take him a round earlier. And I wasn't that high on him, I did have him as my #2 (behind Trubisky) but thought it was a weak class overall anyways. I wouldn't have taken any QB other than Trubisky in the 1st this year.
I had him as a 7th rounder and I was the guy with a 2nd on Dak Prescott. I don't think they are anything alike.
You're right, they're really not alike. I don't know to me it is clear, even just reading draft profiles, that Dak Prescott was a better prospect than Paxton Lynch. I will never understand the "big, strong arm, but no mechanics" QBs that get taken in the 1st round. I scout accuracy above all else because it can't be taught. The unpredictable X factor is always can they read NFL defenses so I look for pro system QBs. Those two factors led me right to Peterman and I was really excited when we took him.
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There's a reason he was a 5th round pick
Yeah it's because NFL front offices don't know how to scout QBs. It's why players like EJ Manuel and Paxton Lynch go in the 1st, while players like Dak Prescott and Kirk Cousins fall to the 4th. If GMs knew how to scout quarterbacks, ones like Peterman would never fall to the 5th. Frankly we're lucky he's on our team because we took Matt Milano before him in the same round... I had him pegged as a high 3rd rounder before the draft FWIW.
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Sooo... are there excuses now?
Honestly, excuses don't matter much at this point, the Tyrod Taylor question is no longer really a question. The best he can hope for seems to be starting this season, seeing his replacement drafted in the 2018 draft, and starting the 2018 season while his replacement learns the game a bit.
Barring making the playoffs and actually winning a couple of those games, it seems obvious Beane wants to replace Taylor.
I don't think Beane wants to replace Taylor, like if he steps up this season they'll have no problem bringing him back. But he's being smart and planning ahead as if Tyrod won't work out. Honestly can't blame him, especially when he's starting off a new regime.
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I won't get ahead of myself and fast forward to next years draft because of one preseason game Peterman had against 3rd stringers.
I WILL say though that it gave me a good reason to watch the 2nd preseason game to see how he does against the 2nd stringers. The kid was definitely worth watching over Yates. But a blind man could of told u that.
I keep thinking back to one throw he made at camp yesterday (I was there). He had pressure in his face and it looked to me like he got happy feet for a second. He threw the ball and I thought he had let it get away from him, but in fact it was a perfect throw to a receiver running an out route. To my eyes the ball was thrown before the receiver made his break, and this was with pressure in Peterman's face. It was right next to the sideline where only his receiver could catch it.
I am just about positive Tyrod would have turned and ran for 3-4 yards in the same situation. Peterman had a 12 yard or so completion for a 1st. This coming from someone who really likes Tyrod.
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He shouldn't get any as it's going to be hard enough as it is for Tyrod to develop chemistry with his all new WR corps.
2CB - my take is that Tyrod and Sammy never had great chemistry. I can't imagine Tyrod was too happy when Sammy complained to the media that he wasn't getting enough targets. And he was limited in pretty much every training camp he was here for with Tyrod. They never had a rapport or any kind of friendly relationship. Tyrod didn't seem too broken up to lose him to be honest.
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In fact the Rams gave up two firsts, two seconds and two thirds plus a lower round pick or two for Geoff. But two firsts should be more than enough ammunition for the Bills.
Bills have the best QB situation they've had in a long long time. They have an established starter who has a year to prove he can run a modern NFL offense, they have a rookie who has shown progress every week, and they're positioned to sell the farm for their top prospect next year. But coffee's for closers so let's see where this goes.
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Why not have both? They have 2 No.1s next draft....should be able to get a QB with that
Not at all. Look at the RGIII, Goff, and Wentz trades.
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Take everything management about why they traded him says as the truth.
Jeez it's like people learn nothing from the last 17 years.
What have you learned about McDermott and Beane from the last 17 years?
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Do you realize how close McD might be right now from losing the team?
but don't worry, be Happy...
Not at all, this kind of stuff happens at Patriots practice all the time. BB sends the players home to cool off and no one is worse off for it.
Bills' 2017 Training Camp Discussion - Final Day
in The Stadium Wall Archives
Posted
Everything you just said I see as ultimately bad for the Bengals. They need to start over. AJ Green is the best example of the point I'm making.