NoSaint
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DeHaven might have given his approval and hired Kwan himself or Kwan might have been hired by Gailey who is assembling the staff for all his units. Per the hiring of the defensive assistants prior to Edwards.
I suspect that Edwards was likely talking to Gailey about those decisions, and just not publicly introducing them, as he was keeping the new job hush-hush. Of course, thats not based off anything other then my own thinking that he was lined up long before the hire.
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I wouldn't mind either of these guys, even though they'd both be a stop-gap player for a few years. Seymour is 30 and Chambers is 31, so they're both also approaching the downside of their careers (if they haven't gotten there already).
I don't know if Seymour would fit into the 3-4, but he'd certainly have enough motivation to play against Belichick twice a year.
hes pretty much prototype for the 3-4 end actually, but versatile enough to play 4-3 as well. exactly the type of player you need if you are planning on mixing them up.
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The Colts were out coached really? Take away drops by Garzon and Reggie Wayne and it's a different ballgame.
I disagree, I think that a game between two very evenly matched teams coaching made a world of difference.
1) Sean payton and staff recognized that baskett turns early on kickoffs early in film study. They practiced the play for a week recognizing a colts weakness that the colts coaches did not. If the special teams coach recognized this problem before the game, they would have never even attempted the kick as the problem would have been corrected.
2) more film study -- the porter pick was all about out preparing the colts. Porter knew that play call from really strong prep work -- his first words after the game were "we saw on 3rd down they call that play a lot"
you could argue that if not for the early colston drop, brees just missing meachem on the first drive, or mike bell (?) slipping at the end of the half the game wouldve been a blowout. neither team was perfect for the entire 60 mins, but it was about as well executed game as I can remember.
PS. freeney was hurt -- the saints lost their starting Probowl LT in training camp. things happen.
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Not to mention you've wasted time chasing something you won't get. Buffalo tried to obtain DL Israel Idonije and G Reggie Wells in 06 and were denied by their teams, Chicago and Arizona respectively. Given that Buffalo's front office can only sign one guy at a time (see Evans and Peters in 08) most likely they removed themselves from pursuing other UFA's in Dick Levy's first foray into an offseason together.
Perhaps that why the crown jewel of the 06 offseason was current UFL scrub Larry Tripplett.
i was implying you might be able to use schobel as the trade bait on one of the MANY rfa's available this year
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So this is a topic in about 3 active threads so why not consolidate -- where does Aaron schobel fit next year. Is his value in a trade or as an OLB.
OLB: yes, he is small, and a pass rusher. Can he follow a receiver or TE on a seam route? Can he read zone coverage? Is he fluid in his hips to turn and run in coverage? I know many say he will be a "pass rush specialist." what is this exactly? It sounds like they expect him to play DE again. If that's the case why really switch even. That 4th man with his hand off the ground is supposed to be a wildcard, not just a pass rusher.
Trade: older, large contract -- played well last year, and many of the 10 before tho. Might gain worth for a final 8 team. Someone like the saints who will likely be replacing a DE, and can't chase a free agent might be inclined to trade for one.
I see him likely gone, even though I'm a big fan. It's much easier for a 20 yr old to make that switch then a 30 something. Hopefully we can get good value for him. Player for player and get an RFA in here with experience in the system, or a first day pick?
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a 33 yr old DE playing OLB?? silly
Maybin?? I doubt he has the football skills
1.POZ-yes-an average NFL LB
2.Mitchell?-yes-a barely average NFL LB
3.FA
4.draft pick
Schobel will be a very tough change -- maybin more likely but still a huge ??? Poz could play on the outside or inside.
1)maybin
2)poz
3)Mitchell
4)FA or rookie
that's worrisome at best. Who is off then bench if anyone tweaks anything? Palmer? Harris? Scott?
Not a good situation without 2-3 real players brought in. Plus 2-3 on the line... Big project ahead.
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Amen. That and the fact he's woed 25million fish on his contract. Schobel is not going anywhere for anything less than a 2nd round draft pick. If he is traded. I can not see him retireing. He might be the one forceing Buffalo to move to the 3-4 defense. I think he will be a monster in the 3-4. He is a good football player, who makes plays for the Bills. I think
Schobel is going to make a lot of Bills fans happy this year.
Is that based off anything in particular? Not trying to be rude with the comment either -- I just don't have memories of schobel covering a TE, slot receiver, or rb down the field. There's more then just rushing the passer as a olb. Can he play man? Read zones?
Living out of market I don't see as much as I'd like but I don't recall anything to make anyone think he can do that????
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I guess what I'm getting at is the example in your sig is -- get cody and we are good to go ::
This may not be the personnel lineup some envision but it would mean we only need one additional body to play NT. This Would give us a ridiculous amount of run stuffing beef up front. Maybin and Schobel would play in more space and would be free to go completely nuts attacking the QB from the left, the right or both sides.
Realistically, it's 2 NTs that we agree we need, and I don't see schobel switching -- does anyone see him covering a TE on a seam route? He just doesn't have the speed, or the hips. Regardless, say he makes the change -- who's depth at lb? At de?
The 3-4 switch is not a bring in one man transition, even in it's best case. If we hit 50% on switching DEs to OLB we need about 4-5 players in the front 7 to field a serviceable team for a season. The front 7 is made up of far more then 7 players, and we are stretching to find those. Imagine if we pick up an injury, say a guy doesn't make the transition, a rookie doesn't play great out of the gate. If everything falls PERFECT -- no injuries and everyone transitions, Cody turns into a 3-down player, your front 7 looks average at best anyway. It features a rookie, and 4 people switching to new positions -- not to mention poz and Mitchell in the middle which isn't even a given for success (do you want either one taking on a lineman? Ever?)
I like the 3-4 but we are much closer to a very good 4-3 with our guys.
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Well if the Bills front office was dumb enough to only keep one NT on the entire roster that would indeed be a problem. Fortunately they will probably be smart about it and get a free agent NT to compete with Cody in camp and rotate with him like they do with other over sized NTs.
So do you propose anyone in particular?? It's a legit question. Cody is a rotational player, not a stud NT-- atleast yet. If he reaches best case and plays 50% of the snaps, at a serviceable level (he's still a rook) who is playing the other half. It's a tough position to fill, and by saying Cody is the guy, it simply isn't full yet.
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Don't panic. Check the signature.
Im just not sure how we can expect cody to fill that role every down, when he doesnt even do that in alabama right now. If we go with cody he cant be relied upon as a 3 down player.
Next problem, what if cody, or whoever we bring in gets injured? who is the backup NT. As thats the anchor of a 3-4 front 7, its important to have more then 1 person that can go.
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Hmmmmmmmm
I know im new here, but i simply dont get the confusion over defensive schemes on this board. Most of you (the writer of this post included) know A LOT about football but it seems get caught up in the name of a scheme, instead of actually looking at the plays run..... just scared by our last coaching staff i guess.
As it turns out 3-4 doesnt equal blitz happy and man coverage all over the field. You can run a 3-4 cover 2 as well. Sadly if we switch straight to 3-4 without a major personell overhaul it will likely resemble a 3-3-5 nickel if a nic harris or scott fill in as one of the extra linebackers (ie 5 dbs, 3 lbs, and 3 lineman) .... we will see what we sign and draft to bulk up the front 7
also, if we go to man instead of zone, it doesnt mean that safeties will be playing straight man coverage all the time... probably still rare in fact. he will likely be in a similar situation, with just some tweaks in how he reads the play in front of him.
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I think the decision to disregard Ralph had a lot to do with him "talking his own book." He knew (or was told by Littman) the percentages allocated to players were such that he'd have no hope of ever reaching the cap based on the non-shared revenue he could generate in Buffalo. Their response was more of "why don't you move out of a poor area?" rather than questioning his santity.
You are right that the keys to this are KC, Cincy, Pittsburgh, and other cities whose economies are more than 2X as large as WNY but still much to small to accomodate the insane money-making schemes of Jones, Synder, etc.
I remember a quote along the lines of "why dont we take some time and make sure we try to understand what we are signing?"
If memory serves, the whole thing came together so quickly that it was near impossible that anyone had gone through it very detailed, ralph voted no - sighting that they should be patient and make sure it was a good deal. Everyone came out saying he was too old to understand what was going on....
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Don't really think they are comparable. Yes Lynch has done some stupid things, but Vick did some very cold and calculated illegal things for a very long period of time and hide them very well. While Lynch is no boyscout, he isn't a cold calculating criminal like Vick either.
I highly doubt Vick will be any one's savior, and do not believe he should be given the opportunity to be playing at all with the level of the crimes he has committed. I do feel should be given a chance to make a living, but not in an industry that supposedly prides itself on cleaning up its image and putting role models out on the field.
Not Even trying to imply anything about vick with this comment but....
How do we know marshawn is better? We've seen some mistakes get caught, how do we know what hasn't been caught??? I remember MV getting caught with little things here and there before it all came out. Truly we don't know what anyone does off the field....
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As someone that was at the saints vikings game -- it went both ways. it was a physical game. drew was driven into the ground on a no call too, but the saints won and favre was showing the wear and tear more. I just question where in this quote he did any more then what fans of any team do saying you have to get to the qb and hit him. If you were designing the buffalo defense to beat tom brady and the pats what do you do -- pressure with the front four, get him moving, make him jumpy, AND HIT HIM. its the defensive philosophy of nearly any team anywhere.
my wonder is whether that will be what they do out of the gate... the way the saints beat the patriots so badly was by dropping 8 and only rushing 3 most of the game. is this a smokescreen to make him think there will be more blitzing? i certainly think they will make sure he feels it if they get close and sneak some blitzes in, but its an odd comment to make if you plan on blitzing early and often. maybe hes pushing them to get ready for an attack thats not coming nearly as aggressively.
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So we kind of established we are an nfl team in this regard --- any idea where we sit in relation to others? are we the top of the heap, somewhere in the middle?
if a coach like cowher walks into the HC Office, does he think to himself wow because its better then pittsburgh, or wow cause his OC in Pitt had a better view? chan, are you reading this? what do you think
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Yeah I got the jist of it, btw roy got to 5 probowls from 02-09, missing them his rookie yr and the 2 yrs he was hurt, and requested his release from Dallas. But you're right I wouldn't consider him tops at his position.
touché sir. I remembered him struggling for longer then that I thought. He was a coverage liability, and was called out by teammates in Dallas I remembered. I also watched him not find many suitors after his release. Note he was granted a Release, not traded which also gave me a negative impression of his play. Without watching a ton of cowboys ball all that added up to me thinking his play had fallen off more then it had possibly. If you've watched more of his play I certainly defer to you on the opinion. It's what I get for leaning on the media guys and not my own two eyes. I'd be curious how many of those were probowls based on rep and being on americas team vs actual play.... It just seems that he went from probowler to.... Not a probowler.... Very quickly. Just an injury problem? Did he do something to get on the badside of the media?
Mostly though I was just getting at the idea of when looking at players, where they are coming from-- systems, coaches, performances of those that are prior products of that system are all factors but certainly not rules... And in the process certainly proved I haven't followed the career of Roy Williams too closely.
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That was a joke, the safety Roy Williams went to OKLAHOMA, not texas, and he went to multiple pro-bowls, def not a "bust"
Haha my bad it's been a long week! Even though he went to probowls early -- where's he been lately? He was hard fought to get a sniff in free agency. A couple early probowls a career does not make. I don't think anyone would consider him top 15 at his position, and he was a top 10 pick. Regardless -- not a longhorn, so doesn't fit my post too well. I think you got the general idea despite me eating it on that example. Sub in mike huff if you want
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What I heard from a few retired players is Buffalo has a top notch medical department with ability to call in specialists from all over Buffalo including medical schools who actually will drop case load/work/classes when Bills call. It was like that as far back as 1980's when I worked in health science library and would get urgent calls from doctors who needed certain textbooks for emergency trip to stadium.
If I was an older player who was worried about quality of medical care Buffalo would be high on the list.
I know the Kevin Everett situation seems to support this. Is buffalo in general known for specialists in sports injuries? I'd imagine somewhere like NYC would be better but you get guys like James andrews in a city like Birmingham so you never know.
I imagine having a top notch facility might reflect that reputation and location might be more of an issue then we think. A top player has many close choices, a top weight machine, anyone can buy. If we are willing to invest in top notch facilities does this mean maybe mean we are more willing to spend then we realize? That's purely speculation of course but the mind is wandering on the topic. Could also, sadly, be that we are better at scouting equipment and interior designers then we are football players haha... Truly, to this point I can't say we are better then anyone either. I'm sure any facilities are impressive, so maybe ours tho nice are truly average for NFL standards.
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I know the WR roy williams, but who's the other roy williams that went to texas?
Saftey drafted by Dallas -- now in cincy. Best known for his role in bringing about the horse collar rule. The need for this question speaks volumes to his bust factor. Wasn't he a top 10 pick maybe 6-7 or so years ago?
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Troy Aikman and Tommy Maddox both played for Terry Donohue, and both had relatively similar numbers. Yet they aren't the same people.
turns out they arent. Also turns out if clausen put up the same numbers at tulane, we'd likely think twice after the losman fiasco. I'm not saying we passed on orakpo due to mike Williams, but there are questions about work ethic coming out of Texas -- did the sum of mike, both Roy Williams and a host of other Texas flops atleast make you wonder about orakpo. He's a prime example of why all must be viewed case by case, but there has got to be something learned from history too. It's not a hard rule that because someone before you failed you would too, but it certainly frames how you view someone atleast to a degree -- whether you like it or not. Quinns let down has got to atleast raise questions about whether clausen is a product of the system, or a gamer that transcends the system.
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That's excellent to hear. I'm sure all are very high end, hence I was so amazed by that sill Arizona example. It got me thinking about all that though. As much as Ralph, Russ, scouts, etc all get debated, I hadn't heard much good or bad about our setup on the physical property. When players and coaches come through, I am sure that's something they look at and are curious about. Granted, I'll take 5 million more and sit in a less comfortable chair at team meetings, but some subtle things can add up within building a culture. Have we heard any player remarks either coming or going, comparing obd to their other homes?
Do I leave early cause I'm just not as comfortable in the film room. Cut a workout a little short cause I don't feel like waiting for someone to finish there bench sets so I can. Skip a meal at the facility where I might be bonding with teammates and talking game strategy cause the food just plain sucks. Sometimes a single misstep can cost a game, and one game can cost the playoffs. By noooooo means am I implying our cook is the key to leading us back to the promise land, but there are so many threads on draft picks, and coaches -- I am curious to learn more about the culture day to day in the building -- the little things being done that don't warrant a press release, and fans don't always see.
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I'm just curious -- i'm sure it's hard for any fan to answer but how do the buffalo facilities match up to those around the league? I know some places (Cleveland with the staph infections, for example) have reputations. If I were looking at a team (as a coach or player) it's the kind of thing I'd look at closely. A reflection of setting up a winning environment. The best weight room, training facilities, film rooms, meeting rooms, offices and more. Arizona had a reputation for locking the fridges on off days -- you'd think if a player wants to come in they would be able to give him a couple bottles of water. A coincidence that they haven't had a winning culture with something like that going on?
So what do we know about the things at one bills drive? Any stories good or bad? Comments from players? I'm just curious how we stack up on the most fundamental of support systems.
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New coaches do not generally have their staffs lined up before they are hired. The only way that they could possibly
do that would be to have lined up other unemployed assistants. They can't legally contact coaches on other staffs and.
even if they could, who would quit a secured job to join the staff of some head coach who didn't have a job at that
point?
That's just plain not true... The bills can't contact anyone but me, you, bill cowher or anyone not employed by an NFL team can call up a friend and say "hey, if I get this job, can I count on you to be there with me?" it's not only legal, but commonplace.
How would the NFL regulate what gailey did prior to getting the job?
The fact that someone isn't on board yet likely means one of three things--
1) someone was lined up but took a different job rather then wait on chans hire, or had a change of heart during the few week process.
2) waiting on an assistant coach on a playoff team.
3) buffalo made a terrible mistake and hired a man with no real plan.
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What? How would they know that the team hiring Pees has a DC already in place, but not know which team it is?
"Hey source, do you know who signed Pees?"
"Yea florio, but they haven't told their DC he's fired so I'm not going to break the news."
I imagine something like that would pretty much cover it....
If the Bills are smart they will trade up to #2 and get Ndamukong Suh
in The Stadium Wall Archives
Posted
The problem with the point charts -- the early picks have changed in value SO much since those have started floating around. 70 mil contracts have changed everything in the top 10 as far as "value"
but yes, it would still cost a ton to move up those spots, a number 1 next year and additional picks/players would be a starting point... Atleast roughly....