Article on Ngata

[oregonmark]

Here is a link to an article from the Eugene Register-Guard on Ngata. I watched this guy play every home game. he is a stud. I hope we don't pass on him.

 

http://www.registerguard.com/news/2006/04/...ection=oregonfb

[cantankerous]

Another Bills fan from Oregon? That brings the total to 5 then...I think.

 

I'll be happy with Ngata at #8. He's a freak of nature.

[Tipster19]

After reading this article, I'm convinced that this is Marv's type of player/person. I won't be surprised or disappointed if we select him with the #8 pick overall.

[BillnutinHouston]

After reading this article, I'm convinced that this is Marv's type of player/person. I won't be surprised or disappointed if we select him with the #8 pick overall.

661718[/snapback]

 

This article does nothing to convince me. All it says is that he's sad his mom died, so he's burying himself in training and preoccupation with the draft to ease his mind. Oh, and he's gonna assist but not support his family financially.

[MartyBall4Buffalo]

This article does nothing to convince me.  All it says is that he's sad his mom died, so he's burying himself in training and preoccupation with the draft to ease his mind.  Oh, and he's gonna assist but not support his family financially.

661743[/snapback]

 

 

pretty much... oh and he's named after his uncle

[stinky finger]

Nice article. I'll pass just the same, thanks.

[Ozymandius]

Nobody ever said this guy wasn't a polite young man.

 

If you guys want to see something scary, read old articles about how polite, personable, and mature Mike Williams came off to be before he was drafted. MW was the "star" of that draft.

[colin]

if he reacts to a huge chunk of adversity like his mom dying by working harder and being focussed, he might just be the anti mike williams.

 

i am worried he is a giant fatbody, but pat williams and ted washington had similiar knocks against them and they gave the bills a run of some of the best DTs an NFL team has seen.

[John from Riverside]

BINGO...

 

Ngata is the ANTI Mike Williams....

 

When he lost his parents he looked inside himself and became stronger for it. I was actually leaning away from this kid but after reading this article I think he should be our first pick....

 

- understand the meaning of work

 

- has mental toughness

 

- fills a definate need on our team

 

- we can trade down a little bit and STILL get him

[Ghost of BiB]

I've long since given up on who is cynical here and who isn't.

[nonprophet]

Here is a link to an article from the Eugene Register-Guard on Ngata. I watched this guy play every home game. he is a stud. I hope we don't pass on him.

 

http://www.registerguard.com/news/2006/04/...ection=oregonfb

661715[/snapback]

If we draft him, we'll have two Mormon defensive linemen. Powerful.

[cantankerous]

You've probably never seen him play if you think he's just a fat ass...He's much more than that, and if you don't know then please don't comment.

[Tasker]

Nice story, but I feel very sure of one thing:

 

when we look back at the players who were available at #8 in this draft two, three, or four years from now, we will not consider Ngata the best of them.

 

I'm not confident of his ability or work ethic or devotion to football. I don't see a lot of talk about football, high energy, excitement, and the times I've seen him personally he hasn't seemed to do much other than be big. Big is good, but not enough. If we pick him, I will change my tune and become a big Ngata fan, because I'm an optimist and loyal fan (other than Holcomb), but I really hope he isn't our pick right now.

[SoCal Pat]

If we draft him, we'll have two Mormon defensive linemen. Powerful.

662418[/snapback]

 

We might have three. Lauvale Sape went to Utah, and he's Polynesian. That's a combo that screams he's Mormon, although I don't know for sure if he is or not.

[Mark VI]

He's a freak of nature.

661716[/snapback]

 

I'll notify Barnum & Bailey. The bearded lady has eczema.

[PortlandBillsFan]

I agree with cantankerous. The reports are painting this guy as an overweight stiff. If you haven't seen him play much before, of course this is what you will believe. Believe me, Haloti is anything but another Mike Williams. He plays through nagging injuries and contrary to popular belief, he doesn't take plays off. Also, he isn't just a run stuffer. Even though his sack totals aren't that high, he collapses the pocket if left one on one and is great at batting down passes at the line. Nobody should be disappointed if Haloti is our pick.

[Ozymandius]

I've seen him play and he takes plays off. Especially when he's double teamed, he thinks he's done his job already and stops working. I saw a bad Arizona team just run straight down the gut on Oregon over and over again. He may play through nagging injuries but he receives those nagging injuries a lot, which slows him down. Yes, folks, he's a injury risk. He was even forced to leave the final game of his college career due to spraining his knee. Speaking of knees, he tore an ACL a couple years ago. He's a very good talent but I don't he's going to step right in and dominate for the team that drafted him high in the first round, after receiving all those millions. Think Ted Washington on this. We want to be the team that signs him four or five years from now, not the team that drafted him originally.

[Phlegm Alley]

Ngata may fill a need of ours and he may be a pretty decent DT. I however, cant justify paying him #8 money when he will probably won't play 3rd downs and isn't really a "playmaker". He may be worth it if we can trade down a few slots and hope that he is still there but, I would rather get the best football player available who can be a "playmaker" with the #8.

[Ozymandius]

Let's just do a quick review of what we know:

- Ourlads, arguably the most respected indepedent draft service out there, pretty much predicts this guy will be a bust. http://www.stadiumwall.com/index.php?showtopic=44966

- He has a history of nagging injuries, including a rebuilt knee

- He has a history of taking plays off

- He has a history of wearing down in games, which may be related to the taking plays off

- His position, DT, has a history of notable top 10 busts. Sure, there are other positions with this history as well, but DT is among them. (OT, for example, does not have this history, with only Mike Williams being a proven out and out bust over the past 15 years as a top 10 pick. Gallery could be #2).

- He has good talent but he also has a body type that can take years to start to dominate (probably due to effort), and usually for a different team. Ted Washington was this way. Sam Adams. Grady Jackson. (Shaun Rogers is an exception, as he's been dominant with the Lions, but Rogers was upset that he slipped to a second rounder and played with a chip on his soldier. We're talking about giving this body type instant millions as the #8 overall pick). I think I would love Haloti Ngata if we signed him as a free agent four or five years from now.

- The Bills are employing Cover 2, which means there will be a defensive line rotation, which means he'll play a little over half the defensive snaps, especially with his endurance issues. This limits his value to any Cover 2 team that uses a defensive line rotation.

 

IMO, drafting Haloti Ngata at #8 overall is a huge risk, a huge reach, and not getting value for that pick.

[Dibs]

Let's just do a quick review of what we know:

- Ourlads, arguably the most respected indepedent draft service out there, pretty much predicts this guy will be a bust. http://www.stadiumwall.com/index.php?showtopic=44966

- He has a history of nagging injuries, including a rebuilt knee

- He has a history of taking plays off

- He has a history of wearing down in games, which may be related to the taking plays off

- His position, DT, has a history of notable top 10 busts.  Sure, there are other positions with this history as well, but DT is among them.  (OT, for example, does not have this history, with only Mike Williams being a proven out and out bust over the past 15 years as a top 10 pick.  Gallery could be #2).

- He has good talent but he also has a body type that can take years to start to dominate (probably due to effort), and usually for a different team.    Ted Washington was this way.  Sam Adams.  Grady Jackson.  (Shaun Rogers is an exception, as he's been dominant with the Lions, but Rogers was upset that he slipped to a second rounder and played with a chip on his soldier.  We're talking about giving this body type instant millions as the #8 overall pick).  I think I would love Haloti Ngata if we signed him as a free agent four or five years from now.

- The Bills are employing Cover 2, which means there will be a defensive line rotation, which means he'll play a little over half the defensive snaps, especially with his endurance issues.  This limits his value to any Cover 2 team that uses a defensive line rotation.

 

IMO, drafting Haloti Ngata at #8 overall is a huge risk, a huge reach, and not getting value for that pick.

662655[/snapback]

 

Good Post!

[oregonmark]

Let's just do a quick review of what we know:

- Ourlads, arguably the most respected indepedent draft service out there, pretty much predicts this guy will be a bust. http://www.stadiumwall.com/index.php?showtopic=44966

- He has a history of nagging injuries, including a rebuilt knee

- He has a history of taking plays off

- He has a history of wearing down in games, which may be related to the taking plays off

- His position, DT, has a history of notable top 10 busts.  Sure, there are other positions with this history as well, but DT is among them.  (OT, for example, does not have this history, with only Mike Williams being a proven out and out bust over the past 15 years as a top 10 pick.  Gallery could be #2).

- He has good talent but he also has a body type that can take years to start to dominate (probably due to effort), and usually for a different team.    Ted Washington was this way.  Sam Adams.  Grady Jackson.  (Shaun Rogers is an exception, as he's been dominant with the Lions, but Rogers was upset that he slipped to a second rounder and played with a chip on his soldier.  We're talking about giving this body type instant millions as the #8 overall pick).  I think I would love Haloti Ngata if we signed him as a free agent four or five years from now.

- The Bills are employing Cover 2, which means there will be a defensive line rotation, which means he'll play a little over half the defensive snaps, especially with his endurance issues.  This limits his value to any Cover 2 team that uses a defensive line rotation.

 

IMO, drafting Haloti Ngata at #8 overall is a huge risk, a huge reach, and not getting value for that pick.

662655[/snapback]

 

Something to keep in mind as it has been said that Ngata takes plays off and wears down etc. He played on all special teams except kick off and kick off return. He was also very adept at blocking kicks and general disruption of place kicks by forcing the middle. He will be in much better physical condition as a pro athelete than he was as a college player.

[Orton's Arm]

Nice story, but I feel very sure of one thing:

 

when we look back at the players who were available at #8 in this draft two, three, or four years from now, we will not consider Ngata the best of them.

 

I'm not confident of his ability or work ethic or devotion to football.  I don't see a lot of talk about football, high energy, excitement, and the times I've seen him personally he hasn't seemed to do much other than be big.  Big is good, but not enough.  If we pick him, I will change my tune and become a big Ngata fan, because I'm an optimist and loyal fan (other than Holcomb), but I really hope he isn't our pick right now.

662439[/snapback]

Good post, except for the part about Holcomb!

[PortlandBillsFan]

I get that the Bills want to rotate their D-line, but who exactly are we going to rotate in? Anderson? Sape? I'm not comfortable with either of these guys being key parts of a rotation at DT. Tripplett was a solid pickup, but it's going to take a lot more than that to solve our run defense problems. Also remember that Haloti played every down at Oregon, not just run downs. If he is rotating in and out, his endurance issues become less of a factor.

[Ozymandius]

I get that the Bills want to rotate their D-line, but who exactly are we going to rotate in? Anderson? Sape?  I'm not comfortable with either of these guys being key parts of a rotation at DT.  Tripplett was a solid pickup, but it's going to take a lot more than that to solve our run defense problems.  Also remember that Haloti played every down at Oregon, not just run downs.  If he is rotating in and out, his endurance issues become less of a factor.

662792[/snapback]

 

There are good second and third round DT prospects as well. Nobody said we're not going to draft DT at all, just that it doesn't seem to be a wise investment to draft Ngata at #8 overall (or Bunkley either for that matter). You hope to get a star at that point in the draft, and he's very risky. There are going to be less risky prospects available at that spot. Again, I don't like Bunkley either and would prefer that we not draft DT in the first round.

[oregonmark]

There are good second and third round DT prospects as well.  Nobody said we're not going to draft DT at all, just that it doesn't seem to be a wise investment to draft Ngata at #8 overall (or Bunkley either for that matter).  You hope to get a star at that point in the draft, and he's very risky.  There are going to be less risky prospects available at that spot.  Again, I don't like Bunkley either and would prefer that we not draft DT in the first round.

662803[/snapback]

 

Who is the slam dunk star that you would draft in this position that fills a need?

[PortlandBillsFan]

I guess I'm just tired of us drafting guys like Anderson, Sape, Edwards and Bannan later in the draft and hoping they work out. Ngata is the best DT prospect in the draft, and this is our biggest position of need. I will say that although I wouldn't be disappointed if we took Haloti at 8, ideally we could trade down and still get Ngata, Bunkley or Justice as picking these guys at 8 is a bit of a reach.

[Ozymandius]

Who is the slam dunk star that you would draft in this position that fills a need?

662807[/snapback]

Nobody is slam dunk but there are certainly players like Davis, Huff, or Justice who don't have the injury history, lack of effort history, positional bust history, or body type bust hisotry that Ngata has.

[Ozymandius]

I guess I'm just tired of us drafting guys like Anderson, Sape, Edwards and Bannan later in the draft and hoping they work out.  Ngata is the best DT prospect in the draft, and this is our biggest position of need.  I will say that although I wouldn't be disappointed if we took Haloti at 8, ideally we could trade down and still get Ngata, Bunkley or Justice as picking these guys at 8 is a bit of a reach.

662810[/snapback]

Who said anything about late in the draft??? If the Bills don't go DT in round 1, I'm quite sure they are going to draft a DT in the second round and probably one in the third round as well (since we have two picks in the third). Trust me, the DT talent is deep this year, especially for one-gappers.

[Ozymandius]

I'm also pretty confident that he is NOT going to be the best DT in this draft, at least not for the team that drafts him. It's just as likely that he's going to get injured, fat, or unmotivated.

[Sisyphean Bills]

Nobody is slam dunk but there are certainly players like Davis, Huff, or Justice who don't have the injury history, lack of effort history, positional bust history, or body type bust hisotry that Ngata has.

662815[/snapback]

 

Ngata worked his nads off to come back from a serious knee injury and this is turned around 180 degrees as a negative. Also, it is far more likely that a lineman will not be a bust than other positions, especially QB, yet this gets flipped on its head as well.

 

Mike Williams wasn't a bust because of the position he played or his massive size. He was a bust because he lacked drive, ambition, and work ethic.

[Ozymandius]

Ngata worked his nads off to come back from a serious knee injury and this is turned around 180 degrees as a negative.  Also, it is far more likely that a lineman will not be a bust than other positions, especially QB, yet this gets flipped on its head as well. 

 

Mike Williams wasn't a bust because of the position he played or his massive size. He was a bust because he lacked drive, ambition, and work ethic.

663072[/snapback]

 

I don't care if he worked his nads off to recover from his knee injury. He still has a rebuilt knee and a history of nagging injuries. All things being equal, would you rather have a player with a clean history of health, or a player who has torn an ACL and is constantly bothered by some injury? Thought so. Yes, there are a lot of busts at QB, same with DT. Oh, and guess what? Some are questioning whether Ngata has the drive/ambition/work ethic as well based on his taking plays off in college.

[Ghost of BiB]

I don't care if he worked his nads off to recover from his knee injury.  He still has a rebuilt knee and a history of nagging injuries.  All things being equal, would you rather have a player with a clean history of health, or a player who has torn an ACL and is constantly bothered by some injury?  Thought so.  Yes, there are a lot of busts at QB, same with DT.  Oh, and guess what?  Some are questioning whether Ngata has the drive/ambition/work ethic as well based on his taking plays off in college.

663090[/snapback]

 

Give it up. It's the new shiny toy theory vs. objective thought. I keep looking at one decent year. In college. A lot of college players never see the NFL. Why? Because they are college competition.

 

If the pick for needs crowd really wants to pick for need, trade down.

[cantankerous]

Ozy...you keep harping on Ngata having a rebuilt knee. Well it seems to me nowadays rebuilt knees are stronger than before injuries. Medical technology is amazing these days...what makes you think Ngata's knee is such a liability?

[Ozymandius]

Ozy...you keep harping on Ngata having a rebuilt knee. Well it seems to me nowadays rebuilt knees are stronger than before injuries. Medical technology is amazing these days...what makes you think Ngata's knee is such a liability?

663110[/snapback]

I guess opinions can vary on whether the knee is stronger now (personally I still prefer the uncut knee to the cut knee) but I don't think either of us is in a position to judge that. What concerns me more is that he tore the knee in the first place. He's injury prone. When he came back from the knee injury in 2004, he was then slowed for a huge chunk of the season by a nagging hamstring injury. And then this past year, he was hobbled late in the season by an ankle sprain. Then, in his bowl game, he was forced to leave the game due to a knee sprain (and sidenote: Oregon started playing better without him in there.) Notice how all these injuries are lower body. It's always a concern with a guy this big -- does he have the ligaments and tendons to support that kind of weight? If we draft him, is he always going to be playing at 80% due to some nagging injury? When is the next ACL tear going to occur? Bunkley tore his knee twice, for example (the same knee, btw, so maybe it does NOT get stronger). I would just hate to take on an injury risk at the #8 overall pick. I like the fact that he will play through injuries (except, of course, when the ligament is completely torn), but if he's consistently slowed by injuries, his value drops dramatically. Maybe that's why he seems so sluggish sometimes, he's injured.