RW sends notes during games

[GG]

I think you are looking down on the little guy here a tad, GG.  Leaving a bad job is what it is and people in all lines of work do it every day.  Fry cooks, Wall St. execs, and every sort of job in between.  There is little to be drawn from this other than people are not always happy with their jobs.

 

Which is precisely why intoducing salary levels into a discussion of micromanagers is ridiculous.

 

My questions about the situation under discussion are:

 

- What is the truth about Wilson's handling of his team?  Is he really meddlesome?  Or is there more going on there? 

 

I haven't a clue, but recall this criticism of Wilson was attributed to Greggo a few weeks back, and now everyone is assuming that it's TD & MM who are spinning it.

 

But if we look at the 45 history of the Bills, only Levy has seemed to have a good relationship with the owner. The last three GMs didn't exactly part with kindness. The GM (McGroder) before Polian had a great working relationship with Wilson, but the Bills also sucked during his tenure.

[apuszczalowski]

But still, why did the Bills go from being a model franchise to being the so-called most dysfunctional franchise in all of sports?

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The Team continued to lose and showed no signs of inprovement over those 5-6 years.

 

Calling them "So-called most dysfunctional franchise in all of sports" is taking it a bit too far, They are not even close to that title.

[GG]

Speaking of stark contrasts, the Steelers with their 2nd year QB and the Bills with their 2nd year QB couldn't be more contrasting than black from white at present.  Cowher "let" Mularkey go but deftly kept Whisenhunt from leaving too.  Just some things that make me go, "Hmm."

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C'mon you know better than to compare Ben to Losman at their current stages of development.

 

As to Mularkey vs Whisenhunt, I believe that they ran virtually identical offenses, except for the obvious personnel differences. If you switched the two coaches, I doubt the outcomes of the two teams would have been much different.

[Kultarr]

I haven't a clue, but recall this criticism of Wilson was attributed to Greggo a few weeks back, and now everyone is assuming that it's TD & MM who are spinning it. 

 

But if we look at the 45 history of the Bills, only Levy has seemed to have a good relationship with the owner.  The last three GMs didn't exactly part with kindness.  The GM (McGroder) before Polian had a great working relationship with Wilson, but the Bills also sucked during his tenure.

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Nor do I, my friend, nor do I. I don't think Wilson is perfect by any stretch. I don't tend to think of him as being as meddlesome as Al Davis or Jerry Jones, the old Jerry Jones anyway.

 

I do think it was time for TD to go. There is more to being a good GM than creating a "big buzz" on draft day with eye-candy picks or swaggering trades.

[Kultarr]

Calling them "So-called most dysfunctional franchise in all of sports" is taking it a bit too far, They are not even close to that title.

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Oh, I agree with you.

 

But, the fact is the Bills are taking a lot of pot shots from the experts lately.

[stuckincincy]

...It's amazing how much you people think you can put up with because there's money involved.  Too many of you sound like you'd be comfy with a porcupine living in your rectum as long as there a big cash payment when you finally take a dump.

 

 

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Your way with words is...poetry in motion.

[eball]

I've read most of this thread and found it generally amusing. I'll only add that the presence of Marv in the organization will likely alleviate this "concern" if it ever really existed. Ralph trusts Marv, and I'm just not sure he ever really trusted Butler (particularly at the end) or Donahoe.

[Kultarr]

C'mon you know better than to compare Ben to Losman at their current stages of development.

 

My unstated question was more along the lines of "Who's brilliant idea was it to expect Losman to be the next Big Ben?" Big Ben won the job in Pitt. because of what he did on the field. For some reason, TD and/or MM decided JPL should jut be handed the job in Buffalo.

 

My other unstated question is, "Do you think if Big Ben had been drafted by some other team, other than Bill Cowher's, and had success that TD's decisions on JPL and Bledsoe may have played out different?" We'll never know, of course.

 

As to Mularkey vs Whisenhunt, I believe that they ran virtually identical offenses, except for the obvious personnel differences.  If you switched the two coaches, I doubt the outcomes of the two teams would have been much different.

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Again, we'll never know for sure. Whisenhunt has done a great job keeping the system going, developing Big Ben, etc. Talent has a lot to do with it. And probably Bill Cowher as well. Still, I guess I don't think of the Steelers as being a great offensive team. Better now than they were when Mularkey was there, though. I think they still take their shots, but they've stepped it down some.

[GG]

My unstated question was more along the lines of "Who's brilliant idea was it to expect Losman to be the next Big Ben?"  Big Ben won the job in Pitt. because of what he did on the field.  For some reason, TD and/or MM decided JPL should jut be handed the job in Buffalo.

 

My other unstated question is, "Do you think if Big Ben had been drafted by some other team, other than Bill Cowher's, and had success that TD's decisions on JPL and Bledsoe may have played out different?"  We'll never know, of course.

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We'll probably find out through next season or after, who's brilliant idea it was to give the job to Losman without a fight. And I agree that was the move that doomed the season and the administration.

 

But, if last season's staff thought that Losman could be a bona fide starter, just because Ben did it in his rookie year, and Brady did it in his second year, and not by judging Losman's ability in trining camp & practice, then I have no issue with none of them ever setting foot in Buffalo again.

[Kultarr]

We'll probably find out through next season or after, who's brilliant idea it was to give the job to Losman without a fight.  And I agree that was the move that doomed the season and the administration.

 

But, if last season's staff thought that Losman could be a bona fide starter, just because Ben did it in his rookie year, and Brady did it in his second year, and not by judging Losman's ability in trining camp & practice, then I have no issue with none of them ever setting foot in Buffalo again.

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That move coupled with building a "smashmouth" line out of RGs, a TE, and and anchored by a finesse lineman who's forte is pulling, trapping, and cut blocking. (Well, my Broncos friends tell me he wasn't really all that great at that even.)

[Kelly the Dog]

We'll probably find out through next season or after, who's brilliant idea it was to give the job to Losman without a fight.  And I agree that was the move that doomed the season and the administration.

 

But, if last season's staff thought that Losman could be a bona fide starter, just because Ben did it in his rookie year, and Brady did it in his second year, and not by judging Losman's ability in trining camp & practice, then I have no issue with none of them ever setting foot in Buffalo again.

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I honestly believe, then and now, that the decision to go with Losman was 95% to do with we can go no further with Drew than we have and 5% Losman is ready to take this team on his shoulders. And the "better chance to win" thing was total bullschit from the getgo. Everyone at One Boces Drive must have known as soon as they traded for Holcomb that Holcomb gave them "the best chance to win" right off the bat. It was obvious. Especially obvious with the fact that they thought they had great special teams and great defense. And I really don't think at all that once they traded for KH they thought uh oh, we said we were going to start the kid and now he doesn't give us the best chance to win right away, Kelly Holcomb does. I think that they honestly believed that the defense was good, that the line would block for Willis, that the special teams would be good for field position. And that yeah, JP is going to suck sometimes, but he is not a guy that turns the ball over a ton, despite his schoolyard looks.

 

Somewhere along the line, however, they fukked up bad. They got enamored with Losman's arm and it worked in the first game of the year against the lowly Texans. And then it all blew up in their face when Milloy and Vincent and Spikes got hurt in the second game of the year and they couldn't stop anyone, AND when they realized that Losman wasn't near ready to read defenses and the line couldn't block for him or Willis. And then they panicked. Then continually put the kid in a position to get creamed, the team continually killed itself and got killed by its opponent and then they just tried to save the season and their individual and collective asses in a series of bad decisions.

 

And they basically all got fired for it.

[eball]

I honestly believe, then and now, that the decision to go with Losman was 95% to do with we can go no further with Drew than we have and 5% Losman is ready to take this team on his shoulders. And the "better chance to win" thing was total bullschit from the getgo. Everyone at One Boces Drive must have known as soon as they traded for Holcomb that Holcomb gave them "the best chance to win" right off the bat. It was obvious. Especially obvious with the fact that they thought they had great special teams and great defense. And I really don't think at all that once they traded for KH they thought uh oh, we said we were going to start the kid and now he doesn't give us the best chance to win right away, Kelly Holcomb does. I think that they honestly believed that the defense was good, that the line would block for Willis, that the special teams would be good for field position. And that yeah, JP is going to suck sometimes, but he is not a guy that turns the ball over a ton, despite his schoolyard looks.

 

Somewhere along the line, however, they fukked up bad. They got enamored with Losman's arm and it worked in the first game of the year against the lowly Texans. And then it all blew up in their face when Milloy and Vincent and Spikes got hurt in the second game of the year and they couldn't stop anyone, AND when they realized that Losman wasn't near ready to read defenses and the line couldn't block for him or Willis. And then they panicked. Then continually put the kid in a position to get creamed, the team continually killed itself and got killed by its opponent and then they just tried to save the season and their individual and collective asses in a series of bad decisions.

 

And they basically all got fired for it.

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Nice summary. This post should be pinned.

[X. Benedict]

Sure he sends notes, but it is stuff like, "Tell the guys I banged Kraft's wife last night" or "Tell the men there is a $5000 bounty on the guy that breaks Brady's knee."

 

Ralph's out of control.

[In space no one can hear]

If I sent Donahoe and Mularkey.... the notes....I would really like to send them...

 

I would be in prison right now!

 

Neither one of them has any mental toughness!!

Oh....poor babies someone passed them a note.....lets cry to the press!!!

[GG]

I honestly believe, then and now, that the decision to go with Losman was 95% to do with we can go no further with Drew than we have and 5% Losman is ready to take this team on his shoulders. And the "better chance to win" thing was total bullschit from the getgo. Everyone at One Boces Drive must have known as soon as they traded for Holcomb that Holcomb gave them "the best chance to win" right off the bat. It was obvious. Especially obvious with the fact that they thought they had great special teams and great defense. And I really don't think at all that once they traded for KH they thought uh oh, we said we were going to start the kid and now he doesn't give us the best chance to win right away, Kelly Holcomb does. I think that they honestly believed that the defense was good, that the line would block for Willis, that the special teams would be good for field position. And that yeah, JP is going to suck sometimes, but he is not a guy that turns the ball over a ton, despite his schoolyard looks.

 

Somewhere along the line, however, they fukked up bad. They got enamored with Losman's arm and it worked in the first game of the year against the lowly Texans. And then it all blew up in their face when Milloy and Vincent and Spikes got hurt in the second game of the year and they couldn't stop anyone, AND when they realized that Losman wasn't near ready to read defenses and the line couldn't block for him or Willis. And then they panicked. Then continually put the kid in a position to get creamed, the team continually killed itself and got killed by its opponent and then they just tried to save the season and their individual and collective asses in a series of bad decisions.

 

And they basically all got fired for it.

597411[/snapback]

 

I like this theory, but think that there's a minor flaw in it. Judging by the veterans' reaction to the move, it would appear that Losman was nowhere near a level of even being a basic caretaker of the offense that the coaching staff wanted him to be.

[Kelly the Dog]

I like this theory, but think that there's a minor flaw in it.  Judging by the veterans' reaction to the move, it would appear that Losman was nowhere near a level of even being a basic caretaker of the offense that the coaching staff wanted him to be.

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I think that was well after the fact, when they saw their glory season going up in smoke. I think they believed this greatest defense crap. They knew they had great special teams. They too thought that the big fat guys would block for Willis. And I honestly believe that Mularkey and Clements, with TD right behind him, just lost all their senses. They never ever ever asked Losman to do what they asked Holcomb to do, when the smart thing, and the expected thing, and the only thing, and the Big Ben thing, was to run a conservative offense, with roll outs, quick passes, dump passes, WR screens, play action, etc, to get the kid used to the NFL. They NEVER did that. Opening drive, game one, they came out throwing. All four of his games before he was benched they had him drop back deep in the pocket, asked him to read defenses, go through his progressions when the WRs weren't open, all under a worfully inadequate and injured pass blocking OL. It was monumentally stupid, even though it worked in the Texans game.

 

It was only after seeing JP fail miserably when he couldn't make good decisions that the vets turned on him. They should have turned on Mularkey and Clements. It wasn't remarkable that they immediately went into a conservative approach when Holcomb came in. That is all he is capable of doing. They should have run the Kelly Holcomb offense from game one series one, too, and they probably would still be in Buffalo.

 

And I know that Losman can not do the things that Holcomb does. But IMO he didn't have to. He can make a quick throw. His inaccuracy came mostly because he was rattled. If they did WR screens and swing passes and roll outs to the TE and button hooks he could have done decently well. But they didn't. They gave him 5 and 7 step drops.

[TigerJ]

What, the owner isn't allowed to talk to the GM or coach?  During the game, it may be uneeded or even detrimental, but having to talk to the your boss for "hours" during the week isn't really that far fetched...  How many of you don't talk to your boss at least a few hours during a week?

 

CW

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I think an occasional call is fine, but my perception at least is that a good head coach will put in 60 to 70 hours a week, reviewing film, putting a game plan in place, leadinig practices, conferring with assistants, and a bunch of miscellaneous tasks I can only guess at, not to mention media interviews and public appearances. If on top of that the coach has to spend a couple hours a day consoling the owner, I think it could get real burdensome. I would expect if a team is losing consistently the coach should expect to catch a lot of heat from the owner, but if the team is winning, let the coach do his job.