Orton's Arm Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 That "nice long pass" was 15 maybe 2o yards, Moulds did the rest of the 55. 493204[/snapback] Watch the play again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 Watch the play again. 493208[/snapback] I think the "pass" was about 25 yards, Moulds ran for the last 30! I don't worry so much about Holcombs arm strength, or his mobility. People are just bitching to B word, and we always have to have a whipping boy....JP was truly dreadful, but so many people here have man crushes on him, they can't deal with the fact that he may, in fact, suck! So, Holcomb, a journeyman back-up who has performed well on a bad team is the whipping boy, because he isn't good enough to carry a bad team. I am all for letting JP play at this point, just to see what we have. I have to say though, his last three starts may have been as bad as any 3 starts put together by any Bills QB in the last 20 years... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 If I thought Losman could be the next Eli Manning, I'd have a different opinion about things. As things stand, the player on our roster who has the best chance of proving himself the QB of the future is Kelly Holcomb. 493179[/snapback] The Bills had the ball for 39 minutes and only scored 16 points (that's pitiful). The Bills only scored 17 while Oakland had a bunch of scrubs in their secondary (this too was pitiful). Whatever bloom was on the Holcomb rose is long gone. Jim Kelly never would have never thrown that 4th and 7 ball where Holcomb threw it. Losman wouldn't have either. It was a chiken sh** pass delivered by a chiken sh** arm. Make no mistake, this is JP Losman's team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orton's Arm Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 The Bills had the ball for 39 minutes and only scored 16 points (that's pitiful). It's good that the offense kept the defense off the field, bad that it didn't turn into points. As has been pointed out in other threads, the red zone troubles were largely a result of drops by receivers and insufficient attention to the running game in the red zone. The Bills only scored 17 while Oakland had a bunch of scrubs in their secondary (this too was pitiful). If a QB has great pass protection, even a great secondary usually won't be able to stop him. If a QB has terrible pass protection, even a terrible secondary usually will. Holcomb had terrible protection. Absolutely terrible. Whatever bloom was on the Holcomb rose is long gone. Yeah, his propensity to avoid sacks, and his 92 passer rating for 2005, sure are a step down from Bledsoe and the passer rating in the 70s he had last year. Make no mistake, this is JP Losman's team. 493226[/snapback] What, precisely, has Losman done to earn the right to call this his team? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 What, precisely, has Losman done to earn the right to call this his team? 493236[/snapback] He was drafted in the first round. Time to see what we have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 People keep comparing Losman to Eli Manning, Peyton Manning, and Carson Palmer. They correctly point out that they all struggled their first season (or half season) of starts. I don't think, however, that any of them looked as raw (or bad if you prefer) as Losman. Palmer, and the Mannings, while having rouhg starts, all showed flashes of their potential. JP only got worse with each start. He has a very long way to go...and he still might not be any good. Next Brett Favre, or the next Joey Harrington? I think Holcomb has performed very well, all and all, but we might as well see what we have in this kid... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realist Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 People keep comparing Losman to Eli Manning, Peyton Manning, and Carson Palmer. They correctly point out that they all struggled their first season (or half season) of starts. I don't think, however, that any of them looked as raw (or bad if you prefer) as Losman. Palmer, and the Mannings, while having rouhg starts, all showed flashes of their potential. JP only got worse with each start. He has a very long way to go...and he still might not be any good. Next Brett Favre, or the next Joey Harrington? I think Holcomb has performed very well, all and all, but we might as well see what we have in this kid... 493268[/snapback] We'll never know unless he's given enough time to start. The defense isn't good enough for this team to get in the playoffs against the competition we will be facing. Its time to see what Losman can do in the long haul. I have nothing against Holcomb, I just think we need to give Losman a chance since the playoffs are all but gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 People keep comparing Losman to Eli Manning, Peyton Manning, and Carson Palmer. They correctly point out that they all struggled their first season (or half season) of starts. I don't think, however, that any of them looked as raw (or bad if you prefer) as Losman. Palmer, and the Mannings, while having rouhg starts, all showed flashes of their potential. JP only got worse with each start. He has a very long way to go...and he still might not be any good. Next Brett Favre, or the next Joey Harrington? I think Holcomb has performed very well, all and all, but we might as well see what we have in this kid... 493268[/snapback] So in the mean time tread water with a 10 year career backup????????? You're not making any sense. Regardless of your opinion of how good or bad he'll be, JP was drafted in the first round. No one, including you, knows Losman's future as an NFL QB. We're not comparing JP to Eli, we're comparing the situations of both teams. The Giants were very smart in letting Eli go through the growing pains last season. The Bills would be very smart to do the same with JP. Will JP be as good as Eli? Who cares at this point. The Bills will look like complete a**holes if in 2006, JP Losman will be starting from scratch all over again after the team spent the 2005 season jerking around with a dead end and dead armed QB named Kelly Holcomb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 We'll never know unless he's given enough time to start. The defense isn't good enough for this team to get in the playoffs against the competition we will be facing. Its time to see what Losman can do in the long haul. I have nothing against Holcomb, I just think we need to give Losman a chance since the playoffs are all but gone. 493271[/snapback] Amen! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orton's Arm Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 He was drafted in the first round. Time to see what we have. 493261[/snapback] I can only speak for myself, but I'm more curious about whether Holcomb can continue to play as well as he has been than about whether Losman can begin to play adequately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 Amen! 493288[/snapback] now you say amen........forget it they arent goint to start him theyre going to try and make a run at this thing no one is comparing him to mannings or palmers or even ortons......just that you dont know till you play him which those guys had a chance to do .....you were all for sticking him on the bench so why stop now? what is the point of doing it in the first place? holcomb has no shot of showing close to the afore mentioned quarterbacks ability but losman hasnt had a chance to but has far better tools......its the coaching staffs job to tap his ability not !@#$ him up holcomb has chances to not lose games but he's not going to win any.....4th and 7 c'mon at least try for a pass interference........9 years he's proven no good but jp has had 3 games he's 1-2........dont even count the new orleans game cause it's incomplete the fans should be pissed....they invested too much to waste even 4 games on holcomb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CircleTheWagons Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 I'm more curious about whether Holcomb can continue to play as well as he has been than about whether Losman can begin to play adequately. 493292[/snapback] Why? Do you really think if Holcomb continues to play as well as he has we will go to the playoffs this year? If yes, then I understand your position - if no, then why not let Losman get some experience in the second half of the year and open up the QB competition in training camp. I don't want Losman getting a free ride again next summer. Let him get the experience over the next 8 games, and if he doesn't improve, we need to open up all our options for training camp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 Why? Do you really think if Holcomb continues to play as well as he has we will go to the playoffs this year? If yes, then I understand your position - if no, then why not let Losman get some experience in the second half of the year and open up the QB competition in training camp. I don't want Losman getting a free ride again next summer. Let him get the experience over the next 8 games, and if he doesn't improve, we need to open up all our options for training camp. 493300[/snapback] holcombs arm is probably some pat or phish fan talking stupid to get you riled up...buftex on the other hand really is stupid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smuvtalker Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 I can only speak for myself, but I'm more curious about whether Holcomb can continue to play as well as he has been than about whether Losman can begin to play adequately. 493292[/snapback] I wonder, as much of a KH advocate that you seem to be, which would you rather see happen? Kelly Holcomb start the rest of the season, throw for 20 TDs and 12INTs, and a passer rating of 92.0, and the Bills miss the playoffs, OR JP Losman comes in, plays like a rookie is supposed to play, displays flashes of why we brought him in, and the Bills sneak into the playoffs. Which would you prefer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 So in the mean time tread water with a 10 year career backup????????? You're not making any sense. Regardless of your opinion of how good or bad he'll be, JP was drafted in the first round. No one, including you, knows Losman's future as an NFL QB. We're not comparing JP to Eli, we're comparing the situations of both teams. The Giants were very smart in letting Eli go through the growing pains last season. The Bills would be very smart to do the same with JP. Will JP be as good as Eli? Who cares at this point. The Bills will look like complete a**holes if in 2006, JP Losman will be starting from scratch all over again after the team spent the 2005 season jerking around with a dead end and dead armed QB named Kelly Holcomb. 493286[/snapback] I guess you didn't read my post...the part about how, at this point, "we might as well see what we have in this kid..." The original topic was that fans being a little overly critiacal of Holcomb. I agree that he has done nothing to lose the job, but that it is time to let Losman play, because as good as Holcomb has played, he is not good enough to carry a bad team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 I guess you didn't read my post...the part about how, at this point, "we might as well see what we have in this kid..." The original topic was that fans being a little overly critiacal of Holcomb. I agree that he has done nothing to lose the job, but that it is time to let Losman play, because as good as Holcomb has played, he is not good enough to carry a bad team. 493311[/snapback] i read it...so youre a flip flopper......why waste the time? newsflash jp might have shown these flashes you were talking about by now, he might be the best qb on the team by now, but he's not cause of the insane move in the first place.................like you argued with me before my argument is the same.....you just wasted a mini, and training camp, 4 pre season games and the most part of 3 regular season games....................regression back to zero..................you said if he even plays in 5 more games he will have had the experience an eli manning was granted the year before........................wrong........manning played 8 games in a row it's not the same start showing some empty seats in that stadium folks...........its time to let em know you arent standing for piss poor handling cause ralph might be too old or naive to know whats up at this point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 holcombs arm is probably some pat or phish fan talking stupid to get you riled up...buftex on the other hand really is stupid 493304[/snapback] I have to question your reading and comprehension. All I have said is that Holcomb is a better QB, at this point, than JP Losman. I have serious doubts that Losman will pan out to be anything better than Holcomb is now. I have also, like you, advocated that we play Losman at this point, because we are not going anywhere. I was fully behind starting Holcomb, for four games, anything less than a 3-1 records in those starts, I was, and am, all for letting Losman play. He was absolutley dreadful for 3 weeks. Holcomb was competent for 4. Either way, it was not good enough to make this team a contender for a playoff spot! I wasn't sure about Holcomb, and was all for giving him a shot. He had his shot. I don't think he contributed nearly as much to the last two losses, as Holcomb contributed to his last two losses. Fug you Johnny! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 i read it...so youre a flip flopper......why waste the time? newsflash jp might have shown these flashes you were talking about by now, he might be the best qb on the team by now, but he's not cause of the insane move in the first place.................like you argued with me before my argument is the same.....you just wasted a mini, and training camp, 4 pre season games and the most part of 3 regular season games....................regression back to zero..................you said if he even plays in 5 more games he will have had the experience an eli manning was granted the year before........................wrong........manning played 8 games in a row it's not the same start showing some empty seats in that stadium folks...........its time to let em know you arent standing for piss poor handling cause ralph might be too old or naive to know whats up at this point 493317[/snapback] Okay, you can read, you just can't keep track of two concepts at once...why is it a "flip-flop" to say that yes, idiot fans like yourself are being unduly harsh in their criticism of Holcomb, but, yes, the team is not good enough, so we might as well see what Losman can do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 I have to question your reading and comprehension. All I have said is that Holcomb is a better QB, at this point, than JP Losman. I have serious doubts that Losman will pan out to be anything better than Holcomb is now. I have also, like you, advocated that we play Losman at this point, because we are not going anywhere. I was fully behind starting Holcomb, for four games, anything less than a 3-1 records in those starts, I was, and am, all for letting Losman play. He was absolutley dreadful for 3 weeks. Holcomb was competent for 4. Either way, it was not good enough to make this team a contender for a playoff spot! I wasn't sure about Holcomb, and was all for giving him a shot. He had his shot. I don't think he contributed nearly as much to the last two losses, as Holcomb contributed to his last two losses. Fug you Johnny! 493321[/snapback] i dont care what you question, if you cant recognize one has a ton more raw talent than the other youre not worth discussing any issues with anyway...........anything less than 3-1? you dont give anyone much of a chance................you said it all when you said 3 games, the other had 9 years oh and fug you too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted November 1, 2005 Share Posted November 1, 2005 i dont care what you question, if you cant recognize one has a ton more raw talent than the other youre not worth discussing any issues with anyway...........anything less than 3-1? you dont give anyone much of a chance................you said it all when you said 3 games, the other had 9 years oh and fug you too 493327[/snapback] Where exactly did you see all this "ton of raw talent"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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