N.Y. Orangeman Posted February 27, 2005 Share Posted February 27, 2005 While I'd hate to lost Pat and assuming Edwards/Anderson arent' ready, I'd love to give Hovan a solid look. Playing next to a space eater and having the opportunity to work with Krumrie would be great for him IMO. While he wouldn't be cheap, he also wouldn't cost $5m and is only 26. Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JP-era Posted February 27, 2005 Share Posted February 27, 2005 While I'd hate to lost Pat and assuming Edwards/Anderson arent' ready, I'd love to give Hovan a solid look. Playing next to a space eater and having the opportunity to work with Krumrie would be great for him IMO. While he wouldn't be cheap, he also wouldn't cost $5m and is only 26. Any thoughts? 254510[/snapback] I LOVE that move, any one who loves the Bills and wears the face paint like (Richter I think?) is a guy the Bills should get. He has HUGE upside and is a nasty player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted February 27, 2005 Share Posted February 27, 2005 While I'd hate to lost Pat and assuming Edwards/Anderson arent' ready, I'd love to give Hovan a solid look. Playing next to a space eater and having the opportunity to work with Krumrie would be great for him IMO. While he wouldn't be cheap, he also wouldn't cost $5m and is only 26. Any thoughts? 254510[/snapback] I think Gerard Warren might be a good pickup if Williams leaves. He's a very talented guy who might develop next to Sam Adams. Adams knows a thing about slow starts to a career and how to overcome them and shake the label of being a dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.Y. Orangeman Posted February 27, 2005 Author Share Posted February 27, 2005 I think Gerard Warren might be a good pickup if Williams leaves. He's a very talented guy who might develop next to Sam Adams. Adams knows a thing about slow starts to a career and how to overcome them and shake the label of being a dog. 254536[/snapback] Warren would be great any other year IMO. However, without a first round pick and Cleveland likely seeking a first day pick, I'm wary of giving up too much for him. If they'd take a 2006 pick, I'd be more interested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JP-era Posted February 27, 2005 Share Posted February 27, 2005 Warren would be great any other year IMO. However, without a first round pick and Cleveland likely seeking a first day pick, I'm wary of giving up too much for him. If they'd take a 2006 pick, I'd be more interested. 254540[/snapback] I liked him alot more before the QB injury related crack. I think hes a tud but his attitude puts him in the "not meant for the BIlls" category. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CajunBillsBacker Posted February 27, 2005 Share Posted February 27, 2005 I'm all for it, Hovan would be much better lining up next to someone like Sam Adams and don't have to always be counted on being "the man" in the middle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted February 27, 2005 Share Posted February 27, 2005 Warren would be great any other year IMO. However, without a first round pick and Cleveland likely seeking a first day pick, I'm wary of giving up too much for him. If they'd take a 2006 pick, I'd be more interested. 254540[/snapback] I wouldn't trade anything for Warren, let alone a first day pick. The belief is that he may be released if noboby steps up. Trading for the player means you either give the guy a new deal or eat his base salary, which is high for a gamble like Warren. Right now, he is more than just a guy in the wrong place at the wrong time, he's a reclamation project. Wouldn't trade for Hovan either. These guys are only appealing if they don't cost personnel/picks in return. As for Hovan, he is only effective if put in position to rush the passer. The Vikings prefer to use Kevin Williams to attack, and rightly so as Williams is one of the best in the game. Anyone lining up next to Adams has to be versatile enough to tie up blockers when called upon because Adams is at his best attacking. That's why I prefer Warren, a big, wide bodied DT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsGuyInMalta Posted February 27, 2005 Share Posted February 27, 2005 Seriously guys, Warren has shown NOTHING in the NFL other than a bad attitude and his ability to be inept at all aspects of football. Not exactly the type of guy you want on your team. I dont see TD signing any DTs if Pat Williams leaves. We have other priorities that we need to address in FA (Guard, Backup QB, TE) and wasting money on a DT would just be foolish considering we already have Sam Adams and a replacement in either Ron Edwards or Tim Anderson already on roster. Let the two of them fight it out in Training Camp to see who starts at the other DT spot, and lets save that money and pick up a free agent Guard to solidify our O-Line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadBuffaloDisease Posted February 27, 2005 Share Posted February 27, 2005 I guess we'll see what the Bills do should PW walk. If they sign someone else, it means that Edwards and Anderson aren't ready for prime-time. Maybe this is the reason TD hasn't talked about a new contract with PW since last year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Playfair Posted February 27, 2005 Share Posted February 27, 2005 Seriously guys, Warren has shown NOTHING in the NFL other than a bad attitude and his ability to be inept at all aspects of football. Not exactly the type of guy you want on your team. I dont see TD signing any DTs if Pat Williams leaves. We have other priorities that we need to address in FA (Guard, Backup QB, TE) and wasting money on a DT would just be foolish considering we already have Sam Adams and a replacement in either Ron Edwards or Tim Anderson already on roster. Let the two of them fight it out in Training Camp to see who starts at the other DT spot, and lets save that money and pick up a free agent Guard to solidify our O-Line. 254723[/snapback] Couldn't agree more. I hope big Pat gives us a hometown discount, but understand if he doesnt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Tate Posted February 27, 2005 Share Posted February 27, 2005 While I'd hate to lost Pat and assuming Edwards/Anderson arent' ready, I'd love to give Hovan a solid look. Playing next to a space eater and having the opportunity to work with Krumrie would be great for him IMO. While he wouldn't be cheap, he also wouldn't cost $5m and is only 26. Any thoughts? 254510[/snapback] I think I'd want to know why a player has been getting worse every year for the last few years before I took a chance on him. He went from the ProBowl to being deactivated for several games last year. Either the Viking's D coaches blew it bad, or this guy is/was a major head case, but the coaches' story was he was deactivated because he wouldn't listen to their instructions. Those 2003 numbers don't look too hot, either. Year GS Tackles Assists Sacks 2000 16 41.0 5 2 2001 16 29.0 14 6 2002 16 38.0 14 5.5 2003 16 19.0 8 2 2004 13 11.0 9 1.5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJsackedagain Posted February 27, 2005 Share Posted February 27, 2005 NO NO NO NO!!! If this guy isn't good enough to be on the field with the Vikings' D why would the Bills want him???? He might make some of you fans happy with his war paint and schtick, but Hovan is an undersized DT that would be a waste of money here. Buf would be better off with Edwards and The Keg in the middle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JP-era Posted February 28, 2005 Share Posted February 28, 2005 NO NO NO NO!!! If this guy isn't good enough to be on the field with the Vikings' D why would the Bills want him???? He might make some of you fans happy with his war paint and schtick, but Hovan is an undersized DT that would be a waste of money here. Buf would be better off with Edwards and The Keg in the middle 254966[/snapback] Edwards over Hovan? I cant see that man. Hovan is a nasty overahiever who has had a few bad years, Edwards is a guy who has really only shown extremely brief flashes. Hovans numbers and 2004 scout report: Height: 6-2 Weight: 296 lbs. Pos: Defensive Tackle Age: 26 Born: May 12, 1978, Rocky River, OH Experience: 5 years College: Boston College Name: Chris Hovan Position: Defensive Tackle Grade: 75 | Key Alert: None Comment: Hovan is a blue collar type that doesn't have great athletic skills. Appears to be very heady and instinctive player. He is excellent when he is on the move in stunts, and that is probably the best part of his game. He has decent change of direction skills, he really makes an offensive linemen work to redirect in pass protection, and can make plays in space. He is somewhat undersized, however, and despite his aggressiveness he cannot get into a lot of bull rush situations or short area fist fights with bigger, more physical offensive lineman. He is also overly aggressive and at times, in an effort to make things happen, he will take himself out of a play. While he is still a very good football player and you love his work ethic, the reality is that he is not an overly gifted athlete. He will continue to play DT in Minnesota's 4-man defensive fronts, but when the Vikings go to a 3-4 scheme, he has a chance to really flourish as the nose tackle and he can use his one gap quickness to disrupt things inside. I see that as an upgrade to Edwards, just maybe a push to Pat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJsackedagain Posted February 28, 2005 Share Posted February 28, 2005 Again, if Hovan is such a prize then why has he played little with the Vikings lately ---- that team is crying out for defensive help and he can't even get on the field. He's all off-field hype and no substance on the field. Edwards hasn't even played much in Buffalo -- he doesn't have a body of work to be judged by yet. Edwards over Hovan? I cant see that man. Hovan is a nasty overahiever who has had a few bad years, Edwards is a guy who has really only shown extremely brief flashes. Hovans numbers and 2004 scout report: Height: 6-2 Weight: 296 lbs. Pos: Defensive Tackle Age: 26 Born: May 12, 1978, Rocky River, OH Experience: 5 years College: Boston College Name: Chris Hovan Position: Defensive Tackle Grade: 75 | Key Alert: None Comment: Hovan is a blue collar type that doesn't have great athletic skills. Appears to be very heady and instinctive player. He is excellent when he is on the move in stunts, and that is probably the best part of his game. He has decent change of direction skills, he really makes an offensive linemen work to redirect in pass protection, and can make plays in space. He is somewhat undersized, however, and despite his aggressiveness he cannot get into a lot of bull rush situations or short area fist fights with bigger, more physical offensive lineman. He is also overly aggressive and at times, in an effort to make things happen, he will take himself out of a play. While he is still a very good football player and you love his work ethic, the reality is that he is not an overly gifted athlete. He will continue to play DT in Minnesota's 4-man defensive fronts, but when the Vikings go to a 3-4 scheme, he has a chance to really flourish as the nose tackle and he can use his one gap quickness to disrupt things inside. I see that as an upgrade to Edwards, just maybe a push to Pat. 254971[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jokeman Posted February 28, 2005 Share Posted February 28, 2005 I dont see TD signing any DTs if Pat Williams leaves. We have other priorities that we need to address in FA (Guard, Backup QB, TE) and wasting money on a DT would just be foolish considering we already have Sam Adams and a replacement in either Ron Edwards or Tim Anderson already on roster. Let the two of them fight it out in Training Camp to see who starts at the other DT spot, and lets save that money and pick up a free agent Guard to solidify our O-Line. 254723[/snapback] I agree with this brand of thought. Though it might be smart to bring in a vet to at least add to the mix might be wise. I know we cut him last season and know he spent a little time with Tampa in the preseason but I wouldn't mind bring in Oliver Gibson for another look so long he's signed for the league minimum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JP-era Posted February 28, 2005 Share Posted February 28, 2005 Again, if Hovan is such a prize then why has he played little with the Vikings lately ---- that team is crying out for defensive help and he can't even get on the field. He's all off-field hype and no substance on the field. Edwards hasn't even played much in Buffalo -- he doesn't have a body of work to be judged by yet. 254974[/snapback] I agree to disagree, I think Hovan is the right type of player for the Bills and would be great next to a monster like Sam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsGuyInMalta Posted February 28, 2005 Share Posted February 28, 2005 I agree to disagree, I think Hovan is the right type of player for the Bills and would be great next to a monster like Sam. 254978[/snapback] But we dont have the money to do it. Basically all we can afford (If the Travis for Shelton deal goes down) this offseason is a starting guard, a backup QB and a TE. The rest goes to our RFA tender offers and draft picks. Even if you substitute a DT for that TE upgrade, you still dont have enough cash to do it since most starting DTs contracts will be much larger than what you could get a TE for. Ron Edwards or Tim Anderson are fine and dandy with me. We cant keep our young guys from the field...let them fight it out between the two of them and I guarantee we'll see little drop-off in the overall defensive play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted February 28, 2005 Share Posted February 28, 2005 Seriously guys, Warren has shown NOTHING in the NFL 254723[/snapback] Hold up, Warren has been a big disappointment, I said as much. But you are wrong. The guy put up nearly 50 unassisted tackles and had 5 sacks as a rookie DT. Physically, he's what you look for in a DT. Sometimes it takes awhile for these guys to come into their own, mature and appreciate what they have. Sometimes they never do, but guys who are 6'4" and can carry 330+ lbs. and still be athletic are kind of rare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsGuyInMalta Posted February 28, 2005 Share Posted February 28, 2005 Hold up, Warren has been a big disappointment, I said as much. But you are wrong. The guy put up nearly 50 unassisted tackles and had 5 sacks as a rookie DT. Physically, he's what you look for in a DT. Sometimes it takes awhile for these guys to come into their own, mature and appreciate what they have. Sometimes they never do, but guys who are 6'4" and can carry 330+ lbs. and still be athletic are kind of rare. 255045[/snapback] That was 4 years ago though...since then his tackle numbers have slowly decreased, his attitude has increased, and nobody in the NFL is scared of him. I doubt they ever were. Pass on this guy, our replacement for Pat is already on roster. Hopefully no Bills fan is seriously considering having this lump on our team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorCal Aaron Posted February 28, 2005 Share Posted February 28, 2005 .Sometimes it takes awhile for these guys to come into their own, mature and appreciate what they have. Sometimes they never do, but guys who are 6'4" and can carry 330+ lbs. and still be athletic are kind of rare. 255045[/snapback] See Ted Washington. Considered a bust in 4years w/ 9ers & broncs. Don't know much about Warren, but if the price is right bring him into camp. Worst happens is that he goes the way of reggie rogers, odell haggins, mjones etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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