Deranged Rhino Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 (edited) Wait what? They didn't beat us in common opponents? Didn't they beat the Giants and Jags? And Redskins? In fact, their only loss to common opponent was Houston. Divisional record is what I was referring to. The teams you play twice and know really, really well. The NFL is a week to week league, comparing wins against outside divisional opponents isn't very illuminating (how many times have we seen the argument that since team A beat team C, and team B lost to team C, therefore A will surely beat B when they play? It almost never works like that in the NFL or sports in general). Divisional opponents are different because of the sheer number of times you see them in a season. Put it another way to show how meaningless the 10 wins are compared to the Bills 8 (when trying to determine which team is better): If the Jets were truly better than the Bills, they'd be in the playoffs, bottom line. But they aren't in the playoffs because they were not better than the Bills in 2015. For the second year in a row they were swept by the Bills and that directly resulted in the Jets being on the outside looking in (which is a small, but satisfying accomplishment for this Bills team). What'd they get for winning two more games? A worse draft position and a roster with far more holes to fill than in Buffalo. It's meaningless to say the Jets are better just by looking at the overall record and dismissing what transpired on the field when the teams faced off not once, but twice. Edited January 6, 2016 by Deranged Rhino Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 Divisional record is what I was referring to. The teams you play twice and know really, really well. The NFL is a week to week league, comparing wins against outside divisional opponents isn't very illuminating (how many times have we seen the argument that since team A beat team C, and team B lost to team C, therefore A will surely beat B when they play? It almost never works like that in the NFL or sports in general). Divisional opponents are different because of the sheer number of times you see them in a season. Put it another way to show how meaningless the 10 wins are compared to the Bills 8 (when trying to determine which team is better): If the Jets were truly better than the Bills, they'd be in the playoffs, bottom line. But they aren't in the playoffs because they were not better than the Bills in 2015. For the second year in a row they were swept by the Bills and that directly resulted in the Jets being on the outside looking in (which is a small, but satisfying accomplishment for this Bills team). What'd they get for winning two more games? A worse draft position and a roster with far more holes to fill than in Buffalo. It's meaningless to say the Jets are better just by looking at the overall record and dismissing what transpired on the field when the teams faced off not once, but twice. Winning two more games than the Bills didn't give them a roster with more holes. And that's very debatable. Mo Wilk may very well stay there with his broken leg. And while they will be picking two spots behind Buffalo, I know you are quite aware that the draft is a crapshoot. If the Bills board and Jets board are exactly the same? Yes, the Bills have an advantage. However, it probably won't be. And we all know that picking higher guarantees nothing. So while that's a disadvantage, it's slight enough to make no matter. Here's what the Jets have as a positive. They split with a hated division rival. They have a QB and HC combo that just led them to their first winning season in what, 6 years? They are on the right track to building a winning culture and competing with NE. And that's really all that matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 (edited) Winning two more games than the Bills didn't give them a roster with more holes. And that's very debatable. Mo Wilk may very well stay there with his broken leg. And while they will be picking two spots behind Buffalo, I know you are quite aware that the draft is a crapshoot. If the Bills board and Jets board are exactly the same? Yes, the Bills have an advantage. However, it probably won't be. And we all know that picking higher guarantees nothing. So while that's a disadvantage, it's slight enough to make no matter. Here's what the Jets have as a positive. They split with a hated division rival. They have a QB and HC combo that just led them to their first winning season in what, 6 years? They are on the right track to building a winning culture and competing with NE. And that's really all that matters. That QB isn't under contract. The Jets only have 40 players under contract headed into the offseason, they have lots of holes. From a Jets fan's perspective the bolded is true -- but doesn't mean anything for Bills fans. The Bills split with the Pats last year and had a QB/HC combo that lead them to a winning record in 14 -- then what happened? Right. The Jets haven't beaten the Bills since 2013. Saying they're a better team is ignoring reality. Edited January 6, 2016 by Deranged Rhino Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 That QB isn't under contract. The Jets only have 40 players under contract headed into the offseason, they have lots of holes. Fitz is going back. And right. But they didn't get those holes by winning more games, is my point. I don't know if that's what you were trying to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 That QB isn't under contract. The Jets only have 40 players under contract headed into the offseason, they have lots of holes. Who doesn't? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 Fitz is going back. And right. But they didn't get those holes by winning more games, is my point. I don't know if that's what you were trying to say. No, that's not what I'm trying to say. What I'm saying is that Reddog's argument that the Bills need to kneecap Fitz because the Jets are better is false. The Jets are not better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 No, that's not what I'm trying to say. What I'm saying is that Reddog's argument that the Bills need to kneecap Fitz because the Jets are better is false. The Jets are not better. I'll go with a push, pending next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 Who doesn't? Every team. The Bills just have less holes than the Jets -- and beat them 5 straight times, including one game with their backups. I'll go with a push, pending next season. So you think the Jets are a bigger concern to the Bills' playoff chances than the Pats? Come on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 (edited) Every team. The Bills just have less holes than the Jets -- and beat them 5 straight times, including one game with their backups. So you think the Jets are a bigger concern to the Bills' playoff chances than the Pats? Come on. That's a different argument entirely. I just think they're better than us. I don't think we'll sweep them next year. Both are concerns to our playoff chances if they have better records than us. Edited January 6, 2016 by FireChan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 (edited) That's a different argument entirely. I just think they're better than us. I don't think we'll sweep them next year. Both are concerns to our playoff chances if they have better records than us. The argument has drifted, yes. The intent is the same: going just by wins and loses while ignoring what transpired on the actual field between the two teams is a meaningless way to determine who is better -- especially when both teams are sitting out of the post season. By what metric are they better? The Jets had everything to play for in week 17 and couldn't beat our second unit. On TNF the Jets got manhandled by a healthier Bills squad at home. Yes, they split against NE, but so did the Bills last year. ...And they haven't beaten the Bills since 2013(!!). Edited January 6, 2016 by Deranged Rhino Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 Is the training staff different than it was in 2013 and 2014 when the Bills had fewer injuries? No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 The argument has drifted, yes. The intent is the same: going just by wins and loses while ignoring what transpired on the actual field between the two teams is a meaningless way to determine who is better -- especially when both teams are sitting out of the post season. By what metric are they better? The Jets had everything to play for in week 17 and couldn't beat our second unit. On TNF the Jets got manhandled by a healthier Bills squad at home. Yes, they split against NE, but so did the Bills last year. ...And they haven't beaten the Bills since 2013(!!). By wins and losses against common opponents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 By wins and losses against common opponents. You mean teams like the New England Patriots and Jacksonville Jaguars? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 You mean teams like the New England Patriots and Jacksonville Jaguars? I'm agreeing with you pal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 By what metric are they better? The Jets had everything to play for in week 17 and couldn't beat our second unit. Our second unit? Did I miss something? Did EJ start? So now Mario, Jerry Hughes, Sammy, Tyrod, Richie Incognito, Preston Brown, Mr. Big Stuff are second teamers? Who knew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 draft a K Roberto Aguayo boom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#34fan Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 Ding!ding!ding!!!! Not sure if it's the FIRST move I'd make, but it's right up there.. Top 3, for sure. -This S&T staff is JUNK... I've been complaining about them for YEARS.... Key players are always busted-up... -Needs a fresh approach going forward... Bring in a college guy from a top program with a record of maintaining low injuries throughout the season... Hard to make a true playoff run with banged-up guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 (edited) Ding!ding!ding!!!! Not sure if it's the FIRST move I'd make, but it's right up there.. Top 3, for sure. -This S&T staff is JUNK... I've been complaining about them for YEARS.... Key players are always busted-up... -Needs a fresh approach going forward... Bring in a college guy from a top program with a record of maintaining low injuries throughout the season... Hard to make a true playoff run with banged-up guys. Patsies** don't have injuries? Seahawks? Graham, Lynch, Rawls, Richardson. Edited January 7, 2016 by reddogblitz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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