(OT) it's carolina v. duke week

[Ozymandius]

Yeah you're right. Forget the fact the Heels smashed UK, Ga. Tech, and Maryland. BTW the Heels killed Illinois in Greensboro a year ago. Last year squads are pretty close to what both teams have this year. Other than the fact that the Heels have the best Freshman in the country in Marvin Williams.

 

After we beat Duke and Uconn this week I will except your apology!!! 

231179[/snapback]

 

I did not forget that they've been blowing teams out.... I just don't care. UNC is a better team than Duke this year, no doubt. But the pressure is on UNC to win a championship, not compete against Duke.

 

Duke has won a championship in the past decade. UNC hasn't. Roy has never won a championship. This is his most talented team ever, and by far the most talented team in the country. Oh yeah, there's a lot of pressure, and my point is, the fact that UNC has failed their two biggest tests so far could show that they're going to choke.

 

I guess we'll find out.

[eball]

keep dreaming 

 

btw, this year's Carolina team is loaded, but they've failed their two toughest tests so far (playing without felton, and playing at Wake)... both those failures were comfortable wins for the opponents.

 

point is, Roy once again may be coaching a team to become chokers.  are the Heels college basketball's version of the Indianapolis Colts... we'll find out... personally, I would love to see an Illinois-UNC matchup... the Heels would be like a 3 pt favorite, and I would bet the house on the Illini

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it's no surprise that the one piece of the puzzle carolina can't lose is felton. everybody knows that. presuming he stays healthy, this team is so much more mature than last year's version. example #1 -- yesterday's game at florida state. carolina shoots poorly and an FSU run of 4 straight threes pulls them to 49-48 with 12 minutes to go. looks like a repeat of last year, when the heels blew a big lead at FSU. wrong. carolina answers by finishing the game on a 32-12 tear.

 

as for the game at wake forest? try beating a team that shoots something like 30-30 from the free throw line. wake forest is picked by most to be in the final four, by the way. and to say their win was "comfortable" is a bit of a stretch. the heels were within single digits much of the second half -- late -- but wake didn't miss a freaking free throw all day.

 

roy has to win one to put the doubters to rest, no question. but "coaching them to be chokers?" c'mon, that's ridiculous.

[Ozymandius]

when I say comfortable, I mean they never seriously threatened Wake Forest. Wake jumped out to a lead and then held them at arm's length the rest of the way. they never made a single "and prosser calls a timeout as the Heels cut the lead to 4" type runs. It was striking to me because I (and most people) think UNC has easily the most talent in the country, and to lose relatively convincingly like that... it puts a question mark next to their heart. good point about the free throw shooting, though. And indeed Wake Forest is very good.

 

as for coaching them to be chokers, call it what you want, but I have never seen Roy Williams build what I consider to be a tough team. He's had a lot of success, of course, but that's different from being able to build a champion. It's one thing to be able to surgically cut up an inferior team ( and no one does that better than UNC this year), but it's a whole 'nother ball of wax to be able to overcome adversity and win close games against elite competition. Again, look at the Colts for an example of someone who can blow out bad teams better than other people but who will come up small in a big game.

 

I'm not saying UNC necessarily = the Colts. But, I have doubts about how tough they are.

 

We'll find out a little bit more on Wednesday. Honestly, UNC should roll Duke because their biggest strength (transition offense) takes advantage of Duke's biggest weakness (transition defense... lack of depth tires them out and they can't run full speed the entire game).

[Zamboni Man]

It'll be a helluva game. It's just like the Bills/Dolphins, throw out all the records and everything else because it's going to be a dog fight. I personally like Wake Forest, so I couldn't care less who comes out on top, but I get plenty of entertainment at school and work with all the Carolina and Duke fans talking trash.

[Ozymandius]

roy has to win one to put the doubters to rest, no question. but "coaching them to be chokers?" c'mon, that's ridiculous.

 

btw, no more ridiculous than that hoary old chestnut about K faking his back injury to set up Gaudet for the fall

 

I'm mean, but you guys are slanderous

[eball]

btw, no more ridiculous than that hoary old chestnut about K faking his back injury to set up Gaudet for the fall

 

I'm mean, but you guys are slanderous

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i have never suggested that coach K faked his injury. but the fact that he actually petitioned the NCAA and had the losses from that season expunged from his record says a lot, in my mind, about his true character. why leave your man gaudet hang out to dry like that? it was K's team. it just wasn't a good one.

[eball]

We'll find out a little bit more on Wednesday.  Honestly, UNC should roll Duke because their biggest strength (transition offense) takes advantage of Duke's biggest weakness (transition defense... lack of depth tires them out and they can't run full speed the entire game).

231284[/snapback]

 

btw, nice work, dook fan, setting yourself up by predicting a tar heel blowout. if the heels do "roll" dook then you "knew it would happen." and if there is any other result, roy's team has no heart and they're "choking" again.

 

very transparent, ozy.

[col_forbin]

Coach K

 

Be careful what you ask Coack "F" Bomb

[The Poojer]

do those teams still play basketball? i thought this week was SU/UCONN week. now there is a matchup, both teams having won something in recent memory!

[Ozymandius]

but the fact that he actually petitioned the NCAA and had the losses from that season expunged from his record says a lot, in my mind, about his true character.

 

"his true character"? riiiight. that's the kind of mawkish nonsense that drives duke supporters up the wall. you guys have basically turned a routine, logical procedure into something evil just to impugn the character of a man that probably does more charity work than all the coaches in the ACC combined.

 

Think about what you're saying. Let's say Mike Mularkey gets sick and Jerry Gray has to take over as head coach for a few games. Who's coaching record do the wins and losses go to during that interim period? Gray's, of course. There's not even a question about this, and yet in UNC circles, they've turned that routine, logical act into something it's not.

 

BTW, he didn't even petition the NCAA, his AD did. K has won something like 700 games and lost something like 300. I don't think he gives a crap about 4 wins and 15 losses. It's ridiculous that the UNC fanbase thinks he does.

[Ozymandius]

btw, nice work, dook fan, setting yourself up by predicting a tar heel blowout.  if the heels do "roll" dook then you "knew it would happen."  and if there is any other result, roy's team has no heart and they're "choking" again.

 

very transparent, ozy.

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oh, I expect and hope to win. It's Duke-UNC, afterall. I don't play those silly games you mention.

 

But the fact is, Duke has been better the past 6 years. It's about time UNC has a better team again. The pressure's on you guys, not us. The fact is, this is Roy's most talented team ever and they match up well against Duke. If we win, it'll be because we have better intangibles.

 

oh, and "dook." how cute. Is there a UNC fan's handbook that you copy all your posts from?

[HopsGuy]

Go Duke.

 

Carolina Blue is a gay color.

 

 

[BuffOrange]

You think there's a chance Vitale might be doing that game?

[ch19079]

You think there's a chance Vitale might be doing that game?

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LOL, i would put money on it. and every time he said anything good about carolina, the duke fans would call him a homer for carolina.

 

and everytime he said anything good about duke, the carolina fans will call him a homer for duke.

 

eather way, i hate that guy. i just cant stand listening to him talk, or scream, or whatever.,... BABY!!!!!

[BuffOrange]

LOL, i would put money on it. and every time he said anything good about carolina, the duke fans would call him a homer for carolina.

 

and everytime he said anything good about duke, the carolina fans will call him a homer for duke.

 

eather way, i hate that guy. i just cant stand listening to him talk, or scream, or whatever.,... BABY!!!!!

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They're both right....cause he's clearly an ACC homer.

I agree with the "can't stand listening to him talk" part though.

 

I have to say - McDonough, Raftery, and Bilas are outstanding. Best broadcasting team in all of sports. I hope they're doing the Uconn/Cuse game tonight.

[eball]

"his true character"? riiiight.  that's the kind of mawkish nonsense that drives duke supporters up the wall.  you guys have basically turned a routine, logical procedure into something evil just to impugn the character of a man that probably does more charity work than all the coaches in the ACC combined.

 

Think about what you're saying.  Let's say Mike Mularkey gets sick and Jerry Gray has to take over as head coach for a few games.  Who's coaching record do the wins and losses go to during that interim period?  Gray's, of course.  There's not even a question about this, and yet in UNC circles, they've turned that routine, logical act into something it's not.

 

BTW, he didn't even petition the NCAA, his AD did.  K has won something like 700 games and lost something like 300.  I don't think he gives a crap about 4 wins and 15 losses.  It's ridiculous that the UNC fanbase thinks he does.

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if the procedure is so "routine and logical" and "there's not even a question about this" then why weren't the wins and losses attributed to gaudet right from the start? and why didn't coach K, who doesn't "give a crap" about the wins and losses, tell his AD to leave it alone rather than embarrass his assistant?

 

i don't care how much charity work coack K does. this was sh*tty, plain and simple. rationalize it all you want.

[Ozymandius]

if the procedure is so "routine and logical" then why weren't the wins and losses attributed to gaudet right from the start?

 

You really need me to explain this? Ok, I will. Because different organizations have different protocols for handling coaching absences. In the NFL, the assistant who steps in automatically gets outcomes credited to his record. Makes sense, there's nothing further to do. In the (typically) less efficient NCAA, the AD from the school has to submit a request for this to occur.

 

Do you think K is the only coach who has ever missed time due to illness? Rick Majerus, for example, because of his girth and concomitant heart troubles, has missed portions of seasons. Every time this happened, his AD filed the request and Majerus never took credit for any games he didn't coach. Routine procedure when a coach is stricken with illness. And logical, too, since why the hell should coaches take credit for games they didn't coach?

 

It's UNC Kool-Aid that has turned this into something evil that K did, and you've obviously drank it.

 

i don't care how much charity work coack K does. this was sh*tty, plain and simple. rationalize it all you want.

 

Are you kidding me? -->I'm<-- rationalizing? Look at yourself and your brethren. You guys have watched K turn Duke into the #1 program in the country over the past 20 years, and your only way to deal with that reality is to slander him. "Yeah, he has 3 championships, BUT he's evil, see, because there was that one time he didn't take credit for games he didn't coach. Pure evil."

 

BTW, I await evidence that Gaudet was embarassed for receiving credit for games he coached.

 

Give it a rest and stop drinking the Kool-Aid. Anyway, here's to a good game on Wednesday.

 

We're both Bills fans and that's something. Later.

[eball]

BTW, I await evidence that Gaudet was embarassed for receiving credit for games he coached.

 

Give it a rest and stop drinking the Kool-Aid.  Anyway, here's to a good game on Wednesday.

 

We're both Bills fans and that's something.  Later.

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we'll never know for sure, but i'd bet dollars to doughnuts that if gaudet coaches the team to the NCAA tournament the duke AD doesn't submit the request, and K doesn't ask him to. whether gaudet was the bench coach or not for those 15-20 games, K coached them in preseason and through the first third of the regular season. it was his team and he should have taken responsibility for the record. gaudet was made to look like some fool who ruined duke's program for a season. like i said earlier, i'm not suggesting that K's health wasn't an issue -- but if duke had been 9-0 and ranked in the top 5, do you think he would have taken his leave of absence?

 

i respect the basketball program K has built at duke. that doesn't mean i respect the man personally. call it "drinking the carolina kool-aid" if you want.

[Pete]

Fug that- its UConn-Syracuse in 7 minutes! Big East basketball is where its at! Fug the ACC!

[Ozymandius]

we'll never know for sure, but i'd bet dollars to doughnuts that if gaudet coaches the team to the NCAA tournament the duke AD doesn't submit the request, and K doesn't ask him to.  whether gaudet was the bench coach or not for those 15-20 games, K coached them in preseason and through the first third of the regular season.  it was his team and he should have taken responsibility for the record.  gaudet was made to look like some fool who ruined duke's program for a season.  like i said earlier, i'm not suggesting that K's health wasn't an issue -- but if duke had been 9-0 and ranked in the top 5, do you think he would have taken his leave of absence?

 

As for whether this or that woulda happened, I can't help it if you're a cynical person by nature. Personally, I choose to live life more positively and give others the benefit of the doubt, even complete strangers to me, and even if they're famous.

 

Your knowledge of this situations seems to come completely secondhand from other malicious Carolina fans obfuscating the truth, and not from the memory of someone who actually followed what happened. Just so you know, Duke was 9-3 when K left (against a decent schedule), and considering that they had just made the championship game the season prior!, no one in their right mind expected that team to finish with a losing record. Gaudet took a 9-3 team and went 4-15 with them. No one had to "make him look like a fool." That remains the only Duke team of the past 20 years that didn't make the tournament.

 

K meanwhile was hospitalized and immobile with back pain and exhaustion. It was doctor's orders -- take a leave, or risk further dangerous deterioration of health. But please continue to slander him.

 

i respect the basketball program K has built at duke.  that doesn't mean i respect the man personally.  call it "drinking the carolina kool-aid" if you want.

 

I don't care who or what you respect or don't respect. It's just that when I see lies (old lies) propagated about a man I DO respect, I feel the need to respond.

 

BTW, notice how I've managed to keep Roy Williams out of the discussion. Here's a man who you could say lied to an entire state four years ago.

 

Remember that day in Kansas, at that huge press conference at the football stadium where teary-eyed ol' Roy (who tends to be teary-eyed) promised the University and the State that he would stop the flirtations with UNC and remain a Jayhawk forever because Kansas was his family? Remember?

 

Ooops. Didn't quite work out that way.

 

If I were really cynical like you, I would even point out that he managed to stay at Kansas long enough just to see Hinrich and Collison through to graduation (and reap the Final Fours they brought) and then only jumped ship once UNC recruited the burgeoning and coveted athletic talents of Felton, McCants and May, giving him the most talented young team in the country at his disposal once he jumped.

 

But see, I didn't bring ol' Roy up. I understand that sometimes people change their minds and while Roy did break a promise, he did not lie about his feelings that day (although I'd hate to try to convince a Kansan of that)

 

There, in a nutshell, is the difference between a typical Duke fan and a typical Carolina fan. Duke fans remain classy even when discussing their rival while Carolina fans try to slander the rival's coach.