Let's simplify things

[Mikie2times]

Our talent has been the problem people, much more then Ralph, cash to cap, coaching, or any other logic being thrown around. Our talent the last 15 years has been abysmal. It’s been abysmal because our drafting has been abysmal. For the first time in that entire stretch Ralph actually has a scout responsible for player decisions. We actually have a guy whose best trademark isn’t selling tickets, but locating talented players.

 

If we draft well we will win. If we win the face of our organization will change.

[lvbillzfan]

I am going to have to disagree with you a little. We are drafting talented guys. Most of our players were very good college players. They were all top prospects coming out of college.

 

I believe our organization has had absolutely zero direction the past several years. It starts with Ralph, goes down to the front office and then finally the coaching staff. If you ask me, when you are that weak in those areas, the players don't have a chance to succeed.

[Mikie2times]

I am going to have to disagree with you a little. We are drafting talented guys. Most of our players were very good college players. They were all top prospects coming out of college.

 

I believe our organization has had absolutely zero direction the past several years. It starts with Ralph, goes down to the front office and then finally the coaching staff. If you ask me, when you are that weak in those areas, the players don't have a chance to succeed.

How do you win when your BEST QB the last decade was a 50 year old Drew Bledsoe? We missed on every QB attempt we had the last decade. We nearly missed on every first round pick we've had in that same stretch. Are all these guys 2nd string? No, but they're sure as hell aren't providing what is necessary from the draft slot they were chosen at.

 

Direction, ownership, coaching, they all seem to make sense when your winning, and they all seem to not when your losing.

If you wanted me to come up with a list of 10-6 or better teams with crap coaching it would be about one billion times larger then the list of 10-6 or better teams with crap rosters.

 

As crazy as this sounds the games are ultimately won on the field.

[rpcolosi]

How do you win when your BEST QB the last decade was a 50 year old Drew Bledsoe? We missed on every QB attempt we had the last decade. We nearly missed on every first round pick we've had in that same stretch. Are all these guys 2nd string? No, but they're sure as hell aren't providing what is necessary from the draft slot they were chosen at.

 

Direction, ownership, coaching, they all seem to make sense when your winning, and they all seem to not when your losing.

If you wanted me to come up with a list of 10-6 or better teams with crap coaching it would be about one billion times larger then the list of 10-6 or better teams with crap rosters.

 

As crazy as this sounds the games are ultimately won on the field.

 

bingo. winning changes everything.

 

we are not the raiders. ralph is not changing coaches every year (like al davis). sure good players dont want to come here. smae is true of the sabres. why come ot a small, cold city on a lake over san diego or houston? we'd all be the same way if we weren't from here.

 

the key is drafting and PAYING those guys. Pat williams is CASE AND POINT. pat comes up with us, wnats to stay, TD lets him walk. Pat Williams owned a home here and a car shop. He didn't want to leave. he likes buffalo.

 

once you are here, you respect it. it's getting people here. the best ways - trade and draft. that is how Polian built us nad that is how Nix will do it. I actually didnt want cowher or shannahan. I did want Marty, but that won't happen. I'd be very happy with a Frazier/Al Saunders combo. I'd also be happy with the Montreal HC or Grimm. A hard nosed coach that demands respect is key. but drafting and talent wins you football games and that makes everything better...

[rpcolosi]

How do you win when your BEST QB the last decade was a 50 year old Drew Bledsoe? We missed on every QB attempt we had the last decade. We nearly missed on every first round pick we've had in that same stretch. Are all these guys 2nd string? No, but they're sure as hell aren't providing what is necessary from the draft slot they were chosen at.

 

Direction, ownership, coaching, they all seem to make sense when your winning, and they all seem to not when your losing.

If you wanted me to come up with a list of 10-6 or better teams with crap coaching it would be about one billion times larger then the list of 10-6 or better teams with crap rosters.

 

As crazy as this sounds the games are ultimately won on the field.

 

bingo. winning changes everything.

 

we are not the raiders. ralph is not changing coaches every year (like al davis). sure good players dont want to come here. smae is true of the sabres. why come ot a small, cold city on a lake over san diego or houston? we'd all be the same way if we weren't from here.

 

the key is drafting and PAYING those guys. Pat williams is CASE AND POINT. pat comes up with us, wnats to stay, TD lets him walk. Pat Williams owned a home here and a car shop. He didn't want to leave. he likes buffalo.

 

once you are here, you respect it. it's getting people here. the best ways - trade and draft. that is how Polian built us nad that is how Nix will do it. I actually didnt want cowher or shannahan. I did want Marty, but that won't happen. I'd be very happy with a Frazier/Al Saunders combo. I'd also be happy with the Montreal HC or Grimm. A hard nosed coach that demands respect is key. but drafting and talent wins you football games and that makes everything better...

[PNW_Bills_Fan]

I agree building the team with drafting well and building the lines first and foremost.

[Coach Tuesday]

Needed: franchise QB.

[papazoid]

Our talent has been the problem people, much more then Ralph, cash to cap, coaching, or any other logic being thrown around. Our talent the last 15 years has been abysmal. It’s been abysmal because our drafting has been abysmal. For the first time in that entire stretch Ralph actually has a scout responsible for player decisions. We actually have a guy whose best trademark isn’t selling tickets, but locating talented players.

 

If we draft well we will win. If we win the face of our organization will change.

IT'S ALL ABOUT TALENT !!....here are PRO BOWL players by TEAM.

 

1. St. Louis (1-15) - 1

2. Detroit (2-14) - 0

3. Tampa Bay (3-13) - 0

4. Washington (4-12) - 1

5. Kansas City (4-12) - 0

6. Seattle (5-11) - 0

7. Cleveland (5-11) - 2

8. Oakland (5-11) - 2

9. Buffalo (6-10) - 1

10/11. Chicago (7-9) - 1

10/11. Jacksonville (7-9) - 1

12. Miami (7-9) - 1

13. San Francisco (8-8) - 3

14. Denver (8-8) - 5

15. New York Giants (8-8) - 1

16/17. Carolina (8-8) - 2

16/17. Tennessee (8-8) - 1

18. Pittsburgh (9-7) - 2

19/20. Atlanta (9-7) - 4

19/20. Houston (9-7) - 4

21. Cincinnati (10-6) - 0

22. New England (10-6) - 5

23. Green Bay (11-5) - 4

24. Philadelphia (11-5) - 6

25. Baltimore (9-7) - 5

26. New York Jets (9-7) - 4

27. Arizona (10-6) - 4

28. Dallas (11-5) - 6

29. Minnesota (12-4) - 8

30. New Orleans (13-3) - 5

31. San Diego (13-3) - 5

32. Indianapolis (14-2) - 6

[shoveldog]

IT'S ALL ABOUT TALENT !!....here are PRO BOWL players by TEAM.

 

1. St. Louis (1-15) - 1

2. Detroit (2-14) - 0

3. Tampa Bay (3-13) - 0

4. Washington (4-12) - 1

5. Kansas City (4-12) - 0

6. Seattle (5-11) - 0

7. Cleveland (5-11) - 2

8. Oakland (5-11) - 2

9. Buffalo (6-10) - 1

10/11. Chicago (7-9) - 1

10/11. Jacksonville (7-9) - 1

12. Miami (7-9) - 1

13. San Francisco (8-8) - 3

14. Denver (8-8) - 5

15. New York Giants (8-8) - 1

16/17. Carolina (8-8) - 2

16/17. Tennessee (8-8) - 1

18. Pittsburgh (9-7) - 2

19/20. Atlanta (9-7) - 4

19/20. Houston (9-7) - 4

21. Cincinnati (10-6) - 0

22. New England (10-6) - 5

23. Green Bay (11-5) - 4

24. Philadelphia (11-5) - 6

25. Baltimore (9-7) - 5

26. New York Jets (9-7) - 4

27. Arizona (10-6) - 4

28. Dallas (11-5) - 6

29. Minnesota (12-4) - 8

30. New Orleans (13-3) - 5

31. San Diego (13-3) - 5

32. Indianapolis (14-2) - 6

 

 

So, which came first... the chicken or the egg?

[papazoid]

So, which came first... the chicken or the egg?

 

 

the guy with FINAL SAY over the draft !!

[Tolstoy]

I am going to have to disagree with you a little. We are drafting talented guys. Most of our players were very good college players. They were all top prospects coming out of college.

 

I believe our organization has had absolutely zero direction the past several years. It starts with Ralph, goes down to the front office and then finally the coaching staff. If you ask me, when you are that weak in those areas, the players don't have a chance to succeed.

 

 

Precisely. Bad franchises become sinkholes for promising young players (see Oakland, Buffalo, et al.). Conversely, good franchises enable even mediocre players to play at or above their natural talent level (see New England, Pittsburgh, et al.). Imagine that you were to come out of college and thrown into a job where everything is in disarray--no clear leadership, vision,and direction, and people are confused about their responsibilities, worried about their job security, doubted by everyone around, etc. Wouldn't that be a difficult environment for you to work in and develop yourself? Imagine now a well-ordered environment, where everyone works confidently in their own well-defined task, people believe they will succeed and are motivated to do so, and the leadership inspires everyone. It is no different in the NFL.

 

On a positive note, I think the Sabres are one of those NHL teams which enable young talent to develop--such as Myers, Kennedy, etc. In fact, look at their whole roster--most of it is homegrown. Good franchise.

[Ray]

How do you win when your BEST QB the last decade was a 50 year old Drew Bledsoe? We missed on every QB attempt we had the last decade. We nearly missed on every first round pick we've had in that same stretch. Are all these guys 2nd string? No, but they're sure as hell aren't providing what is necessary from the draft slot they were chosen at.

 

Direction, ownership, coaching, they all seem to make sense when your winning, and they all seem to not when your losing.

If you wanted me to come up with a list of 10-6 or better teams with crap coaching it would be about one billion times larger then the list of 10-6 or better teams with crap rosters.

 

As crazy as this sounds the games are ultimately won on the field.

 

KZOO you are correct 100% in regards to the QB thing. The reason we have not been successful more than anything else is the QB position. We traded a number one for Bledsoe, traded a number one for RJ, drafted a number one with JP and then drafted Trent. We failed with THREE number one picks for QBs.....that is a very bad record. I for one, was on board with the Bledsoe trade for full disclosure as I thought he did have something left in the tank.

Our skill position players are very good. If we had a good QB in the last decade we would have made the playoffs 4-5 times, it's that simple. If you think about it almost every year expect the 3-13 year, and the last year of Donahoe's reign we were in playoff contention the last 1-2 weeks of the season. If we had competent QB play that makes another 2-3 wins a year easy. We need a QB but I cannot see where we are going to get it for next year.

[RuntheDamnBall]

bingo. winning changes everything.

 

we are not the raiders. ralph is not changing coaches every year (like al davis). sure good players dont want to come here. smae is true of the sabres. why come ot a small, cold city on a lake over san diego or houston? we'd all be the same way if we weren't from here.

San diego, sure, but Houston? I'm sure living in a refinery inside a greenhouse is awesome, but Buffalo has a little more to offer than the sprawling cesspool by the gulf. And I say this with no respect at all for Houston (except regarding the Oilers).

[Bob in STL]

Our talent has been the problem people, much more then Ralph, cash to cap, coaching, or any other logic being thrown around. Our talent the last 15 years has been abysmal. It’s been abysmal because our drafting has been abysmal. For the first time in that entire stretch Ralph actually has a scout responsible for player decisions. We actually have a guy whose best trademark isn’t selling tickets, but locating talented players.

 

If we draft well we will win. If we win the face of our organization will change.

 

You are correct. It all starts with the draft. Our strong scouting system, and a GM and coach that are on the same page. Winning will cure all this neagtivity.