buffalo mike Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 Who do you blame first. This team has been circling the drain since Jim Kelly retired. In 1996!!!! Henry-probably gone. Moulds wants out. Bledsoe- well let's not even go there. Even Miami has been to the playoffs almost every year since Marino retired except this year. I have to admit after the Flutie- Johnson joke I thought our problems were somewhat behind us- little did I know they were just begining. Ralph busted a nut on Wade, now what? I'm sick, I'm sure everone here feels the same. Tired of waiting until the next season, and then some. Funny how some teams hit bottom and seem to pull back into contention within a few seasons. Man this blows...... Frustrated fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frez Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 Tom Donahoe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 Who do you blame first. This team has been circling the drain since Jim Kelly retired. In 1996!!!! Henry-probably gone. Moulds wants out. Bledsoe- well let's not even go there. Even Miami has been to the playoffs almost every year since Marino retired except this year. I have to admit after the Flutie- Johnson joke I thought our problems were somewhat behind us- little did I know they were just begining. Ralph busted a nut on Wade, now what? I'm sick, I'm sure everone here feels the same. Tired of waiting until the next season, and then some. Funny how some teams hit bottom and seem to pull back into contention within a few seasons.Man this blows...... Frustrated fan. 124097[/snapback] FINALLY someone addresses this on this Board! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalo mike Posted November 19, 2004 Author Share Posted November 19, 2004 Tom Donahoe 124099[/snapback] I have to agree. Funny how great the Steelers are without their GM, Offensive Coordinator, and whatever Clements was. And how much better we are with them and Kris Ferris....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 I have to agree. Funny how great the Steelers are without their GM, tand Offensive Coordinator, and whatever Clements was. And how much better we are with them and Kris Ferris....... 124110[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoho Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 We need instant gratification. The problem with the Bils success in the late 80's, early 90's is that it created front running fans. If you were a Bills fans before that it was because the Bills were a religion to you. Like family, thick or thin. We then got the fans that were only satisfied if we were Super Bowl contenders year in and year out. The fact that no such thing exisited was beside the point. If in 3 years we are not contending, fire the bunch, lynch ralph wilson and start all over again. Been there, done that. Over and over and over again since 1960. I love my Bills, always will, especially while Ralph owns them. We are all frustrated but I am tired of all you front runners ready to throw the Bills overboard unless they start winning BIG again. We are not that far away from success. But it may take another year or two. In the meantime, if this is too frustrating for you go root for the Patties in the meantime and come back home when we are back in the hunt. Just dont expect me to respect you for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICE Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 We need instant gratification. The problem with the Bils success in the late 80's, early 90's is that it created front running fans. If you were a Bills fans before that it was because the Bills were a religion to you. Like family, thick or thin. We then got the fans that were only satisfied if we were Super Bowl contenders year in and year out. The fact that no such thing exisited was beside the point. If in 3 years we are not contending, fire the bunch, lynch ralph wilson and start all over again. Been there, done that. Over and over and over again since 1960. I love my Bills, always will, especially while Ralph owns them. We are all frustrated but I am tired of all you front runners ready to throw the Bills overboard unless they start winning BIG again. We are not that far away from success. But it may take another year or two. In the meantime, if this is too frustrating for you go root for the Patties in the meantime and come back home when we are back in the hunt. Just dont expect me to respect you for it. 124121[/snapback] Actually it is the opposite. for over 4 years now we have been 'rebuilding'. By now playoffs are in order. No one should get 7 years as you suggest to turn around a franchise in this day and age. And BTW...I really don't think anyone gives a stevestojan one way or the other if you respect them or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoho Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 Actually it is the opposite. for over 4 years now we have been 'rebuilding'. By now playoffs are in order. No one should get 7 years as you suggest to turn around a franchise in this day and age. And BTW...I really don't think anyone gives a stevestojan one way or the other if you respect them or not. 124131[/snapback] Ice, when did you become a Bills fan? Just a wild guess, that it may have been during their front runner days? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICE Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 Ice, when did you become a Bills fan? Just a wild guess, that it may have been during their front runner days? 124137[/snapback] No. I started in 86'. So please tell me how you are such the bigger fan because of rooting for x amount of years. or how you suffered through this 2- whatever season. Who cares? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalo mike Posted November 19, 2004 Author Share Posted November 19, 2004 We need instant gratification. The problem with the Bils success in the late 80's, early 90's is that it created front running fans. If you were a Bills fans before that it was because the Bills were a religion to you. Like family, thick or thin. We then got the fans that were only satisfied if we were Super Bowl contenders year in and year out. The fact that no such thing exisited was beside the point. If in 3 years we are not contending, fire the bunch, lynch ralph wilson and start all over again. Been there, done that. Over and over and over again since 1960. I love my Bills, always will, especially while Ralph owns them. We are all frustrated but I am tired of all you front runners ready to throw the Bills overboard unless they start winning BIG again. We are not that far away from success. But it may take another year or two. In the meantime, if this is too frustrating for you go root for the Patties in the meantime and come back home when we are back in the hunt. Just dont expect me to respect you for it. 124121[/snapback] Excuse Me!!! I have been a fan since the 70's, and have followed the Bills through many a losing season. And obviously if I am still here, I am still a true fan. But if you think we are not far away you better take your rose colored glasses and flush them! Throw them overboard if they don't win any big games! Better do something,this is no joke. My pride as a Bill's fan is causing me to explode- unlike you- let's just sit back and wait and watch teams like the Eagles, Patriots, Steelers go from worst to first while we just keep going though head coaches and first round draft picks-Give me a break. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoho Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 No. I started in 86'. So please tell me how you are such the bigger fan because of rooting for x amount of years. or how you suffered through this 2- whatever season. Who cares? 124140[/snapback] I would be happy to explain. I grew up with the Bills. My dad was an usher with the Bills in the All-America Football Conference and when they merged with the NFL in the early 50's and did not take the Bills he never forgave the NFL. When I was 8 years old, the AFL started and my Dad and I watched every game instead of the Evil Cleveland Browns on CBS. I lived through Jack Kemp and two AFL championships, Preston Ridelhuber and Dan Darragh and some horrible teams, the excitement of OJ, the awful decline iin the 70's, the Chuck Knox revival, the Hank Bullogh disaster (these were teams that before opening day would pick up players off the waiver wire and then START them on opening day). I finally got to enjoy the Marv Levy era, went to 2 super bowls and had the satisfaction of the Bill being among the elite. Now, in the salary cap era, I see a team that has an awful lot of talent but seems to be a couple of players away from success. I am not ready to throw it all in, boycott games and start rebuilding from scratch because some front running fans are frustrated by the lack of success. I am not claiming to be a bigger fan than you but am trying to explain why some Bills fans are more patient and less ready to ride people out of town after a couple of frustrating seasons. Unless I see that there is no committment to excellence from the Bills organization, I will remain a loyal fan. OK, I will admit, even when there was no committment I remained loyal. As I said, it is religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICE Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 I would be happy to explain. I grew up with the Bills. My dad was an usher with the Bills in the All-America Football Conference and when they merged with the NFL in the early 50's and did not take the Bills he never forgave the NFL. When I was 8 years old, the AFL started and my Dad and I watched every game instead of the Evil Cleveland Browns on CBS. I don't care. Who does? I lived through Jack Kemp and two AFL championships, Preston Ridelhuber and Dan Darragh and some horrible teams, the excitement of OJ, the awful decline iin the 70's, the Chuck Knox revival, the Hank Bullogh disaster (these were teams that before opening day would pick up players off the waiver wire and then START them on opening day). I finally got to enjoy the Marv Levy era, went to 2 super bowls and had the satisfaction of the Bill being among the elite. I don't care. Now, in the salary cap era, I see a team that has an awful lot of talent but seems to be a couple of players away from success. I am not ready to throw it all in, boycott games and start rebuilding from scratch because some front running fans are frustrated by the lack of success. So? Sit there and keep eating the stevestojan TD and RW are feeding you. 3 years from now we are still going to be in the same place if drastic changes are not made.I am not claiming to be a bigger fan than you but am trying to explain why some Bills fans are more patient and less ready to ride people out of town after a couple of frustrating seasons. Unless I see that there is no committment to excellence from the Bills organization, I will remain a loyal fan. OK, I will admit, even when there was no committment I remained loyal. As I said, it is religion. 124152[/snapback] The Bills are are religion? You sir need help. I'm not kidding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalo mike Posted November 19, 2004 Author Share Posted November 19, 2004 I would be happy to explain. I grew up with the Bills. My dad was an usher with the Bills in the All-America Football Conference and when they merged with the NFL in the early 50's and did not take the Bills he never forgave the NFL. When I was 8 years old, the AFL started and my Dad and I watched every game instead of the Evil Cleveland Browns on CBS. I lived through Jack Kemp and two AFL championships, Preston Ridelhuber and Dan Darragh and some horrible teams, the excitement of OJ, the awful decline iin the 70's, the Chuck Knox revival, the Hank Bullogh disaster (these were teams that before opening day would pick up players off the waiver wire and then START them on opening day). I finally got to enjoy the Marv Levy era, went to 2 super bowls and had the satisfaction of the Bill being among the elite. Now, in the salary cap era, I see a team that has an awful lot of talent but seems to be a couple of players away from success. I am not ready to throw it all in, boycott games and start rebuilding from scratch because some front running fans are frustrated by the lack of success. I am not claiming to be a bigger fan than you but am trying to explain why some Bills fans are more patient and less ready to ride people out of town after a couple of frustrating seasons. Unless I see that there is no committment to excellence from the Bills organization, I will remain a loyal fan. OK, I will admit, even when there was no committment I remained loyal. As I said, it is religion. 124152[/snapback] If this is a religion somebody better call an exorsist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICE Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 If this is a religion somebody better call an exorsist. 124161[/snapback] ROTFLMAO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoho Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 The Bills are are religion? You sir need help. I'm not kidding. 124157[/snapback] I'm sorry. I didn't realize you don't care. My fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 I'm sorry. I didn't realize you don't care. My fault. 124170[/snapback] I care Yoho. I've been a Bills follower since 1960 too. There are attitudes on this board that grow weary. I understand totally where you're coming from my compatriot. My suggestion is to do what I have done. Drop out and go anonymous. I'm slowly starting to enjoy Bills losses simply for the absurdity that they bring to this board, and the comic relief I get from the multitude of silly posts that follow each loss. Malicious, I know, but then "who cares." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frayed Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 What pains me is not the W-L record, it's the way they play. Pure torture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoho Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 I care Yoho. I've been a Bills follower since 1960 too. There are attitudes on this board that grow weary. I understand totally where you're coming from my compatriot. My suggestion is to do what I have done. Drop out and go anonymous. I'm slowly starting to enjoy Bills losses simply for the absurdity that they bring to this board, and the comic relief I get from the multitude of silly posts that follow each loss. Malicious, I know, but then "who cares." 124199[/snapback] In some ways I enjoy the old days when the only Bills fans on Earth were those that grew up with them. Not some front-runners that liked them when they had Jim Kelly and were winning. Does the term "Cowboys" ring a bell? Thanks for the thoughts. I need to adopt your attitude but I have been hanging around this board for a long time and get disappointed when folks are ready to run them out of town. Everything else has left Buffalo. Please not the Bills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jahnyc Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 I really don't think it is fair to question whether someone is a fan just because they have lost patience with this team. The last number of years have been extremely frustrating. Poor qb play, losing records, poor head coaches, a boring offense and suspect drafts. Of course we should be upset! Many of just want to see things fixed, or at least see some improvement so that we can be optimistic about the future. After what we have been experiencing, I think we deserve at least that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 I would be happy to explain. I grew up with the Bills. My dad was an usher with the Bills in the All-America Football Conference and when they merged with the NFL in the early 50's and did not take the Bills he never forgave the NFL. When I was 8 years old, the AFL started and my Dad and I watched every game instead of the Evil Cleveland Browns on CBS. I lived through Jack Kemp and two AFL championships, Preston Ridelhuber and Dan Darragh and some horrible teams, the excitement of OJ, the awful decline iin the 70's, the Chuck Knox revival, the Hank Bullogh disaster (these were teams that before opening day would pick up players off the waiver wire and then START them on opening day). I finally got to enjoy the Marv Levy era, went to 2 super bowls and had the satisfaction of the Bill being among the elite. Now, in the salary cap era, I see a team that has an awful lot of talent but seems to be a couple of players away from success. I am not ready to throw it all in, boycott games and start rebuilding from scratch because some front running fans are frustrated by the lack of success. I am not claiming to be a bigger fan than you but am trying to explain why some Bills fans are more patient and less ready to ride people out of town after a couple of frustrating seasons. Unless I see that there is no committment to excellence from the Bills organization, I will remain a loyal fan. OK, I will admit, even when there was no committment I remained loyal. As I said, it is religion. 124152[/snapback] The thing is...like you mentioned, this is the Salary Cap Era. The Cap disallows Dynasties (for the most part...apologies to NE should they win another this year), but also allows Teams who make some good solid Football moves to improve dramatically in a year or two... When TD came in, and the Bills went 3-13, I would imagine that most Fans felt just like I did...Frustrated, but understanding The Bills needed to be torn down before they could be re-built...Then when the Trade for DB happened, and the Bills opened the 2002 Season 5-3, everything seemed to be going to Plan...So we thought... Since that decent start to the 2002 Season the Bills are 12-21, a .364 winning %. They still have a below average O-Line, just like the one they had in Pre-TD 2000, they gave up a 1st Round Pick for a Franchise QB who is broken beyond repair, and the history on that QB says he was broken before we gave up that 1st Rounder. To TD's credit, he has helped build one of the better Defenses in the NFL, and he at least has addressed the QB of the future. Though the argument can be made that had he made the right decision concerning DB initially, The Bills could have had their new Franchise QB in house a couple years back... I simply cannot blame any Bills Fan for being beyond frustrated with TD and our beloved Bills...Everyone has their individual reasons. Mine is the fact that TD was so damn stubborn about Bledsoe that he could not bring himself to do what was obviously best for the Franchise. The Cap money that would have been saved could have been better spent on the Roster overall (maybe a freaking Free Safety that can play, and another O-Lineman), and The Bills still could have afforded a Vet UFA QB like Volek, Garcia, or Warner to pave the way for JP...TD flat out blew this decision, and the Season because of it in my opinion. And it's awfully tough to let him off the hook for it when I was screaming for TD to waive DB from my Computer Desk in Charlotte NC this past off season, and God knows I am not an NFL GM...But I was not alone in this belief, plenty of folks right here on TSW and a few NFL "experts" (ie. Boomer Esiason during last Season) were advising TD to get out of the Bledsoe deal Cap penalty free...TD should have known better...period... I'll never give up on the Bills, it would be a serious waste of over 35 years of my life. But I'm not about to look the other way when we are the laughing stock of the NFL because our GM cannot turn a Team around in 4 years time. And it's looking like year 5 will be used to groom a young QB on top of it all...Plenty of other Teams have been able to turn things around in a year or two. TD has had 3.5 years now and we have nothing except one of the best Fan bases in the NFL... The Bills Fans have more than held up their end, TD and The Bills Organization have not...We as Bills Fans have had to sit and watch a longtime Divisional Rival become a dominant Franchise AT OUR EXPENSE...That's awfully tough to take... I'm not advocating TD's departure, but I don't blame those who do. And if he did get canned, he deserves it because, in the Salary Cap era of the NFL, it's a bottom line business...And the bottom line is The Bills are not good enough, and TD has had plenty of time to change that fact... B) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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