YellowLinesandArmadillos

Great article Mickey: Here are my thoughts, it is interesting how he frames the neo-con movement out Wilsonian demcracy, never quite understood it that way. I guess that I am confused about the neo-con retreat from militarization and the moral compass issue. If what I understood him to say is that democratic expansion for neo-cons is a moral outgrowth of their view of the World. Then the lesson from Iraq "failure" is that militarism should be applied opportunistically, he opens himself up to the attack that neo-cons have become moral relativists. While it is easy to be a Monday morning quarterback, and he appears to be one, I don't think his analysis of the role of the Muslim faith as a reason for Bush doctrine underestimating the difficulty of handling Iraq, but rather Bush underestimated the timetable by which American citizens will tolerate military intervention. I agree with his conclusion that in the long run modernity will lead to forms of democracy... just not necessarily friendly to the U.S. and that is the failure of Bush doctrine. Principles of capitalism and democracy will create competition and thus potential conflict with other Democracies and that is a tough pill to swallow. Don't think any of us quite have a handle on that one yet. Great article!

Whatever, he was an idiot out of the gate, the Press was hard on him, then 9/11 happened and they backed off like the cowering sheep they are and he got a relative pass for 2 years, heck as hard as we tried, we couldn't even pin any of the Enron crap on him, kinda like Whitewater, only there was no fake investigative group to waste tax payer dollars. More recently, Iraq has beeen falling apart and though the country's economy is growing, the middle class is feeling squeezed...a "general malaise" has set upon the country and the press like any good hound is no longer buying the threats to stay away and has finally gotten hungry enough to plow through to get to the red meat. But a pass Bush did get, and for a variety of reasons including Democratic ineptitude, even their sincere desire to have a strong leader after 9/11 that brought us in a sensible direction. Clinton never got that kind of honey moon from the right. Although it can be said until 9/11 Bush did not get one at all. Come on, a little honesty from the right here, or is that too much to ask. Rhetorically, I just answered my own question.

Nothing yet that I am familar with, but they just added a number of, need to confirm, Alito type judges and it is more a wait and see approach. One at least ran Jesse Helms race baiting and gay bashing campaign, Claude Allen. Still can't get that image out of my head of Sen. Helms discussing Gays in the military saying are you a Homo...pause...sexyou'all.

It is between the 4th in VA and the 11th in Alabama. The 11th with the 10 Commandments decision still bothers me. Keep organized religion out of State Sponsored events or we will all become drones like the Iranians.

Not going to deny some of the 9th circuit decisions are out there, but Gore would never have gotten them through with a GOP Congress, unlike Alito with a rubber stamp one who is just as scary on the right fringe.

Yep, called critical thinking. Folks need to be taught the skills to work through problems but memorization after that is just state sponsored and more frequently today Corporate sponsored propaganda.

Dude it is the SoCal air, can't surf because it just rained here, too much pollution from corporate right wing bloodsucking horizontal clams?...golf courses and SUVs, so they are a lighting up and it provides the whole region with a contact buzz.

There is a bad Monty Python skit going on here somewhere...that one about an arguement, but one of you guys already asked the other out, so why?...never mind. I liked Ghost's link better.

With the exception of Clarence Thomas when he is thinking with his lower half, I would agree with you, especially the CNN/Fox standard, if it makes that level time to bail on the issue. Day to day, their decisions on Commerce and taxation have probably a larger, although largely ignored, effect on my day to day life...i.e. States vs. Individual or Federal rights than anything else. P.S. I am routing for Stevens... Responding to previous posts: Legislating from the Bench by liberals, what do you think the outcome based judicial philosophy of Scalito is? Just has a right wing bent, so you guys are happy. All judging at that level carries bias and can be accused of legislating from the bench...please spare me the soap box.

Sorry it was probably Basra, my wife took the call. Got my bs messed up, should've checked the geography to make sure I had it right. It was a couple of month ago. P.S. He is a Korean, and Chinese interpreter, just got out of DMZ to get some more training in Chinese and afterward they sent him to Iraq.

Ralph is a waste of time Presidentially speaking, won't even get honest with the fact that he is a trust fund baby on an ego mission. Too bad, he has a lot of young, very talented kids making him look pretty good most of the time until he opens his mouth.

OH, OH..with a million Chinese or Latinos doing the work for you?

Agree with your point Ken, took me a while to firgure it out though because the personal insults by some, and the discussion threads often invite flip, sarcastic answers. Hard to know if it is Chicken or Egg thing sometimes, but having been a partisan, I don't take flip critiques lightly and respond usually very harshly and just as inanely. That being said your guidance on this matter has been invaluable and made my enjoyment of the board increase. Though occasionally it would feel good to get the old bat out and start swinging. P.S. You should state this more often, and maybe issue some statements like children, I don't care who started it, you all go to your rooms till you can be nice. Carping chatter takes away from legitimate hyperboli.

Man you guys are sick, so are you right wingers actually going support the morning after pill at Walmart just this once?

Really that is too bad. Suburban DC got you down? That is why we moved from there to quasi-rural. Good public schools for my kid..s, taxes are a third less than a comparable private school, low crime, only 3 police officers needed in our town and good home value. Nearest town, Amherst has more crime, but mostly is drunk and disorderly related stuff due to college students. I have to drive slowly on evening weekends to avoid swerving pedestrians. Still and hour from Boston and 2.5 from downtown Manhattan to see a show. Can't beat it, except the long winters. But I will take snow over the 30 degrees and rain crap you get and heck, I am avoiding this winter out in SoCAL. Carlsbad, CA isn't so bad, first day of rain today in a month and it is weird, but everyone here gets out and watches it like "Dude" the first snow of the year. Seriously enjoy the local community discussions at the town eateries and coffee shops, something refreshingly simple about local gossip.

My understanding of the political situation over there is the same as yours, but what I understand is still a huge undiscussed problem and is due to outside influences along the borders with Syria and Iran...no surprise there, and is not being discussed by the media...darn lemmings. ---Not you, the press! Just for clarification.

The lesser degree than appears of violence part of your statement is hard to fathom. Where are you getting your info. My cousin, an intelligence officer over there now, before he actually crossed into Iraq was stationed in Bahrain and could hear the explosions regularly from there and now is in the green zone and it is a regular occurence. Other soldiers that I have talked to express the same experiences about the violence. Granted my info is recent statistics that have upticked as a result of the sectarian violence and the annectdotal info that I have heard from soldiers. What they say that is being underreported is the violence from all the fighting going on between U.S. raids and groups fighting them. But I do agree with your conclusion about a line of tolerance. Just think that it is going to take a lot more work or serious change in tactics to achieve that goal. I don't think we should underestimate the difficulty in achieving that worthy goal.

Yeh, so has every admin since Kennedy. That is as far back as I go. Still, I think the State Department's role of diplomacy is crucial, it just shouldn't drive any foreign policy decisions and maybe it should be reduced to sub-cabinet status, i.e., back to the old diplomatic corps framework, maybe put it under hah!...Homeland Security! Seriously, not sure which Dept. to make it a sub of, maybe Commerce...

Oh the partisan shot... As a Clinton opologist... his foreign policies were both, reactive and proactive, proactively he worked on the Israel/Palestinian conflict, he reacted and then became proactive in the former Yugoslavia. But aside from my irritation at your quick Clinton bash, I agree that no policy of ours can be limited to one or the other, also one could argue that Bush has been too proactive. I don't necessarily agree with that assessment either, it is more a question of chosing those things to be active on and setting up workable plans.

Hey, I read they are going to a "thorough review of the Ports deal" Frist has agreed, Guess it is going through? Didn't figure Hastert would be hard to be bought off, and he has kept a low profile, but Frist, now that he is done, so is a serious congressional review. See: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...6022600737.html Any thoughts?

I was thinking the same thing and chuckling, one of those posts devolved into the name calling and it got pretty pathetic, got a lot more posts, but no info, sounded more like my brothers and I in the back of the Volvo on a trip to Toronto. It finally divolved into hit each other on the knee and don't say a word...brutal game, but Mom couldn't yell at us.

Agreed, it would be a much easier policy for a future admin to adopt if it were changed now and has albeit short history of making progress and less likely the next one would choose or see as viable the cut and run approach.

Yeh I know and that is what is frustrating, in many respects the stay the course action seems to be letting events control our policy, not our policy controlling events unlike during the initial invasion. My hyperbol...invasion which I thought was stupid... but we are passed it, you are right. So, how best to minimize any more damage in the process? Notice I did not say get out. Think that would also be irresponsible. We just need to have less fingerprints on the process. How best to accomplish that will only occur when a decision on a new direction is determined. Like Johnson before, we may have to wait another 3 years...Democrat or Republican.

While the later is probably correct, the Shias also don't see themselves as Persian and Al'Sadr will eventually demand independence from Iraq for that reason and for a typical power desire. I like the 3 state confederation idea that you suggested while bringing in Syria and Iran to overtly part of the process. As you stated they already are covertly part along with who knows who else... Still would need heavy monitoring and probably an Arab moderator government on the ground. Not sure who, possibly Jordan or Egypt if they were willing, but not sure. I don't think sticking it out is the answer anymore and other options need to be considered and tried before it gets worse.

Neat, didn't know the magazine was still in publication, still have some old copies from my high school days.