Bob in Mich

The NFL's stance is really senseless, if their goal is protecting the league image. Today, the league pee tests players and publicly punishes failures for marijuana. When the league publicizes the failure, they 'tarnish' their own image. Instead, I think the league should punish players that get into legal trouble with cannabis. Those players are impacting the image. Otherwise, the NFL should basically ignore its use as it is not considered a performance enhancer.

I would say we need to get back to valuing honesty in our politicians. Today, we back our politicians' comments not based on validity or truth, but based on D's or R's. If we think of them as on our team, we excuse even the most blatant lies if it gets a political win. This has led to our deep national divide and needs to change if that divide is to close. The tricky part is that it will take condemnation of our own D or R to bring about this change. Schiff will not change to please R's nor will Trump change to please the D's. Having separate truths is at the root of many of our nation's troubles. Stop allowing false realities. Push for the truth yourself. Be honest yourself. Avoid untruths in political discussions just to win points. Get back to condemning dishonesty when apparent in your own politicians and if they persist, replace them.

THE truth, you know, the one that used to matter. Try to think back a few years. Ask yourself, if the shoe was on the other foot, would 17 witnesses speaking under oath against Obama been enough to prove anything to you. And please stop with Zelensky said he felt no pressure. We both know he had no choice So which of the 7 or 8 defensible positions are you taking? And, is THE truth more important to you or would it be better for the Repubs to find a good defensible position regardless of the truth?

There may be discussion on the Dem side on what to charge and what to call Trump's actions but there is pretty good agreement on what happened. Trump tried to use the leverage of the pre-appropriated aid to get himself personal favors. Not just any favors though, favors that would improve his chances in the next election, aka election aid from a foreign government. Trump himself has clung to a position that everything was perfect, that is true. His supporters however, knowing his penchant for lying, have settled into many different positions. On the Trump defender side, there are about 8 different positions. 7 of those 8 are not really true. But hey, the economy is good and the Saudis will probably help to elect the same guy you wanted anyway

Well, you quoted me first in this interaction and responded to my questions but I guess you are welcome for leaving you off ignore up until now. Unlike some posters here, after a post or two gets ignored I deduce that that particular person doesn't wish to converse with me but if they reply I deduce that they do wish to converse. I can put you on ignore if you like. I seriously doubt that you could change positions with respect to Trump. As mentioned, Trump supporters immediately vilify and discount any one that criticizes Trump. They then can justify ignoring that negative information as fake news. I am not sure most even realize that they are doing that. How can your view turn negative if you are immediately rejecting negative information? Don't spend all night on that one. It can't.

Look, the Sabres played Calgary last night. While there may be different takes on various facets of the game, no one is giving a score other than 4-3. There is an actual truth. 4-3 Calgary win. Do you know the actual truth with Trump's Ukraine interaction? All people, even the most independent thinking people should agree on the truth. My point is that Trump's defenders don't even know the truth, nor do they seem to care. If you are concerned with the truth and not just a defensible position, not knowing the truth while continuing to defend him should grate on your conscience imo.

Yeah, hilarious. You are one of the funniest posters here. Mission accomplished? Now answer my questions please. Does it bother you that the truth does not come into play when defending Trump? If the truth was being told by his defenders they would all have the same story....actually what happened. Instead we see a take-your-pick defense position. And again, if you had to choose, would you choose defending Trump or determining the truth? As always: Ignoring serial insulters DR and DCTom

Plausible defense positions have been staked out. Does it bother you in any way that there is not a unified story to defend Trump? I mean, either he didn't do it or he did it .... or he did it but it was fine or he did it and it was wrong but not impeachable or the economy is good so just drop it. Where are you on the spectrum? Are you concerned at all about future presidential powers or future elections if these actions are true and deemed just fine? Shouldn't the truth be of some concern rather than just throwing up enough crap to confuse the issue? I often view your goal as defending rather than trying to determine the truth. If you had to choose, which is more important to you personally, getting Trump off or determining the truth

Maybe I was making a point that posters could think on rather than answering directly. Why do you lie when defending Trump? Like the other day in some thread, you said something like, The Ukraine got their money before 9/30, so what's the problem? You know the problem with the timing of the whistle blower and the release of the funds but pretended that issue didn't exist. Why? Thanks. That was entertaining

I understand why Trump lies defending himself. He is guilty and needs to deny his actions in order to avoid impeachment. I understand why the Republican Senators and Congressmen lie defending Trump. The Trump supporters will work to defeat them in their next election if they oppose him. I understand why the right leaning media lies to defend Trump. They are trying to mold public opinion to maintain Trump voter support as well as to bump their ratings. I don't understand the reasoning behind why folks in message board discussions lie to defend Trump. Why do you folks repeat lies in these discussions just to deflect or to avoid admitting obvious points? Now, if you honestly don't know you are repeating lies that is one matter and of course is understandable. I am asking those in these conversations that just lie and throw out chaff to avoid answering 'incriminating' questions, what are you gaining in exchange for compromising your personal integrity?

In PPP find the thread titled, 'Know anyone with a Disease?' It began in 2014. It has probably been dormant for a month or two. This may get you there https://www.twobillsdrive.com/community/topic/169052-know-anyone-with-a-disease-read-this/

You are indeed trying to ridicule me but you are ridiculing my cannabis use too. The question was why? Why does this collection of fools still seem to think my promotion of medical cannabis so foolish when over the years I have been proven right and they have largely been proven wrong? Go back through that thread and behold the persistent ignorance and the grinning pride in such ignorance. Reminds me of battling similar ignorance and group think here today.

I am a medical cannabis patient. I have legitimate medical need (spine), as verified by at least 10 doctors now as well as diagnostics such as x-rays, mri's, and emg's. If you don't believe in pain medicine, then I would say fine, please don't ever use it. If you believe in using pain medicine, then trying to hold the moral high ground on a medical cannabis pain patient is misguided, at best. So, what are your thoughts? All pain medicine users are to be ridiculed? They are just weak? Or, just patients that have transitioned from opiate dependence to cannabis? Where is that moral high ground to you pal?

Still awaiting your answer, Rob. You are unable to answer the only question I have asked you but I got my butt kicked? lol Sorry Rob, you are making less and less sense in not just admitting the similarities that I pointed out are indeed valid. It won't hurt you to admit there are similarities. Rational discussions often include conceding points. Have you ever seen that done?

Do you think it is improper to start a thread entitled, 'Can Anyone Help DR'? Not to dump it all here, but imo the guy is either: - being paid to post and control the narrative here; or - has become so invested that he has lost objectivity and reason; or - drug crazed; or - mentally damaged, perhaps from witnessing something traumatic, like Lisa Page's texts or altered 302's; or - actually mentally unstable and way beyond obsessive. Is there a clinical disorder where the patient has developed such a fear of losing his 'followers' that he snaps? DR seems to think that his congregation is not able to hear my words without his explanations. I have become the devil to the ears/eyes of his followers around here apparently. They need protecting for they are so impressionable. Even his disciples must wonder a bit when the thought leader seems to have snapped. Can anyone help DR? Seriously?

You fools have spent two pages whimpering about why you can't or won't answer where my comparisons are invalid. If invalid, it would take one post to address each point and explain why it is untrue. Pretty ***** telling, eh?

I think perhaps Rob's health concerns should be for you. You are surely repeating yourself a lot these days. How many times have you used this 'joke' now?

Scrolling back would tell you that. Rob made the well worn point that comparisons of Trump to Hitler are ridiculous. While I agreed on one level, I was trying to point out Trump is using many of the tactics Hitler used in his rise to authoritarian rule. Still awaiting that answer though........anyone? Well, lol, let me correct that. Anyone not named Tom or DR

Maybe you'll answer. So far Rob has been stumped. Please show my invalid Trump-Hitler comparisons, aside from the propaganda machine point. For each that you point out, did Hitler not do it or is Trump not now doing it?

You seem to have time to engage. Why won't you post a reply as to where the Trump-Hitler comparisons are invalid? So far you have questioned only one of them. Even if I allow that I was wrong on that one (which I don't), why are the other 6 invalid?

Rob, are you reverting to just insults now? What happened to the common ground you were looking for? lol Please show my invalid Trump-Hitler comparisons, aside from the propaganda machine point. For each that you point out, did Hitler not do it or is Trump not now doing it? Thx Ignoring serial insulters DR and DCTom as always so please don't think they responded for you.

Please, tell me where my comparison is false? Instead of just dismissing the post overall, tell me specifically which comparisons of Hitler-Trump are invalid? Unless, as I suspect, you don't have much in that regard. As to your other point, I don't wonder at all why this group makes fun of me. Ignorance abounds around here. When folks can pick apart an argument they jump at that opportunity and will post a rebuttal. When they can't, they make fun of or insult the poster.

Where do you get your news? Do you believe any news not coming from Trump, FoxNews, Rush, or Levin? If so, what are your individual other reliable sources? To me and to anyone with working eyes, FoxNews is way too chummy with the administration, especially if you think the press should be a watchdog over the admin. Rather than digging into any Trump possible misdeeds, they immediately attack the 'witness' and explain and enable for the president. And so what is the problem with the other Hitler-Trump comparisons? For each of the similarities I listed, are you disputing Hitler used the tactic or that Trump is using the tactic? Because in spite of hand waving dismissal, no one has disputed any of the similarities except you with this propaganda machine issue and I think you are way off there.

Maybe you could clarify your point. Are you actually taking issue with my contention that Hitler was arguably the planet's biggest monster? If so, my point eluded you. What do Stalin or Mao's regimes have to do with Hitler and Donnie's comparison? Fox News is Trump's propaganda machine today.

Morning Rob. I understand those making fun of comparisons to Hitler. He was arguably the biggest monster to ever live. Donnie is a saint by comparison. Most that make fun of the comparison I believe get the point of the comparison but intentionally ignore it. Where the comparison makes sense is in Hitler's rise to power. Looking back, I am fascinated that he was seemingly able to hypnotize so many Germans and to convince them to willingly give up democracy in favor of a Hitler Dictatorship. History was never my best subject but it appears that the comparison holds up reasonably well when looking at 1930's Hitler. - He has declared a group to focus blame -He has declared the press to be the enemy -He lies blatantly to the people -He has clouded truth overall in this country -He has stated political opponents should be jailed -He has undermined confidence in other government organizations -He has built/commandeered a huge propaganda machine -etc