gus2378

I am actually kind of speechless watching that ... and I didn't think it was possible for me to like the guy less than I already did.

Crayonz is obviously insane ... he is forgetting the fact that Poz could have told them that Maybin was a child-molesting axe murderer and if Ralph wanted him, that's who the Bills were taking. Seriously, the whole premise is off because rookie holdouts are hardly the only measure of football character. Jim Kelly essentially held out for 3 years from the Bills before arriving. Henry Jones had an extended holdout to start his career. Did they not leave it all on the field when they played? I am sure we could come up with 100 more examples from around the league. It's not fair to judge Maybin yet, let alone judge Poz, who didn't even really play with the kid because Maybin was redshirted Poz's last year at Penn State.

Are you kiddinig me? I editied it, but perhaps next time you woudl prefer that I record it and provide an mp3 link so you don't have to use your brain at all?

I want Maybin in camp too but the Bills are as much to blame as he is... it is a two-way street ... Yes, no doubt the players get pressure form the union to get every last cent ... the vets talk about how unfair it is but deep down every veteran in a contract year LOVES when the rookies get big money because it drives their price up in free agency. They stick together ... and why? because the owners are the same way. The Bills are in WIN NOW mode. They spent how much money on T.O ... their pass rush SUCKS ... when you think about it, the BILLS should be going to Maybin and saying "Here is what you should get based on the guy below you and your slot last year ... were are offering XX% more because we believe in you and we need you and we want to win. If you do not take it, we are going to the media and telling them you are turning down an above-market value offer." What's another two or three million spread over 5 years? It's not much given their need to win NOW. But what are they doing? They are waiting because they do not want to screw the TEAMS with unsigned guys in front of them. They are not even pushing because they do not want to set the market. It is true, Maybin could just say screw it, I want to be in camp, do it at last year's No. 11 slot ... but come on ... you can say he hasn't done anything to be owed a big contract, but the Bills have done nothing to deserve what amounts to a hometown discount either. When it comes out the Bills have made a REAL effort to get him in, i will rip the kid. So far, it seems they are OK with it the way it is.

I know rookies need any work they can get, but there are still 4 full weeks before the season. Given the country club that Bills camp appears to be most of the time, he hasn't really missed much but a bunch of walkthroughs and meetings. important, yes, but not career-threatening. If he signs this week and ends up sucking, he will be a bust on his own merit, not because he missed a couple weeks.

Forgive me for not reading the entire thread, but my eyes are bleeding from trying to decipher this ... I am a little surprised it didn't lock up the entire Internet.

With all due respect to Derrick Thomas, he was a one-trick pony. He was one of the 10 best pass-rushers ever and second only to LT at it from the LB position. Biscuit was not in the top 10 ever at anything, but overall he was the better LB in my opinion. If he was allowed to rush the passer on every play like Thomas was, he would have had a lot more sacks. And as I said in another thread comparing Talley and Bennett, never in a million years could Thomas have moved inside to help the team fill a hole because of injury and made the Pro Bowl like Bennett did. All that said, if Bruce Smith never existed, those Bills would have needed someone like Derrick Thomas. But the guy was basically a DE listed as a LB ... it's not fair to him or Bennett to compare them really.

I wasn't criticizing, necessarily, just saying the Titans DO hit and in the very first game it shows. I would have liked to see the starters one more series as a result, though.

Come on, the starting offense looked bad on ONE PLAY and never got the chance to go back out. If you really expected them to be PERFECT against a very good team after not hitting all camp, you are the idiot. I'm not saying they are a playoff team but give them a chance. You must have been a basket case in the glory days when they Super Bowl teams won 2 preseason games in four years. Probably ran Kelly and the boys out of town more than once in August.

I am not panicking and actually like some of what I have seen ... but it definitely shows that Tennessee HITS in camp while the Bills do not. They were far more ready to play a real game and it shows. That said, the first TD almost should not count ... that proves nothing about either team. Poz basically stopped that drive himself and Edwards looked good except for on the throw where he got hit. Yes, it sucks he got pressured, but did we really think rokie guards would never get beat? better now than 3 months from now.

I maintain that Cornelius Bennett was a better player than Talley ... maybe not a better person or teammate, definitely not a better leader, but a better linebacker. He was a much better pass rusher, yet also sacrificed his personal stats to cover tight ends and could cover just about any of them. He also made the Pro Bowl playing inside linebacker one season when he moved in due to injury, something Talley never could have done. I love Talley and perhaps he was more valuable to that team because of how he pushed Bruce if for no other reason. But Bennett deserves more credit than he ever gets because Talley is so lovable and everyone thinks he never got his due. He gets his due all the time now, and Biscuit is forgotten.

there's a good chance the full game tapes of those games didn't survive the 1970s, let alone into the 21st century. But it would be cool.

I was there ... and also at the Raiders playoff game a few weeks later that was even colder. Good times.

That had to be the game of Burkett's life. Too bad he turned into a bit of a headcase a couple years later.

Again, where are you guys getting this stuff that the Browns and Schottenheimer somehow held Kosar back? Look at my previous post for his record playing for Schottenheimer as opposed to after Schottenheimer left. And look up the numbers, all but one year they passed more than they ran, Marty was not holding them back. Also, while he may not have had GREAT offensive talent around him, it was plenty good ... Kevin Mack made Pro Bowls ... Webster Slaughter, Ozzie Newsome, both Pro Bowlers .... the line was always solid and OT Cody Risien made Pro Bowls ... on defense Clay Matthews, Chip Banks, Minnifield and Dixon, all Pro Bowlers. Even Bob Golic made Pro Bowls, look it up ... Point is, it is revisionist history to say Schottenheimer's teams sucked just because they lost in the playoffs. Those were very good teams that were just not quite good enough, just like Kosar. At best he was the FIFTH-best QB in the AFC behind Kelly, Elway, Marino and Moon (and some might make a case for Boomer some years) ... the NFC had Montana and Simms early in his career and then added Aikman and Young ... Kosar was barely top 10 at any given point let alone of all time. Was Randall Cunningham one of the best ever? Dave Kreig? Mark Rypien? because those guys were all pretty similar to Kosar at that time in terms of numbers, Pro Bowls and winning. No one has come up with anytyhing yet that sets Kosar apart.

Oh, I don't know ... maybe if he doesn't throw 6 interceptions in 3 conference title games they win one of them. Just sayin' ... he was a good player but he played 16 games only 3 times his whole career, had a passer rating higher than 87.8 exactly ONCE and had a losing record as a starter. In fact, if you take out the Schottenheimer years that you insist held him back, his record was 23-37-1 as a starter (as opposed to 30-17 playing "Martyball"). Hell, without Marty he had worse numbers AND a worse winning percentage than ROB JOHNSON. (OK, that was a low blow ... true, but a low blow.)

My post was not a shot at TE ... I think they can win with him. I agree the rest of the parts have to get better. The point was, it remains to be seen that all the other pieces are in place. When all we have to worry about is whether TE can stay healthy and whom the backup is, I will be thrilled. The bigger questions are: Will the O-line be adequate? Will there be any sort of pass rush? Who will starts on SLB and will he help the run defense resemble the first half of last season as opposed to the second half? Who starts next to Whitner and will he really be freed up to make more plays? Will McKelvin be a playmaker like he was late last season without horrible growning pains? If all those questions are answered positively, THEN the No. 2 QB might make or break the season. Otherwise, 6-10 is the same as 8-8 to me.

Until they prove they can with with the No. 1 QB, that's the least of my worries. One thing at a time.

Really? I know it is tough to compare positions but you sound pretty sure of yourself ... these guys sound pretty equal to me: They both went to two Pro Bowls ... Taylor played just nine seasons and never caught more than 64 passes ... and he was injury prone, playing 16 games just twice. Basically, he was a role player on great teams. He had a rep as a great punt returner, but after 1989 he didn't even do that all that well. Put him on another team, is he a great player? Talley was a role player compared to Bruce Smith, Bennett, Kelly, Thomas and Reed, but it was a bigger role for a longer period of time since he played 14 seasons in the leage and missed TWO games during the Bills' 1988-94 run of success. Put him on another team he's not a great player but he would have started for 10 years for anyone in the league without a doubt. I think I'd rather have Talley. Sorry for hijacking the thread.

Was John Taylor underrated? I think it got to the point where people said that so much he was closer to OVERrated, kinda like Daryl Talley. Both great players but by the end of their careers they were no longer underrated. Jerry Butler was my favorite player back then and WOULD have been great had he not gotten injured, but he did. he only accomplished so much, so it's hard to say he should be rated above guys who had more productive careers.

Yeah, losing to one of the best teams ever makes you HORRIBLE. Give me a break. 99% of the teams in NFL history must really suck a$$, because they were not as good as the "horrible" 1990s Bills.

Funny, if the AFC was so weak, how come the Bills racked up 7 playoff wins over teams quarterbacked by future Hall of Famers from 1988-95? (Moon twice, Marino 3 times, Elway and Montana). The Bills lost to great teams. But to just say the NFC was always WAY better is not accurate either; Washington had to beat Atlanta and Detroit to get to SB XVI. Would you say they Washington team was just lucky to play in a weak NFC? Of course not. It was a great team. The Bills went 14-2 vs. the NFC during the Super Bowl seasons, and the two losses were both the last game of the season when the Bills rested many of their starters. Seven of the 14 wins were over NFC playoff teams. Kelly never lost a start to an NFC team during those seasons. It was a great team that ran into some bad matchups (I've always wondered if things had been different if they ever played the 49ers in a SB) and then played its worst 3 of the 4 games at the worst possible time. They were not good enough when it mattered most, so they did not earn the right to be mentioned with some of THE ABSOLUTE greatest teams ever. But let's not diminish and dismiss what they DID accomplish by saying it was just a weak AFC. If the AFC was so weak, Marino, Elway and Moon were way overrated, right? And Schottenheimer's playoff teams in Cleveland and KC ... and Cowher's early Pittsburgh teams .... did they all suck? You can't have it both ways.

Not to mention I highly doubt that Seattle will be picking that high again with a healthy Hasselbeck and soem real WRs.

Maybe if he doesn't work out with the Bills the Sabres can give him a look ... can he skate?

not to go way off the original topic, but it amazes me that the NFL would ask their crappy part-time officials who suck on a regular basis to now also decide, at top speed, while looking for holding and clipping and various other felonies on a kick return, whether or not these pairs of blockers were or were not within a specified yardage of each other. That's just asking for trouble.