UKBillFan

Josh was bad on the opening drive. After that he played more than well enough to win. Unfortunately the other things you mentioned conspired against him and the Bills. You also forgot the drops - Kincaid two and Samuel one.

We'd probably be talking about Mahomes in the same way we're talking about Josh right now. Future HoF QB but the team cannot get over the line. Would things be that different if the Chiefs then positioned themselves to take Josh the following the year? With him having Reid instead of McD, Spags and Chris Jones instead of Frasier/Babbich and the ever injured Milano? Mahomes being called on during his first season rather than being able to sit behind and learn from Alex Smith? I grudgingly admit Mahomes' key strength over Josh is mental strength. I thought he had sorted it out but the opening drive last night indicated otherwise, albeit not helped by playcalls. But I don't think the difference is that stark that switching the QBs would be enough to get the Bills to one SB, let alone four.

Especially as the officials were short spotting the ball all night and everyone should know the Bills were not going to get any favors.

As he was earlier in the game, to Coleman. The immediate response in the GDT was "Why are we throwing behind the sticks?"

I agree. I think the issue was Jones was that side, and it would have left the ball less protected than going to the left.

If so, it's up to the coaches to pull him up on it if it's not working. Pull rank. Call another play. Do you honestly think Reid would have allowed that to happen? Sneak after sneak, failing time and time again?

Unless Josh is traded. That seals it. The Bills should go all out to get Zac Taylor. What could go wrong?

Bull. Partially on Josh, I accept, but not all. Low or not, it was still a catchable ball. I said it at the time, and will say it again, it was akin to Jackson to Andrews last week. The ball wasn't in the sweet spot, the receiver had to adapt but still should have come up with it. At lot is being made of this one, but didn't Kincaid also drop one, may have also been that drive? I thought he had to reach slightly (it had to be high to avoid a Chiefs player) but it was also catchable. As I said before, it can almost be guaranteed the likes of Kelce, Brown and Worthy would catch those kinds of balls for Mahomes and no one thinks anything more of it. The darts to Hollins yesterday were supreme throws but not the easiest of catches, yet he made them. As said on this thread or elsewhere, Daniels had at least five off throws yesterday yet his receivers made something of them. It cannot and should not be all on one man. And, along with the usual awful play off defense, a key reason the Bills are out is because they abandoned the running game for too long. Too much was placed in Josh's hands, and Cook was used sparingly.

If that's the argument then it has to be for both sides of the ball. Yet the offense only scored one less point at Arrowhead than they managed at Highmark in week 11. And if it wasn't for bad drops and repetitive play calling it could have been more.

Thank you. I appreciate they come as a pair, but if there is anyway Pegula lets Beane go but holds on to McDermott - is there anyone in the league who you would rate as a good replacement, and would be available/happy to come here?

Thank you. But wouldn't McDermott have a say on who to choose? Or is it all on Beane, and he basically tells McDermott to work with them? It also sounds like Coleman was chosen at Josh's insistence. https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/josh-allen-pumped-bills-took-keon-coleman-qb-texted-wr-before-draft-youre-the-guy-that-i-want/ Of course, that's not to say Josh wanted him chosen ahead of Worthy, or at 33.

@GunnerBill - with no offence intended to anyone else, I rate you as the most knowledgeable poster on the board so would really like to know your full opinion on McDermott over Beane, as you disagreed with keeping the current GM over the HC.

I'd keep Beane ahead of McDermott. Decent GMs are harder to find than decent coaches - not that the latter is easy either.

The defense was looking ropey even before Benford's injury. Though considering it ended up being a three point game...

I'd say his defense made two key plays when they needed to. The bat down for the final 3rd down, which was fantastic player execution (albeit... O Line?) and the disguised blitz on 4th. QBs will miss that from time to time and Spags is elite. I doubt any QB but Josh would have even got the ball away there. Of course there's stopping the sneak too. I'm more aggrieved at the call on Kincaid's spot on the previous down than what happened on 4th and inches from an officiating angle.

The difference is Mahomes' defense, coaching, passing catchers and line helped him out yesterday. By your own admission, Josh's didn't. Edit: Do you know what Kelce would have done in Kincaid's position yesterday? Brown? Worthy? They would have caught the ball. And that's why Mahomes is, rarely questioned. His team comes up for him in tight spots.

How did Mahomes do in his last proper possession where he really needed a TD to extend the Chiefs lead with the clock ticking?

Only for the Eagles, though.

Bull. Your hatred of Josh is blinding you. Switch QBs and the result would be the same. There was not that much of a difference in quality. If Kincaid caught the ball - as he should have done - we'd be talking about what a great play it was. Look at Worthy on that incompletion/interception/questionable call. That could have easily gone differently but someone else made a play for Mahomes. Someone else helped him out. That doesn't happen for Josh. In terms of receivers, he has to practically do it all himself. And where was Cook? Where was the help from the run game? Why did coaching have the offense come out passing instead of offering easy passes and runs to ease them into the game - see the Chiefs first drive? Why did the Bills continue going with the sneaks when they weren't working? If you want to whine about someone crapping the bed look at Brady. Everyone at the Bills could take some blame for last night. But Josh should be at the bottom, or near the bottom of the list.

Their QB who hasn't seen his team score 30 or more all season until McDermott's wondrous defense came to town. Their QB who fumbled the ball under no pressure too, and also took an almost unforgivable sack in the red zone which cost his team the chance of a TD to extent their lead. Mahomes is great, there is no doubt about it. But last night's result wasn't down to the QBs. It was down to coaching, the respective defenses at the death and, as always, some interesting calls from those in stripes.

Nerves did get to Josh in the first which was a shame because I thought he'd sorted them out. That is a concern and something, the one thing, more than anything, he needs to work on. However, he was was not the QB who fumbled the ball. He was not the one to mess up in the red zone and had to take a FG from a great position for a TD. Mahomes and Josh were both good enough to win last night. The difference was bad calls, from Brady (no Cook and a lack of change from/to the sneak), McDermott/Babich (Spags adjusted to the sneak rolling left. The Bills coordinators? Just keep Mahomes running to the right without a stop) and the officials (I'm more peeved at the spot on Kincaid's play than the subsequent 'failed' sneak. And then we have the so-called Worthy completion). Switch QBs and the Chiefs would have still won last night. Switch defenses and it would be the Bills going to the SB. If there was a switch coaches? Think the Bills would have made it.

The Chiefs aren't going to the SB because of Mahomes. He's a key piece but, swap him with Josh, and the results would be the same. Their defense is a class apart as is Reid's/Spag's coaching.

Funny that. The MVP candidate last week made two turnovers yet all the talk was about Andrews dropping the ball and fumbling. Yet it always was.

Let's face facts. Like the majority of their time here they made a relative success because of Josh. As a GM and HC, your time is often dictated by your pick at QB more than anything and, whilst they've had quite a few draft busts since, Josh was not one of them. He was in the MVP discussion despite a much weaker receiving room than the Bengals, Ravens, Chiefs, Eagles, Lions, Rams, Vikings... you name it. And even when Cooper came in, Brady seemed clueless as how to integrate him. Shakir could be growing into a stud (Tom Brady's favourite word) and that seems to their only long term hope. In truth, McDermott and Beane are safe as long as Josh says they're safe. If he starts throwing his weight around and saying he wants change, then Pegula will either have to listen to trade him. I do not think Josh is the kind of person to do that, though. On a personal level, the one disappointment from last night when it came to 17 is I thought he'd got his nerves under control. Clearly he still needs some work on them early on. But again, Brady could have helped him with easy throws and a run game during the first series.

Think I'm right in saying 30th? The Commanders take the 29th based on regular season record.