BullBuchanan
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Posts posted by BullBuchanan
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1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:
They have both started. And been quickly relegated to the bench. If you are going for such low value positions in the first three rounds I expect actual starting level talents. And neither of those guys were.
That's a wildly unreasonable expectation. Looking at draft history, you're lucky to get 2 starting caliber players from rounds 3+, and both Singletary and Moss were that. In Singletary's class in 2019, 20 RBs were drafted after him and only one, Tony Pollard, has been better. In Moss' class in 2020, 8 RBs were taken after him and he's the best of that group.
90%+ of the time you're getting an RB that is a career backup when you draft in the 3rd+ in the last 10 years. They don't put up the 150+ yard games that both Singletary and Moss have. Make no mistake, I'm not saying they're great, but you're grossly misrepresenting their ability and achievements in comparison to their peers.
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5 hours ago, Shaw66 said:
I'm glad you guys are having fun talking about who could make that play, but that really isn't the question. The question is whether the totality of what Cook contributes could be obtained in free agency for less than Cook wants. I think the answer to that is probably yes.
As do I, and that's a point I was trying to make. You don't need a player to make a given play most of the time, if he can be as effective in totality.
3 hours ago, GunnerBill said:If they knew what they were getting with Singletary and Moss and STILL spent day 2 picks on them that is a fireable offence.
How? What exactly are you expecting of 3rd round players? Both of those guys have started in this league and have had monster games from time to time. Not sure what more you're looking for there.
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39 minutes ago, GASabresIUFan said:
Yes, I realize that and 3x $5 mill is a great deal different that 6-8x 5 mill. Math does matter.
As to someone earning a huge raise, (which Cook has), what do you think Shakir is getting or Benford or Benard? Shakir's raise for 2026 is nearly 3x his 2025 and his 2027 cap hit is over 5x his 2025. Benford's 2026 is 3x his 2025 and his 2027 is nearly 8x his 2025. Bernard? 2.5x in 2026 and 4.5X in 2027.
Obviously paying Cook a 3x raise is similar to the other similarly situated players on the Bills.
We all understand that you don't want to pay Cook. We get it. However once you start saying Singletary is a reasonable substitute for Cook your credibility suffers.
I didn't realize he was making over $5m This year. I knew his entire rookie deal was under $6M so not sure how he got such a big raise.
I could understand how you might think my credibility would suffer if I said singletary was a "reasonable substitute" for cook. I guess It's a good thing I never said that then.1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:Singletary doesn't have the vision or change of direction of Cook. There is zero chance he makes that play. Zero.
I disagree. Watch the highlight clip I shared at 0:34. It's a similar play that Singletary scores on.
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1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:
The Bills are not trading him at this point. Save for like a Saquan type guy going down in camp and the Eagles deciding they gotta make a move and overpaying. There was a point where a trade was on the table between the parties as an option but that has passed.
And Cook is going to be here and play.
Zero point zero point zero per cent chance.
His two touchdown plays were great here. Maybe people think that James cook play was more special than I do. It wouldn't crack my top 50 and I'm not certain it would crack my top 100 runs of the year across the league. If I'm not a Bills fan, it's just a nice play assisted by the safety dropping his head.
14 hours ago, Mikie2times said:His athleticism is what allowed the play to happen. For 15 million dollars this team will not find a player that will make as big of an impact as Cook will. If you don't agree with that statement I get it. That's how these things go. I think he's a 12 million dollar guy and not 15. But I keep getting stuck on reflecting on my own financial situations over time. A lot of the time 10% would have secured my highest motivation as it showed a belief in me. I have gotten it at times and not in others. In the end the cost to the employer was a very dedicated high performing employee over a fraction of what the likely replacement and training costs would be. I see the gap from 10 to 15 million with Cook as a fairly similar situation which is where I really wonder just how much more we would get with 5 million dollars?
See, i don't even advocate paying him 10 when you can get that talent on a rookie deal for $1-2M. A lot of folks around here believe that we would have wont he SB in 2021 had we beaten KC. if that had come to pass, Devin Singletary would have been our starting RB. having James Cook hasn't been the thing that put us over the edge. He's not that big of a difference by himself.
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36 minutes ago, GASabresIUFan said:
What? You do realize he is making 5+ this season?
You do realize the whole discussion is about him asking for $15M and us talking about if the Bills should give him that?
56 minutes ago, HappyDays said:I mean this is just stretching to find reasons not to compliment the player. KC's defense had the play sniffed out and perfectly covered. None of the RBs you mentioned would come close to making that play.
There is a phenomenon happening amongst certain Bills fans where they're making the jump from "we shouldn't pay Cook" to "Cook isn't that good." There are plenty of reasonable arguments for why Cook shouldn't be extended - his position, his snap count, his 3rd down %, etc. You can make those arguments without making irrational comparisons to Singletary and the like. Any discussion about extending Cook should acknowledge the fact that if you don't extend him you are losing some of the great individual plays he made last year.
No, it isn't each of those players are capable of amazing plays and monster games and have done so. I'm not taking a thing away from Cook. It was a great football play, but that's exactly what is was - a football play. It wasn't a "James Cook" play the way that Derrick Henry stiff arming someone into oblivion is.
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5 hours ago, Mikie2times said:
What 15-20 running backs are going to make this play? Is Devin Singletary going to do it? Zack Moss? That is what replacement level is. If you don't pay him what will you do with the money? Go get a 10 million dollar RB and a back up corner? How about we scrap that plan and target a WR with all of that. Josh Palmer is about what we can get.
If you trust Beane to land an offensive difference maker with that money so be it, but to replace him with a replacement level back (which Davis and Johnson are) then assume your money lands you a difference maker that is even close to what he did for us last year is fools gold.
What is it about that play that distinctly James Cook? It's a great football play, but I don't think there's any particularly unique skill that he has that enabled him to do that. It's not like it's a signature move. Could I see Singletary or Moss making that play? Absolutely. I could see Ty Johnson making it too. Derick Henry? Probably not. He'd just run straight through the guy instead.
There are a lot of ways RBs can add value above replacement without having to replicate a given play, too. Maybe Barkley scores on 1st down, so you don't even need to have a hero pitch. If you look at the top 15 backs int he league, there's a ton of talent there. I don't think Cook does anything terribly special to stand atop most os them. There's also a new crop of rookies that will likely insert themselves in that group too.
As for what I'd do with the money, I'd spend it on basically any other position but RB or special teams. We'll likely need to make a serious investment at safety next year, whether that's in the 1st/2nd round or FA. The same goes for EDGE, and possibly WR. Maybe Elijah Moore resurrects his career and we want to keep him? The only way I'm giving a RB $15M a year is if he can carry the entire team on his back with Trubisky under center.-
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On 6/14/2025 at 2:03 AM, Sierra Foothills said:
Final thought... there are plenty of posters here who want to go "all-in" to win a Super Bowl and cite actions such as trading for DJ Metcalf etc. If you want to go all-in to win a Super Bowl, how about simply paying James Cook a few more million dollars?
so you're supporting paying a guy 6-8 x more than hes making right now, when he's not contributing enough to put us over the edge on a sub $3M deal? That just makes it harder to take the next step. there are 15-20 guys that could give us what James Cook is giving us. Here's good - very good even, but he isn't special. He's replaceable, and I'd sooner draft another couple guys + bring in some UDFAs and find fresh legs than pay a hefty second contract to an RB. There are far bigger priorities.
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15 hours ago, FireChans said:
There's some market inefficiencies to take advantage of here.
First, let's set the stage:
In 2018, the salary cap was 177M. In 2025, its 279M.
In 2018, one of the best RB's of his era, Todd Gurley, who was second in MVP voting signed a massive extension.
That extension was 4 years for 57M. An AAV of of $14M. 21M guaranteed at signing (with more guarantees later if he made the team). A record setting contract.
Those numbers, TODAY, would make him the 4th highest paid running back in the league. So when we are talking about a Cook extension, and how that fits in the salary cap, just remember, he is asking for a little more than 2018 Todd Gurley money with a $100M more in salary cap space.
Now, of course, other contracts have been inflated. QBs make more than ever. WR's make more than ever.
Odell Beckham set the WR market in 2018. He signed a 5 year, 95M deal, with 18M AAV and 41M in GTD.
in 2025, that would make him tied for the 20th highest paid WR, right next to Christian Kirk (who inked his deal in 2022). The guarantees are even close, with Kirk getting $37M over 4 years of his deal.
So what conclusions can we draw from this?
Nothing that we didn't already know. The NFL at large has decided that running backs aren't valuable and that WR's are crazy valuable.
However, I would argue that this points to a strategy to take advantage of NFL decision-making at large. In a league where there is 1 winner and 31 losers, you don't want to follow the pack.
I suggest the Bills SHOULD meet Cook in the middle if he would take $15M AAV. We don't have a WR worth $30M. We aren't sure we ever will, and we aren't sure that we would pay them even if we did.
I would also suggest the Bills should NEVER pay a WR anything ever. There is no point in playing in a market where JAGs or good players are having their value this inflated. I don't know where the WR carousel ends, but I don't want to be on it when it does.
The analysis of the current market and strategy I agree with, but blowing all that money on Cook isn't leveraging the inefficiency of the market correctly.
Letting cook walk and signing someone like JK Dobbins who averaged 4.6 YPC last year for 2.4M would be leveraging inefficiency in the market. Similarly signing Nick Chubb to a 2.5m deal also would have been the same. The whole idea is to get value. Cook as the 4th highest paid RB will never be value.-
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$500 is absolutely nothing, so Super Bowl for sure. $5k, $10k same thing.
That said, I've gotten so conditioned to them not winning it, that I might as well have the money. It would have to be enough to get something decently cool though. I'd say $100k, but if you twist my arm, I'd probably take less.-
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1 minute ago, boyst said:
right now the offer is a 2026 7th and a bag of Dots - cinnanom and sugar.
Get er done BBB!
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1 hour ago, boyst said:
i paid attention to him when he was younger. he was the one who made Klein obsolete. i didn't like him that much over Klein at the time but Thompson has range and versatility. Thompsons cieling was much higher so as a rookie he got the start.
he's quick downhill, he doesn't excel in traffic to collapse the pocket however. but he can move around the field as good as any depth linebacker.
i think this is a solid addition to the team and look forward to what he can bring. Spector is trade bait.
Trade for what? A swap of 2028 conditional 7ths?
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He basically hasn't played since 2022, so hopefully he's well rested?
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1 hour ago, SirAndrew said:
14 Ohio State players were chosen in the 2025 draft alone
And that tied an all-time record for the school's 135 year football history, and represents 20.5% of all active OSU players in the NFL. Best not to use statistical extremes to make your point.
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1 hour ago, SirAndrew said:
You’re right, but I said “starting lineup”. I think most guys in the starting lineup of elite teams at least get a chance in one of the various pro leagues. I wasn’t necessarily referring to the entire roster.
I didn't, and you changed a variable to "starting" to try to disprove my point. Even using your preferred metric, 82% of Ohio State's starting lineup is future salesman or Amazon delivery drivers. Maybe that's actually worse than 95% of the entire roster.
1 hour ago, SirAndrew said:I think most guys in the starting lineup of elite teams at least get a chance in one of the various pro leagues.
And that would be an incorrect thing to think. 7 total Ohio State players "got a chance" in the NFL. (4 on active roster). None had their rights drafted by the UFL. Steele Chambers (what a name), is the lone member of the Ohio State 2024 class currently in the UFL. That's 5 players across two leagues.
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I expect him to be released to make room for Heocht and Ogunjobi after week 6.
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3 hours ago, SirAndrew said:
The starting lineups of elite college teams are definitely not 95% future salesmen. The majority of Ohio State starters are going to see the NFL in some capacity, and the rest will be in the CFL, or the UFL.
I agree, a guy like Kyle McCord who couldn’t cut it at Ohio State in 2023 would probably be the best UFL QB. There are a lot of college teams that have better QB play than anyone in the UFL. NFL rosters often carry up to three QB’s. The NFL is taking most of the QB talent, that leaves the UFL with nothing at the position.
Ohio State has 4 players from their 2024 roster currently on active NFL rosters. They had 105 players on their roster. 96.2 percent of them are not on active rosters. I'll listen to an argument that some of that 96% are construction workers instead of salesman, but that's closer than being NFL players.
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2 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:
Ohio State, Georgia, Michigan, etc would destroy any of these teams.
positively ridiculous. The worst UFL team would blow out Ohio State. Most college teams are made up of 95% future salesman. At least these guys are playing pro ball.
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19 hours ago, Draconator said:
Yes it is. I know more about this than you do. So stop trying to pretend otherwise.
You absolutely do not. I've been at this as long as it's existed and worked in the TV provider industry.
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4 hours ago, Draconator said:
My TV App gets all NFL games for $47 a month, all legal. (Plus all MLB, NBA, NHL, ESPN+, and over 600 local stations across the US. Even BBC from England and other English Stations).
No it isn't.
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1 hour ago, Einstein said:
I will never understand people advocating illegal streams.
For some reason, it being media makes it pallatable for people to say things like like this. But most of us would never say “oh that restaurant meal was expensive - but there are ways to skip out the door before paying without the waitress knowing”.
Why not just straight up say “i’m a thief”?
I'm a thief. My morals aren't your morals.
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The Bills and the Cowboys are pretty much the same team right now. Strong regular season teams. Not sure how we have the ego to talk down to them.
They played without their starting QB last year and still were respectable. They've gone 12-5 each of the last 3 seasons with Dak under center. We don't want to start comparing Lombardi's with them either.-
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7 hours ago, Bray Wyatt said:
I just find it interesting that per their own stats and rankings he is higher than what they chose to rate him.
It's Top 32 for 2025, not the previous two years. There are always up and comers and guys that slip down a little. It's hard to argue that any of the guys above him don't deserve to be.
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45 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:
There's also the "I take so much juice at once and so many masking agents I get confused so I just let my trainer take care of it and pray he doesn't screw up" approach. Either way, you look a hell of a lot better if you take full responsibility for it imo. Especially when there's no qualifiers in front of that statement.
I feel like this is a thing parents tell their kids for some reason that has absolutely no evidence of being true in reality. From every example I've seen both those directly involving me directly and those involving others, admitting guilt almost never proves to be a beneficial choice. Not only do you guarantee punishment, but your public perception is damaged forever. Not once in my entire life have I ever heard a person say, well, he [did poorly perceived thing], but because he admitted it I'll stand in his corner.
Deflect, Deny, Deflect to the bitter end unless you're getting a hell of a deal to do otherwise. When you refuse to admit guilt, you get several benefits. 1. You can potentially evade punishment. 2. some people will believe you or will be skeptical enough to not want you crucified for it, and related to that, your legacy is nowhere near as stained as if you admit it in the first place which can have sever implications both reputational and financial.-
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On 5/30/2025 at 12:12 PM, Mr. WEO said:
Then he's the dumbest guy in the NFL and shouldn't be on the roster for that reason.
Everyone who has gotten caught the past 10 years has claimed this. For this reason, it's just not a credible defense. No player would simply take something some trainer or what not handed him and said, "don't worry, it's ok". Most of these guys can read, so, if they were really not sure what was in the drugs they were given, they could easily find out. Why would they leave their fate in the hands of some pusher? Accepting responsibility isn't accomplished by blaming someone else (who is this person he's blaming anyway?).
It's just not believable he didn't know what he put in his body. Zero point zero chance.
I don't think anyone is making the argument they don't know that they're playing to the limit and a little past it with PEDs. That's not really the issue here.
It's not about not taking banned substances, it's about not taking too much so you don't get popped. These guys aren't dosing out their own supplements. They have professionals for that, and I fully believe they're capable of screwing up, probably by misjudging what a player's test result will grade on a given day as a result of getting a little too risky with the program.-
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RB and WR markets are actually insane.
in The Stadium Wall
Posted · Edited by BullBuchanan
Did you read what you just wrote or what I wrote?
Singletary is MILES above guys like Damien Harris (out of football), Justice Hill, and Myles Gaskin(13 carries in the last 3 years). Which one of those guys would you have preferred?
In 2020 when the bills drafted Moss, you could have had your pick of:
Darrynton Evans
Joshua Kelley
Lamical Perine
Anthony McFarland
DeeJay Dallas
Jason HuntleyLions
Eno BenjaminCardinals
Raymond Calais
Which one of those guys did you want? Moss has had a better career than any of them, and it's not close. For a guy that spends as much time analyzing the draft as you do, it's odd to me how unaware you are of the value of 3rd round plus RBs
No team has reliably done that in the last decade. Why would you expect Beane to reliably hit on a 10% (or less) chance?
How does paying a guy already on your roster a big raise help you "win now"? I like Palmer, but I think they grossly overpaid for him. Still, he adds value that wasn't here before. Does James Cook? Maybe they think having a Saquon/Henry type makes more sense than having a Cook type back.