yall

No, you are both missing the point. The title of the thread is "Mike Williams or McKinnie". Most draft analysts said that Williams was a better pick and that he could play RT or LT due to his size, speed, and athletic ability. That was my point which seems to have eluded you both. I'm not saying I liked the pick, that in retrospect it was a good pick, or anything of the sort. He was supposed to be the better football player. He was not. Not by a longshot. This is what makes him a bust. If he had not been considered the better player, it would have merely been a stupid pick.

Nope. You have it wrong. Most scouts, media, and fans had Williams going above McKinney. My point was that TD did not do something that seemed crazy or stupid at the time. It's what makes Williams a bust. Everyone thought he was a better pick than McKinney. http://football.about.com/od/mockdrafthist...bl_2002mock.htm http://archive.profootballweekly.com/conte...raft_042002.asp And my favorite: http://www.bootlegsports.com/cgi-bin/bs3co...file=nfl-draftw Most likely to live up to expectations - Mike Williams, OT, Texas - Williams saw his stock rise higher than Bryant "Mount" McKinnie in the weeks leading up to the draft and rightfully so. He can play on either side of the line and is polished enough to step in and start for Buffalo. If there's such thing as a nimble 375 pounder, than Williams is it. Buffalo is expecting Williams to anchor their line next season, and with his excellent ability against the pass and the run, Williams will no doubt be up to the task. I'm sure I could find more mock drafts, and maybe even a few with McKinney going higher, but the point is that most had Williams going higher. Combine that with McKinney being kind of a jerk, and TD's initial decision didn't look bad. (Please don't think of me as some TD apologist, I'm glad he is gone. But just because he was a jerk didn't mean he should have been able to see into the future and predict that the guy viewed as the best lineman in the 2002 draft would turn out to be a lazy SOB.)

Are you guys forgetting that not only TD, but most of the sporting media thought Williams was a safer pick over Mckinney, do to attitude issues? And when McKinney held out on the Vikes, it sure did look like ol' TD made the smart move. Obviously in retrospect it wasn't, but everyone here is acting like TD went against conventional wisdom by drafting big Mike, when that was not the case.

Shturmovik means "Storm Bird". I think I learned that from G.I. Joe.

Huh? The Shturmovik is the IL-2, a WW2 era ground attack plane. The SU-25 is the "Frogfoot". Scary name indeed...

97-00 (I think... )

Really? I thought I read on this site that he was a free agent... No need to be a dick pal.

Actually I have a pretty good reason from the man himself, to suspect that he will not be returning. I don't want to reveal how I know or turn this into a 'soprano' situation, but I'll try to illustrate. Lets just pretend that Milloy had a personal website with a bunch of Bills logo's on it. Then he does away with that website and starts up a new one (about 5 or 6 weeks ago), yet this time there is no Bills logo, only an NFL logo. Like I said, thats sort of an illustration of what I know. The reality is very similar. I realize it could mean absolutely nothing, but this went down right at the end of the regular season. Combine that with the fact that the team played like sh--, the D wasn't very good, coaching staff turnover, and he is a free agent, and it doesn't look so good.

You know they used to see Genny Cream Ale in the south as a premium... (and I must admit I still enjoy a green screamer every now and again). True story about Iron City. When I went to Fredonia, the Quality Supermarket had mistakenly received a pallet of IC light. They had it on sale for 2.99 for a 12 pack. We bought as many as we could carry, went home and got stewed. A day or two later we returned to the store to get more, only to find the pallet was gone, so I asked one of the stock boys if there was any left. He pointed to a shopping cart filled with the remaining 12'ers. As we walked up to it we realized the price had gone down to $1.49 per 12 pack. I wheeled the entire cart right up to the register and bought the whole damn thing!

Too bad Milloy is as good as gone...

BOOYAH!

True to certain extent, but that is their style.

Milloy seems to think he is no longer gonna be a bill.

And he might be well rested after a nice vacation at "Club Marv" come summer.

Milloy is gonna be gone.

LOL! See... that was a good joke!

Oh, I don't really care, I'm just pointing out the 3rd grade mentality. Feel free to throw as much crap as you can. A huge percentage of posts are nothing more than electronic posturing, followed up by bad jokes. You just have to wade through the stevestojan to find the occasional worthwhile thread. As far as internet forums go, this one is pretty timid. Go try throwing your hat in at the debate forum at penny-arcade if you think you are up to it. It can get pretty vicious over there.

Thanks for proving my point. I knew I could count on the forum regulars.

Who should I ignore?

Ever heard of the ignore fuction? The people that feel the need to be annoying on the internet are just sad. They probably get little attention from folks in the real world. They feel that long, verbose posts on an internet forum will show the world what a true comic and/or intellectual genius they really are.

You mean like how the ball didn't bounce our way this year? You make your own luck... I was not pleased initially to hear Jauron was a front runner. But the more I hear about him, the less hesitant I am about him being hired.

Didn't you know his last name was "Lee-vee". Bad joke, but I was thinking the same thing when he was on...

Oh.... I thought this was gonna be a link to Sully's article.

Someone actually made you a mod? I'm not the type of fan that would bring in a sign, derrogatory or otherwise. But I have to say, when I heard about people with signs being harrased by security, it bothered me. It sounds like it bothered a lot of people, including RW. Maybe he is old school and that kind of sh-- bothers him. If so, there is nothing wrong with him apologizing. As a matter of fact, I welcomed it.

If thats the problem, I recommend a trip to the Canadian massage parlors to reduce swelling.