Webster Guy Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 Im so sick of hearing what a genius Belichick is. Belichick was 36-44 with the Browns; the Patriots were 5-11 in 2000, Belichick's first year, sans Brady. And they lost their first game in 2001 (sans Brady). That's a total record of 41-56 with one playoff appearance and no victories.... Wow that guy is brilliant. Funny what a hall of fame quarterback can do for a guy's intelligence. Especially one with zero charisma or people skills. Its also ironic that our coach went 13-3 that year in 2001 and won AP NFL coach of the year in Chicago. Where was Bill's brilliance in the super bowl against the Giants who BARELY even made the playoffs that year in the weak NFC. He got outcoached and they lost. Im not saying Jauron is a better coach, but everyone needs to take a breath and stop genuflecting to grumpy Bill. He couldn't even make the playoffs without Brady last year either. Lets switch Trent and our O Line for Brady and his O line and see how we end up after 16 games. Take the Bills and the points on Monday. The spread is gonna move even more to NE and i think its gonna run to almost 2 touchdowns by kickoff time. Go Bills!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pneumonic Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 If you study NFL history any at all you'll find that almost all of the GREAT HC's had top QB's and, in most cases, never were winning much until such time as they installed top QB into the lineup. Check out Walsh' record minus Montana as starter. Or Landry without Staubach. Or Noll without Bradshaw. So, while it's true that Belicheck is the benefactor of having a great QB, so too are most of the other great HC's of all time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 Im so sick of hearing what a genius Belichick is. Belichick was 36-44 with the Browns; the Patriots were 5-11 in 2000, Belichick's first year, sans Brady. And they lost their first game in 2001 (sans Brady). That's a total record of 41-56 with one playoff appearance and no victories.... Wow that guy is brilliant. Funny what a hall of fame quarterback can do for a guy's intelligence. Especially one with zero charisma or people skills. Its also ironic that our coach went 13-3 that year in 2001 and won AP NFL coach of the year in Chicago. Where was Bill's brilliance in the super bowl against the Giants who BARELY even made the playoffs that year in the weak NFC. He got outcoached and they lost. Im not saying Jauron is a better coach, but everyone needs to take a breath and stop genuflecting to grumpy Bill. He couldn't even make the playoffs without Brady last year either. Lets switch Trent and our O Line for Brady and his O line and see how we end up after 16 games. Take the Bills and the points on Monday. The spread is gonna move even more to NE and i think its gonna run to almost 2 touchdowns by kickoff time. Go Bills!!! Um, he was 11-5 last year without Brady (Brady went out very early in the first game). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEAST MODE BABY! Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 Yeah, he totally crashed and burned last year going 11-5 with Cassell. Obviously "Webster Guy" was sleeping through class again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 Um, he was 11-5 last year without Brady (Brady went out very early in the first game). That was also a team that just went undefeated and had one of the most dangerous receivers ever. The only difference was QB. His coaching job last season was very overrated. He still sucked (slightly worse) than Jauron. In fact, if Edwards becomes Brady and comes off a season where they lost one game, DJ will be able to win 10 games the next season. Belichick is the most overrated coach in NFL history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan_34 Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 Im so sick of hearing what a genius Belichick is. Belichick was 36-44 with the Browns; the Patriots were 5-11 in 2000, Belichick's first year, sans Brady. And they lost their first game in 2001 (sans Brady). That's a total record of 41-56 with one playoff appearance and no victories.... Wow that guy is brilliant. Funny what a hall of fame quarterback can do for a guy's intelligence. Especially one with zero charisma or people skills. Its also ironic that our coach went 13-3 that year in 2001 and won AP NFL coach of the year in Chicago. Where was Bill's brilliance in the super bowl against the Giants who BARELY even made the playoffs that year in the weak NFC. He got outcoached and they lost. Im not saying Jauron is a better coach, but everyone needs to take a breath and stop genuflecting to grumpy Bill. He couldn't even make the playoffs without Brady last year either. Lets switch Trent and our O Line for Brady and his O line and see how we end up after 16 games. Take the Bills and the points on Monday. The spread is gonna move even more to NE and i think its gonna run to almost 2 touchdowns by kickoff time. Go Bills!!! Say what you want...the guy has rings and we dont. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 That was also a team that just went undefeated and had one of the most dangerous receivers ever. The only difference was QB. His coaching job last season was very overrated. He still sucked (slightly worse) than Jauron. In fact, if Edwards becomes Brady and comes off a season where they lost one game, DJ will be able to win 10 games the next season. Belichick is the most overrated coach in NFL history. I'm sorry, but this is just dumb. I realize that's an offensive thing to say. It makes no logical sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Webster Guy Posted September 9, 2009 Author Share Posted September 9, 2009 Yeah Barry Switzer has a ring too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 I'm sorry, but this is just dumb. I realize that's an offensive thing to say. It makes no logical sense. It's dumb because you have no argument in return. The Pats* were 18-1 in 2007. It wasn't like Cassell took over the Lions. And the bottomline is that if BB didn't stumble into Brady, he would have never last until 2008. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 It's dumb because you have no argument in return. The Pats* were 18-1 in 2007. It wasn't like Cassell took over the Lions. And the bottomline is that if BB didn't stumble into Brady, he would have never last until 2008. Since you asked, I watched most Pats games last year, and for the most part Cassell was lousy -- inaccurate on the medium routes, not much zip, problems with the deep out. It was amazing that they won 11 games with him, and a lot of that was due to coaching and game planning. I suspect that they would have had a good shot at the Super Bowl if they had gotten into the playoffs. No one wanted to play them at the end of the season. As for Belichick's record in 2000, he was stuck with Bledsoe. Walsh was 5-11 his first year with SF; Jimmie Johnson was 1-15. If he hadn't stumbled into Brady (who he drafted, btw), he would have stumbled into someone else. Who that would have been is anyone's guess, but it's impossible to argue about counterfactuals. I will note that you're failing to mention his DC'ing for the Giants, the Pats, and the Jets in the 1980s-1990s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zdro22 Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 That was also a team that just went undefeated and had one of the most dangerous receivers ever. The only difference was QB. His coaching job last season was very overrated. He still sucked (slightly worse) than Jauron. In fact, if Edwards becomes Brady and comes off a season where they lost one game, DJ will be able to win 10 games the next season. Belichick is the most overrated coach in NFL history. WOW you have to be kidding me!! He SUCKED SLIGHTLY worse then Jauron? The same Jauron who was 0-6 in the division and lost his last 5 home games? Your BLIND optimism is obnoxious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 Since you asked, I watched most Pats games last year, and for the most part Cassell was lousy -- inaccurate on the medium routes, not much zip, problems with the deep out. It was amazing that they won 11 games with him, and a lot of that was due to coaching and game planning. I suspect that they would have had a good shot at the Super Bowl if they had gotten into the playoffs. No one wanted to play them at the end of the season. As for Belichick's record in 2000, he was stuck with Bledsoe. Walsh was 5-11 his first year with SF; Jimmie Johnson was 1-15. He still had a team that went undefeated in the regular season. That is a hell of nucleus. and the QBs he failed with before Brady were Bernie Kosar, Vinny Testaverde, and Drew Bledsoe. That's hardly Miller, Matthews, McNown, and Losman. Those Qbs all had good to very good NFL careers. If he hadn't stumbled into Brady (who he drafted, btw), he would have stumbled into someone else. Who that would have been is anyone's guess, but it's impossible to argue about counterfactuals. and the QBs he failed with before Brady were Bernie Kosar, Vinny Testaverde, and Drew Bledsoe. That's hardly Miller, Matthews, McNown, and Losman. Those Qbs all had good to very good NFL careers. It was hardly like BB had no talent before Brady at the QB position. I will note that you're failing to mention his DC'ing for the Giants, the Pats, and the Jets in the 1980s-1990s. He became the Giants DC in 1985. It was a loaded defense with the best defensive player ever and had several top 10 finishes before. http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/nyg/ The cupboard was hardly bare. He was never the Pats DC (assistant head coach & dbacks coach) and he was the Jets DC from 1997 to 1999. Their rankings in yards: 24, 7, and 21. That doesn't sound elite to me. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Belichick BB is a pretty good coach who is very overrated. He failed many time before with much better QBs than Jauron has ever had. Bottomline, Brady would still be a star without BB. BB would have been fired without Brady. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 WOW you have to be kidding me!! He SUCKED SLIGHTLY worse then Jauron? The same Jauron who was 0-6 in the division and lost his last 5 home games? Your BLIND optimism is obnoxious If you read the original post, you'd understand the argument. The numbers (which can't be argued) are Belichick had a worse winning % than Jauron prior to Tom Brady. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lv-Bills Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 Im so sick of hearing what a genius Belichick is. Belichick was 36-44 with the Browns; the Patriots were 5-11 in 2000, Belichick's first year, sans Brady. And they lost their first game in 2001 (sans Brady). That's a total record of 41-56 with one playoff appearance and no victories.... Wow that guy is brilliant. Funny what a hall of fame quarterback can do for a guy's intelligence. Especially one with zero charisma or people skills. Its also ironic that our coach went 13-3 that year in 2001 and won AP NFL coach of the year in Chicago. Where was Bill's brilliance in the super bowl against the Giants who BARELY even made the playoffs that year in the weak NFC. He got outcoached and they lost. Im not saying Jauron is a better coach, but everyone needs to take a breath and stop genuflecting to grumpy Bill. He couldn't even make the playoffs without Brady last year either. Lets switch Trent and our O Line for Brady and his O line and see how we end up after 16 games. Take the Bills and the points on Monday. The spread is gonna move even more to NE and i think its gonna run to almost 2 touchdowns by kickoff time. Go Bills!!! Is this the same Belicheck that took the Patriots to an 11-5 record last year with a high school QB? The Patriots steadily improved all year and were one of the league's best teams at the the end of the year, but barely missed out with an 11-5 record. The same team that is now rebuilding their entire aged defense and are still Super Bowl contenders while doing it? Yeah, he sucks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 He still had a team that went undefeated in the regular season. That is a hell of nucleus. and the QBs he failed with before Brady were Bernie Kosar, Vinny Testaverde, and Drew Bledsoe. That's hardly Miller, Matthews, McNown, and Losman. Those Qbs all had good to very good NFL careers. and the QBs he failed with before Brady were Bernie Kosar, Vinny Testaverde, and Drew Bledsoe. That's hardly Miller, Matthews, McNown, and Losman. Those Qbs all had good to very good NFL careers. It was hardly like BB had no talent before Brady at the QB position. He became the Giants DC in 1985. It was a loaded defense with the best defensive player ever and had several top 10 finishes before. http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/nyg/ The cupboard was hardly bare. He was never the Pats DC (assistant head coach & dbacks coach) and he was the Jets DC from 1997 to 1999. Their rankings in yards: 24, 7, and 21. That doesn't sound elite to me. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Belichick BB is a pretty good coach who is very overrated. He failed many time before with much better QBs than Jauron has ever had. Bottomline, Brady would still be a star without BB. BB would have been fired without Brady. Belichick ran the defense in 1996 for the Pats despite his title. In 1997, Parcells was taking over a 1-15 team that was bereft of talent. They kicked butt in 98, and suffered some devastating injuries in 1999. Re his tenure with the Browns, he coached them through the 1995 moving fiasco, and he made the playoffs in 1994 with Testaverde. By the time he replaced Kosar, Kosar could barely throw. I get it -- you don't like him. Chances are, though, that the Pats will compete for the Super Bowl -- again. And they'll probably beat the Bills twice -- again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEAST MODE BABY! Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 If you read the original post, you'd understand the argument. The numbers (which can't be argued) are Belichick had a worse winning % than Jauron prior to Tom Brady. Dick, is this what you're going to say before Ralphie tries to fire you at the end of the season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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