GrudginglyOptimistic Posted August 25, 2009 Share Posted August 25, 2009 Exactly. Who cares how many tackles Schobel had in 2001-2002? London Fletcher had a lot of tackles too - unfortunately most of them were 9 yards down field. Who cares how many hypothetical "projected" tackles he would have had? He didn't have them in fact. How many sacks did he have? The fact NOW is that he can't get to the quarterback. The fact NOW is that the Bills had to use their top draft pick on a DE because the pass rush stinks with Schobel as the leading "pass rusher". The fact is too many Bills fans live in fantasy land where achievements years ago are overly admired, but are meaningless today. Don't hide from today's reality - the Bills starting DE's are ineffective. I agree that Schoebel and Kelsay are inadequate pass rushers. A big part of the fantasy that you describe though is the belief that the problem will be solved if the Bills simply get better pass rushers. If this is true, the potentially the problem is solved now that we got mutant pass rusher Maybin. I do not think so. The problem strikes me as the Bills still are not running a D scheme which allows the players to do the limited things which they can do well. The fact remains it seems to me that Kelsay and Schobel are better suited for a run-blitz scheme of the type LeBeau/Gray were building before they got the boot. Merely pointing out that Schoebel/Kelsay are not the sack/pressure DEs we need for the cover 2 scheme we run is obvious but pretty pointless without a plan to do something about it. Maybe Maybin can provide the sack/pressure we need from the DE and Ellis can become a credible back-up to Maybin but in the interim it looks to me as though we are a couple of years away from cycling through the Schoebel/Kelsay contracts and can make a personnel switch. We are then a year or two away from training the new personnel to be what they need to be. Unfortunately, if you want a winner this year and probably even next the better part of valor would be to go with a run/blitz than try to use Schobel/Kelsay for something they ain't at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quester74 Posted August 25, 2009 Share Posted August 25, 2009 Bottom line.. a DE's job is to be disruptive.. and that hasn't been Aaron Schobel's MO for quite awhile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcali Posted August 25, 2009 Share Posted August 25, 2009 My sense is that there is some general resentment of these athletes for getting a king's ransom to play a boys game. Add to that Schobel throwing a bit of a hissy fit when already under contract he sat out all of the voluntary minicamps when the FO stupidly signed the worse performing Kelsay for a ton more than Schoebel was under contract for. There is some resentment, but the difference is that the FO simply caved for Schoebel but then drew a line in the sand for Peters. Peters ran with the Schoebel model as he never said negative things about the Bills he simply refused to show up for voluntary practice and then escalated to not show up for mandatory practice when the Bills refused to negotiate. In the end though, just as they gave Schoebel the cash prize he demanded so too did the FO give Peters the cash result he demanded. Now Maybin and his agent made a special effort to push the Bills FO around. I suspect that as the Bills FO demonstrated their willingness to cave to a players cash demands both in the case of Schoebel and Peters we likely will see more Bills FAs doing what Maybin appeared to do and what Jackson appeared to do when negotiating with the Bills FO. Schobel set the precedent though. I think even fans who do not care about this or understand the contracts still feel underlying discomfort with the way Schoebel pushed the Bills FO around. nonsense...most people just think he was grossly overrated --and is now practically non-existent as a passrusher.We resent not having a passrush;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted August 25, 2009 Share Posted August 25, 2009 I agree that Schoebel and Kelsay are inadequate pass rushers. A big part of the fantasy that you describe though is the belief that the problem will be solved if the Bills simply get better pass rushers. If this is true, the potentially the problem is solved now that we got mutant pass rusher Maybin. I do not think so. The problem strikes me as the Bills still are not running a D scheme which allows the players to do the limited things which they can do well. The fact remains it seems to me that Kelsay and Schobel are better suited for a run-blitz scheme of the type LeBeau/Gray were building before they got the boot. Merely pointing out that Schoebel/Kelsay are not the sack/pressure DEs we need for the cover 2 scheme we run is obvious but pretty pointless without a plan to do something about it. Maybe Maybin can provide the sack/pressure we need from the DE and Ellis can become a credible back-up to Maybin but in the interim it looks to me as though we are a couple of years away from cycling through the Schoebel/Kelsay contracts and can make a personnel switch. We are then a year or two away from training the new personnel to be what they need to be. Unfortunately, if you want a winner this year and probably even next the better part of valor would be to go with a run/blitz than try to use Schobel/Kelsay for something they ain't at all. Not buying it. In Schobel's first year in Jauron's/Fewell's scheme he racked up 14 sacks and had numerous pressures. In 2007, Fewell had to adapt his scheme a bit to mitigate the rash of injuries on that side of the ball and Schobel responded with arguably his best overall season, as evidenced by his selection by the COACHES to play in the Pro Bowl. That's NOT a popular vote when it comes to the coaches. He was selected because the coaches in the league know better. Yeah, his sack numbers went down in '07 but unlike the sheeple who are told by the media what stats are important for a DE, I don't agree at all that the reduction in sack totals was even remotely evident of a dropoff in play. Kelsay? Meh. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Posted August 26, 2009 Share Posted August 26, 2009 Not buying it. In Schobel's first year in Jauron's/Fewell's scheme he racked up 14 sacks and had numerous pressures. In 2007, Fewell had to adapt his scheme a bit to mitigate the rash of injuries on that side of the ball and Schobel responded with arguably his best overall season, as evidenced by his selection by the COACHES to play in the Pro Bowl. That's NOT a popular vote when it comes to the coaches. He was selected because the coaches in the league know better. Yeah, his sack numbers went down in '07 but unlike the sheeple who are told by the media what stats are important for a DE, I don't agree at all that the reduction in sack totals was even remotely evident of a dropoff in play. Kelsay? Meh. GO BILLS!!! Dear Lord, We thank you for this plentiful bounty, particularly in the midst of all this brazen asshattery. God bless the people who see the whole game. Amen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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