Is Buffalo ready for the T-Gun?

[VJ91]

...I was hoping you would comment if you think we have the right coaching staff and players to run it!...

 

I don't believe any team in the NFL has "the right coaching staff and players to run it" as a full time offense. It's a terrific change of pace scheme to throw off a defense, and of course, every team needs a proficient hurry up offense at the end of the first half and end of games.

 

But as a main or full time offense, it puts way too much pressure on the defense. Quick 3 and outs will exhaust a defense and allow the other team's conventional offense to put together long time consuming drives.

 

I suppose if Edwards is smart enough and can get rid of the ball quickly, the Bills have some nice weapons to succeed in the hurry up offense. But can Hangartner call out the defenses as fast as Kent Hull did for Jimbo? And can this ever changing O-Line handle the pressures of full time no-huddle? And of course I don't believe Jauron and Schoenert are the right coaches. I don't see a back like Thurman Thomas who can catch the ball and make tacklers miss on quick hitters like he did. Thomas once led the entire NFL in total yards from scrimmage for 4 consecutive years. He is a Hall of Fame running back. Where is our Thurman Thomas of today? And please don't get me started on this defense being able to play 30-40 minutes a game and still make as many plays as the K-Gun D made back in the day.

 

Bottom line, no way should the Bills be exploring the ho-huddle.

[VJ91]

I guess you prefer an offense that averages 18 pts a game, consistently goes 3 & out more then any other team in the league, averages .75 td passes per game & has ranked in the bottom half of the league the last 4 years. Yeah lets stick with that offense.

 

I prefer a conventional offense that moves the ball down the field and eats up some clock. Let's see, I think that just described every offense that has ever won the Super Bowl. Certainly it described the offenses of the New York Giants, Washington Redskins and Dallas Cowboys (twice in a row), that beat the Bills in their 4 Super Bowl games.

 

But forget ancient history. Let's talk about the modern game today. No team uses the lightning fast no-huddle offense as it's main scheme. Peyton Manning goes no huddle most of the time, but he stands up at the line of scrimmage and uses up almost the entire play clock while making adjustments and calling out audibles. That's it folks. Nobody else uses it more then as a change-up look every now and then. Perhaps a couple of series per game. And of those other 31 teams that don't use the no-huddle, one won last years' SB, and 11 others made the playoffs, while the Bills did not. What makes you think that running the no-huddle full time is the only way the Bills can improve beyond those putrid numbers you pointed out?????

[Adam]

I guess you prefer an offense that averages 18 pts a game, consistently goes 3 & out more then any other team in the league, averages .75 td passes per game & has ranked in the bottom half of the league the last 4 years. Yeah lets stick with that offense.

It is time to let go of the no huddle- we don't have all pro's on the offensive line, our linemen will be pretty new at what they are doing across the board. We also don't have a hall of fame QB. Terrell Owens is not Andre Reed and Lee Evans is not James Lofton. And don't ever think we have anything remotely close to Thurman Thomas.

 

Let this group learn to work together- we don't need the gimmicky no huddle.......it would lead to more mistakes.

[Lori]

Care to elaborate?

Yeah. I'd like to hear this one too.

 

And yes, Kelly called his own plays. From "Armed and Dangerous":

The only time in "K-Gun" when we usually huddle is before the first play. I already have a good idea of what my first two or three calls will be, but I only give the first one in the huddle. For the rest of the series, my decisions take into account down, distance, and what the defense shows.

...

Once I'm on the field, I hardly ever look to the sidelines. But Ted would always be there, just in case I needed a play. Sometimes, after using a lot of the same material over and over, I'd glance at Ted or Frank to see if they had anything different in mind. More often than not, Ted would shake his head and say, "You have a good grasp of it. Just go with what you're doing." There were other times when they'd purposely avoid eye contact with me because they didn't think it was necessary to interfere.

 

The only time the play-calling is taken out of my hands is in short-yardage and goal-line situations. Coach Levy prefers to handle that himself. He'll either signal me the play or tell it to me on the sidelines during a time-out. In those situations, he feels he can do a better job of seeing to it that we make all the right personnel changes, with small, fast guys coming out in favor of the big, powerful studs. And Coach Levy does a good job with it.

[damj]

Why do we always think that just running the no huddle will solve all of our offensive woes. The K-Gun had the perfect mix of coaching and players to run it ... That offense was loaded with Pro-Bowlers and Hall of Famers. Sure, it was exciting and fun, but since then, every time our offense struggles, everybody always calls for the No Huddle as if they expect that to fix everything.

 

You can put lipstick on a pig, but it's still a pig ... though I think with T.O. and if Trent keeps developing, we could have a pretty hot looking pig.

[BuffaloBill]

One of the many reason the K-Gun was successful was the QB called the plays. They sensed the flow of the game better than the coaches. I don't see the point of a hurry-up/no-huddle if the coaches are going to call the plays.

 

 

It was succesul because of the full compliment of players. Even Kelly has admitted they had a limited number of base plays. H e said the majic with it was that they had so many good players on the field that mismatches were easy to find. Thurman was also a huge part of the success. I do not think it works without him.

 

I believe in the SB's the concept worked against the Bills. Defense was too tired out.

 

I like the idea of change with the current offense. maybe it simplifies things. Sometimes I wonder if NFL coaches outsmart themselves with playbooks that are two feet thick. Put athletes on the filed and let them play.

[toddgurley]

I believe the offense is a posibility but not sure we have the center, experince on the OL, or the coach to run it!

 

But, the Bills can practice the hurry up and if it is effective, go with it!

 

 

for the record, our center Hangartner, is one of the smartest o-linemen in the league. We scored an unreal number one his wonderlic exam before he was drafted (like a 47 or something unreal). So he has the smarts for it, now whether or not we have the coaches is the question? Because we have the talent at wr and rb to create alot of mismatches-

 

It will all depend on one thing-TRENT EDWARDS

[damj]

Kelly has admitted they had a limited number of base plays.

Good point ... one game, Kelly had a concussion and kept calling the same play over and over again. Nobody realized because the play worked every time. It was only after he put his helmet to talk to the coaches on the sideline during a timeout, then took it off and ran back on the field that someone realized that he might not have been all there.

 

The point is, the no huddle worked because of the players, not the scheme. The no huddle put these players in a position to succeed.

[Sisyphean Bills]

It is time to let go of the no huddle- we don't have all pro's on the offensive line, our linemen will be pretty new at what they are doing across the board. We also don't have a hall of fame QB. Terrell Owens is not Andre Reed and Lee Evans is not James Lofton. And don't ever think we have anything remotely close to Thurman Thomas.

 

Let this group learn to work together- we don't need the gimmicky no huddle.......it would lead to more mistakes.

Langston Walker is the starting LT, right? Is he now pushing the envelope of superior physical conditioning? Because running the K-Gun, when it works, doesn't just mean the defense gets gassed. The offense, and especially, the offensive line simply cannot take various snaps off to catch their breath.

 

It'd be nice to have an offensive identity other than gimmickry.

[crazyDingo]

You dont need a gimmick for a two yard dump off. You need a gimmick to sell tickets to watch a two yard dump off.

[DIE HARD 1967]

Some great responses here today, lets just hope it all works.

[Got_Wood]

The K-Gun was supposedly named after tight end Keith McKeller. So we would name ours after Derek Fine.

 

I think we should call it the F-Bomb

[Ice Cold Bruschi]

The bills didn't invent the no huddle, Sam Wysche on the Bengals did

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sam_Wyche

[DIE HARD 1967]

The bills didn't invent the no huddle, Sam Wysche on the Bengals did

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sam_Wyche

 

I think you will find that info in the link I provided

[IDBillzFan]

I believe you need the following

 

#1 A head coach that excels in Clock Management, its going to be Dick or the Turk calling the plays.

Coaches must move players in and out to create a mismatch. Poor management will result in bungled plays, yellow hankys or wasted time outs not to mention a fatigued defense if its 3 and out.

 

#2 A quarterback that can read the opposing teams defense and communicate changes on the fly

 

#3 An experienced Offensive line with endurance to handle the fatigue factor. Center is a critical position.

 

I'll take "Things The Buffalo Bills DON'T Have" for $200, Alex.

 

Seriously. Maybe I've just been watching a different team because we don't have ANY of those things. None of them. Not even one. In fact, based on what I saw last year, I'd wager that you could randomly add a FOURTH item to that list, and we wouldn't have that, either.

 

I appreciate the idea that the team may be a bit faster-paced, and run some no-huddle , and maybe actually be a bit more fun to watch this year versus last, but if a successful no-huddle truly relies on those three items, I'd come up with a new gameplan pretty fast.

[Lori]

The bills didn't invent the no huddle, Sam Wysche on the Bengals did

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sam_Wyche

In other breaking news, water is wet.

 

Although to be entirely clear, teams were using the two-minute drill while Wyche (not spelling) was still playing. The Bengals just decided to run it more often.

[Big Turk]

I will leave it up to you but here are my thoughts. The below link will provide some history on the hurry up offense. Make sure you scroll down and read the TWO MINUTE DRILL. I will call the offense the T-Gun till we think of a better name (lol)

 

I believe you need the following

 

#1 A head coach that excels in Clock Management, its going to be Dick or the Turk calling the plays.

Coaches must move players in and out to create a mismatch. Poor management will result in bungled plays, yellow hankys or wasted time outs not to mention a fatigued defense if its 3 and out.

 

 

If they plan on running the no-huddle offense effectively, Trent is going to be the ones calling the plays at the line of scrimmage. If they refuse to allow this, it will pretty much lose its effectiveness as it will take too long for the plays to get signaled in from the sideline. If the coaching staff is willing to trust Trent to run this offense, they need to trust him to RUN the offense...not just run plays that are called in....thats not the way the no-huddle offense is designed to operate...

 

Kelly explained many times why the QB has to be the one calling the plays when executing this type of offense, and as one of the best to ever do it, I trust his opinion...

 

I see this as just one more area where the coaches show they aren't up to par---they will want to run this offense, but not really allow Trent to run it properly...in the end it will end up not being as effective as it should be because of it...

[Big Turk]

In other breaking news, water is wet.

 

Although to be entirely clear, teams were using the two-minute drill while Wyche (not spelling) was still playing. The Bengals just decided to run it more often.

 

True they used this offense, but as Kelly explained in his book, there was a major difference between what the Bengals were doing with this style and what the Bills were doing. The Bengals ran it more to cause penalties and would run a sugar huddle, which was a sort of huddle near the Line of Scrimmage...when they saw opponents trying to substitute or not paying attention, they would run up to the line of scrimmage and hike the ball. What they were trying to accomplish and what the Bills tried to accomplish were totally different things...Kelly described it as the Bengals came up with the idea to run a no huddle offense, but the Bills were the ones who mastered it, which I thought was a fair description...

[Thurman#1]

I don't need a wilkepedia article about the hurry up. I watched it live for about 8 years be run better then any coach or QB could ever hope to use it, and it produced an 0-4 SB record at its very best.

 

Screw the full time no-huddle, hurry up or 2 minute offense. It sucks and it tires out the defense even when it scores a lighting fast TD.

 

 

 

It wasn't the offense that lost those Super Bowls. It was the defense.

 

We ran a 3 - 4. What is arguably the first thing you need when you run a 3 - 4? Look at Green Bay's first draft choice this year, because they decided to switch to the 3 - 4. They snagged the big man from BC, Raji, to be their nose tackle.

 

Do you remember our big man inside? Jeff Wright, 6'2", 274 pounds. Any wonder why the Cowboys in particular, but also the Giants ran over us over the middle?

 

Thumbs up for the no huddle, or any effective offense that scores points.

[Thurman#1]

I prefer a conventional offense that moves the ball down the field and eats up some clock. Let's see, I think that just described every offense that has ever won the Super Bowl. Certainly it described the offenses of the New York Giants, Washington Redskins and Dallas Cowboys (twice in a row), that beat the Bills in their 4 Super Bowl games.

 

But forget ancient history. Let's talk about the modern game today. No team uses the lightning fast no-huddle offense as it's main scheme. Peyton Manning goes no huddle most of the time, but he stands up at the line of scrimmage and uses up almost the entire play clock while making adjustments and calling out audibles. That's it folks. Nobody else uses it more then as a change-up look every now and then. Perhaps a couple of series per game. And of those other 31 teams that don't use the no-huddle, one won last years' SB, and 11 others made the playoffs, while the Bills did not. What makes you think that running the no-huddle full time is the only way the Bills can improve beyond those putrid numbers you pointed out?????

 

 

 

What Peyton Manning does is called a no - huddle offense. What more do you need to know? And sometimes he does indeed take all the clock he wants. Other times they go quick. They mix it up, the better to confuse teams and get them off-balance.