Billsfanfourlife Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 Is it just me or does it seem that no one really has a fear of not playing well on this team? For example look at Miami, truthfully they haven't done all that much in the off season, but now with Bill Parcells in there the players know they best perform or they'll be looking for work elsewhere. Look at a Ted Ginn Jr. or a Jerry Porter, Porter was potentially the worst FA pick up of last season! Or look at the team that dominated us this Sunday and for the whole decade, you don't think that team fears the man underneath the sweater?? Bottom line is Dick Jauron doesn't put the fear into the eyes of his players and they really do not worry about taking a play off or not performing up to their optimal level... A quick solution maybe to cut Chris Kelsay. He makes a ton of money, and he is about as valuable as Copeland Bryan who arguably has made more plays than Kelsay. Also he's a team Captain, this just shows every player on that team that NO ONE is safe. We might not have all that much depth at DE but we get nothing out of that position as it is so mine as well throw Ellis in there and see what he's got, because what's the worse that can happen, go another week with no sacks?? Gosh I hope that doesn't happen. Fact is I'm fishing here, trying to stir the pot, but something needs to happen. Jauron's Diplomatic answers just aren't cutting it anymore and a wave needs to be sent through that locker room, and maybe wake some players up that might being weighed down too much by that weekly pay check.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartyBall4Buffalo Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 Is it just me or does it seem that no one really has a fear of not playing well on this team? For example look at Miami, truthfully they haven't done all that much in the off season, but now with Bill Parcells in there the players know they best perform or they'll be looking for work elsewhere. Look at a Ted Ginn Jr. or a Jerry Porter, Porter was potentially the worst FA pick up of last season! Or look at the team that dominated us this Sunday and for the whole decade, you don't think that team fears the man underneath the sweater?? Bottom line is Dick Jauron doesn't put the fear into the eyes of his players and they really do not worry about taking a play off or not performing up to their optimal level... Bottom line is cut Chris Kelsay, he makes a ton of money, and he is about as valuable as Copeland Bryan who arguably has made more plays than Kelsay. Also he's a team Captain, this just shows every player on that team that NO ONE is safe. We might not have all that much depth at DE but we get nothing out of that position as it is so mine as well throw Ellis in there and see what he's got, because what's the worse that can happen, go another week with no sacks?? Gosh I hope that doesn't happen. Fact is I'm fishing here, trying to stir the pot, but something needs to happen. Jauron's Diplomatic answers just aren't cutting it anymore and a wave needs to be sent through that locker room, and maybe wake some players up that might being weighed down too much by that weekly pay check.. You're not fishing at all. It's nothing some of us haven't said before. It should still be done though. There comes a point, when you just have to admit mistakes. Kelsay should've never been re-signed to begin with. He's did nothing to warrant the contract then, and even less since. He doesn't even have this self proclaimed "high motor" He gives garbage effort. Has no quickness. Rarely wins individual matchups, which he sees the majority of the time. He puts no fear into any qb. No threat off the edge. His containment is even more attrocious. Guranteed 6-7 yard gain running end arounds toss sweeps screens or stretch runs to kelsays side 8 out of 10 times. The captian moniker doesn't mean much. Angelo Crowell was a "captain" the bills had no problem ir'ing him effectively ending his career with the bills. Hopefully we move on, and finally address the glaring flashing red signal of dire need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 Is it just me or does it seem that no one really has a fear of not playing well on this team? For example look at Miami, truthfully they haven't done all that much in the off season, but now with Bill Parcells in there the players know they best perform or they'll be looking for work elsewhere. Look at a Ted Ginn Jr. or a Jerry Porter, Porter was potentially the worst FA pick up of last season! Or look at the team that dominated us this Sunday and for the whole decade, you don't think that team fears the man underneath the sweater?? Bottom line is Dick Jauron doesn't put the fear into the eyes of his players and they really do not worry about taking a play off or not performing up to their optimal level... Bottom line is cut Chris Kelsay, he makes a ton of money, and he is about as valuable as Copeland Bryan who arguably has made more plays than Kelsay. Also he's a team Captain, this just shows every player on that team that NO ONE is safe. We might not have all that much depth at DE but we get nothing out of that position as it is so mine as well throw Ellis in there and see what he's got, because what's the worse that can happen, go another week with no sacks?? Gosh I hope that doesn't happen. Fact is I'm fishing here, trying to stir the pot, but something needs to happen. Jauron's Diplomatic answers just aren't cutting it anymore and a wave needs to be sent through that locker room, and maybe wake some players up that might being weighed down too much by that weekly pay check.. Bingo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjbegoose Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 Bingo! they need to cut Shonert , and Jauron too for that matter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsfanfourlife Posted November 10, 2008 Author Share Posted November 10, 2008 You're not fishing at all. It's nothing some of us haven't said before. It should still be done though. There comes a point, when you just have to admit mistakes. Kelsay should've never been re-signed to begin with. He's did nothing to warrant the contract then, and even less since. He doesn't even have this self proclaimed "high motor" He gives garbage effort. Has no quickness. Rarely wins individual matchups, which he sees the majority of the time. He puts no fear into any qb. No threat off the edge. His containment is even more attrocious. Guranteed 6-7 yard gain running end arounds toss sweeps screens or stretch runs to kelsays side 8 out of 10 times. The captian moniker doesn't mean much. Angelo Crowell was a "captain" the bills had no problem ir'ing him effectively ending his career with the bills. Hopefully we move on, and finally address the glaring flashing red signal of dire need. Yea I realize the "cutting the captain" didn't necessarilly work with Crowell, but that's a different type of situation. He went behind the organization's back by opting for surgery, and put himself (who knew he had FA coming up next season) over the team. Really alls Kelsay is guilty of is sucking, and that's cause for termination Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bflobarry Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 Money aside, Kelsay just never, ever makes a play. Ever. He is the least impactful player on the field, every week. I think the coaches are well aware of this this, but they have no depth. Watching Kelsay take his wayyyy round about "pass rush" is almost as frustrating as watching every running play to his side succeed. This has nothing to do w/ yesterday; he has never been a difference maker, except for the other team..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 Money aside, Kelsay just never, ever makes a play. Ever. He is the least impactful player on the field, every week. I think the coaches are well aware of this this, but they have no depth. Watching Kelsay take his wayyyy round about "pass rush" is almost as frustrating as watching every running play to his side succeed. This has nothing to do w/ yesterday; he has never been a difference maker, except for the other team..... Yet Kelsay is the best defensive lineman on the team right now, and it's not even close. Go figure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justice Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 Here are guys, ino, that don't earn their paychecks. These guys don't suck, necessarily, they just simply are some over paid guys. Derrick Dockery Chris Kelsay Aaron Schobel Melvin Fowler Robert Royal We should cut our ties with all of these guys. replace the DE's with bigger and stronger athletes and switch to a 3-4 or even a true 4-3. Anything but that dreaded cover 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartyBall4Buffalo Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 Yet Kelsay is the best defensive lineman on the team right now, and it's not even close. Go figure. I think you're a good poster here, but can you point out where you see this. The guy makes no plays. I'm not even talking about coming up with sacks. I'm talking overall game. I constantly see runs to his direction end up in positive yardage, with kelsay taking a spin move inside to be stood by a guard, or a wide angle pass rush, that he gets knocked out by a rb or simply run out by a tackle. Denney at least has shown an ability to bat down passes. Stroud meanwhile is the recipient of double teams. Kelsay looks like he couldn't lose his shadow in the shade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 I think you're a good poster here, but can you point out where you see this. The guy makes no plays. I'm not even talking about coming up with sacks. I'm talking overall game. I constantly see runs to his direction end up in positive yardage, with kelsay taking a spin move inside to be stood by a guard, or a wide angle pass rush, that he gets knocked out by a rb or simply run out by a tackle. Denney at least has shown an ability to bat down passes. Stroud meanwhile is the recipient of double teams. Kelsay looks like he couldn't lose his shadow in the shade. Kelsay at least had one extremely good game - against Seattle, and he made a couple of very good plays against the Rams. He's also batted down a couple himself. What has the Utah stork done? Nothing, really. And as for batting down passes, that only happens because someone is a lousy pass rusher in the first place. As for the rest of that sorry crew, what are there names again? EDIT - Kelsay has 18 solo tackles, 6 stuffs, 4 passes defensed, and 1 sack. Denney has 20 solo tackles, 2 stuffs, 4 passes defensed, and one sack. Eight of Denney's solo tackles came against NE, which might mean simply that the Pats chose to run at him. Of the two and based on past history, I'd definitely take Kelsay. He's a better player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justice Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 Kelsay at least had one extremely good game - against Seattle, and he made a couple of very good plays against the Rams. He's also batted down a couple himself. What has the Utah stork done? Nothing, really. And as for batting down passes, that only happens because someone is a lousy pass rusher in the first place. As for the rest of that sorry crew, what are there names again? EDIT - Kelsay has 18 solo tackles, 6 stuffs, 4 passes defensed, and 1 sack. Denney has 20 solo tackles, 2 stuffs, 4 passes defensed, and one sack. Eight of Denney's solo tackles came against NE, which might mean simply that the Pats chose to run at him. Of the two and based on past history, I'd definitely take Kelsay. He's a better player. Not for the kind of coin he's receiving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 Who is missing at DE? Sometimes one DE needs the support of the other DE to complete the package. Look at Bryce Paup years ago. One year he had 17 sacks, lose a DE and he was half the man he used to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Avenger Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 Does anyone realize that the big money guys are also the hardest to cut because their cap numbers are so big? Cutting a guy like Dockery leaves you with tons of dead money and little ability to get replacements willing to play for little more than league minimum. 3 Bills with highest cap figures this season: Aaron Schobel - $8.7M Dockery - $6.4M Kelsay - $5M Source: BillsDaily Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Fong Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 Does anyone realize that the big money guys are also the hardest to cut because their cap numbers are so big? Cutting a guy like Dockery leaves you with tons of dead money and little ability to get replacements willing to play for little more than league minimum. 3 Bills with highest cap figures this season: Aaron Schobel - $8.7M Dockery - $6.4M Kelsay - $5M Source: BillsDaily And not a one of them would be on my team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheKing Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 I think cutting a player or two after a loss like this might wake these bums up. My candidates for being cut Kelsay Dockery Royal Losman Then make Jackson the starter and Lynch the backup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 Who is missing at DE? Sometimes one DE needs the support of the other DE to complete the package. Look at Bryce Paup years ago. One year he had 17 sacks, lose a DE and he was half the man he used to be. That's not why he declined. He declined because he tore a groin muscle in mid-1996 in the midst of a second consecutive great season. He never regained his burst after the injury. He also never lost his counterpart on the other side - Smith played until 1999 in Buffalo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loyal2dagame Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 I think cutting a player or two after a loss like this might wake these bums up. My candidates for being cut Kelsay Dockery Royal Losman Then make Jackson the starter and Lynch the backup. yeah, cutting losman, a guy that did not have a hand in the 3 game losing streak sends the right message. cut someone on the o-line...... fowler AND preston? fowler is gone after this year anyway, and duke is just as big a waste. now that would shake up the team and send a message. and signing almost any center available would get the bills about the level of play we've seen all year, garbage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheKing Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 yeah, cutting losman, a guy that did not have a hand in the 3 game losing streak sends the right message. cut someone on the o-line...... fowler AND preston? fowler is gone after this year anyway, and duke is just as big a waste. now that would shake up the team and send a message. and signing almost any center available would get the bills about the level of play we've seen all year, garbage. Cutting Losman would send a very good message that goes like this... If we invest a 1st round draft pick or multiple draft picks in you we expect production. You better produce or you are out. If you are a bust, good riddance. Letting that bum collect on the last year of his contract is not a good way to motivate players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bizell Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 yeah, cutting losman, a guy that did not have a hand in the 3 game losing streak sends the right message. cut someone on the o-line...... fowler AND preston? fowler is gone after this year anyway, and duke is just as big a waste. now that would shake up the team and send a message. and signing almost any center available would get the bills about the level of play we've seen all year, garbage. rofl. the hate some people have for losman is funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cody Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 The Bills’ coaches chose Kelsey as a captain. Making Kelsey a captain, shows that the Bills thought he was doing a good job. Kelsey is no worse now than when they made him a captain, or when they gave him his contract. Cutting Kelsey would be leadership admitting they were wrong and did not know what they were doing. I'd suggest they strip Kelsey of his C, but who would they give it to? Is there anyone on the defense that deserves a C? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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