bills44 Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 One quick note about HGH: Pettite took it to help his injured elbow heal. If it can work as a medicine/healing agent, why is always bad? How do you differentiate between its use as a healing agent and as a performance enhancer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LynchMob23 Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 If used during the recovery process for an injury - healing agent. If used constantly as a method of constantly keeping body synthetically superior - cheating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dean Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 If used during the recovery process for an injury - healing agent.If used constantly as a method of constantly keeping body synthetically superior - cheating. The way to judge, IMO, is to make the process open. That is, if a guy is injured and the doctors want to use HGH for a period of time, then they get an exemption from the league to use it for the needed time, during the healing process. Of course, you would have to protect against phony injuries for the exemption, but I see that as a relatively easy oversight issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RunTheBall Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 Excess testosterone, aka steroids, help one heal faster too. Growth hormone not only allows one to heal faster but also increases lean muscle mass. It's just a different performance enhancing compound so if you are going to ban steroids, you have to ban the growth hormone too. RTB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKOOBY Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 They set the rules up ahead of time, break them and pay a price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBill Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 Fixed. It is crazy to think that everybody who uses diuretics does it to mask/flush other drugs. But, they are on the list of what is prohibited, so either way, they are a no-no. But, IMO, they should not be. I stand corrected - you appropriately point out the fact that there are many other legit and beneficial reasons to use them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsZubaz Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 I am hoping this isn't true, and I doubt that it is. Donte Whitner does not strike me as the type of guy who would cut corners. GO BILLS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 As per ESPN radio and the ESPN TV crawl and our buddy Mort in particular, the NFL and Union have confirmed to him that it's 8 players in total, including 3 Saints, and 4 of them are Butenamide violations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bills44 Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 As per ESPN radio and the ESPN TV crawl and our buddy Mort in particular, the NFL and Union have confirmed to him that it's 8 players in total, including 3 Saints, and 4 of them are Butenamide violations. Not according to this article: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/fo....g.ap/index.html ESPN.com, citing two unnamed sources, reported the number of positive tests is more than 10 and may exceed 15. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RI Bills Fan Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 Not according to this article: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/fo....g.ap/index.html ESPN.com, citing two unnamed sources, reported the number of positive tests is more than 10 and may exceed 15. That article has been taken down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bills44 Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 hmmm....bad link, maybe? Try this: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/foot...g.ap/index.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsfaninFl Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 I preface this with saying I DO NOT KNOW if this is true, but a respected and well known poster on another board I frequent says that FOX Radio in Denver reported a list of players to be suspended, and that that list includes Donte Whitner.... Deuce McAllister (NO) Will Smith (NO) Donte Whitner (BUF) Leon Washington (NYJ) Warrick Dunn (TB) Jason Ferguson (MIA) Eddie Royal (DEN) Ben Utecht (CIN) Malcolm Floyd (SD) Dawan Landry (BAL) Cornelius Griffen (WAS) Dont shoot the messanger if this is wrong...just putting it out there. BIG loss if true... Your only problem is believing a poster on another board. Don't you know the guys on this board are the only ones you can trust? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elegantelliotoffen Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 If that list was for real PFT would surely have picked up on it by now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jester43 Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 To be fair to McAllister, if he took steroids/HGH to heal more effectively after tearing up both knees, from his perspective a four game suspension is less serious than a shot career. One quick note about HGH: Pettite took it to help his injured elbow heal. If it can work as a medicine/healing agent, why is always bad? because that gives pretty much everyone an excuse to use it and it is not safe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 hmmm....bad link, maybe? Try this: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/foot...g.ap/index.html Only problem is that story is almost a day old now--ages in new media time. The other Mort stuff was being reported about 2 hours ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steely Dan Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 The way to judge, IMO, is to make the process open. That is, if a guy is injured and the doctors want to use HGH for a period of time, then they get an exemption from the league to use it for the needed time, during the healing process. Of course, you would have to protect against phony injuries for the exemption, but I see that as a relatively easy oversight issue. That's exactly what I was thinking. If Whitner is on this list and gets suspended for four games I'll eat Rosie O'Donnell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 Fixed. It is crazy to think that everybody who uses diuretics does it to mask/flush other drugs. But, they are on the list of what is prohibited, so either way, they are a no-no. But, IMO, they should not be. There is no other reason for an athlete to use a diuretic than to mask drug use. Diuretics dehydrate the body increasing the risk of cramps and heat stroke. Losing water hurts performance, it doesn't help it. The only reason besides masking that a diuretic would help is if the player taking it was trying to "make weight" at a weigh-in that might be a condition of his contract. Diuretics are only good for short term weight loss and you don't actually lose weight (in terms of muscle or fat) because by simply drinking liquids, you gain that weight right back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dean Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 There is no other reason for an athlete to use a diuretic than to mask drug use. Diuretics dehydrate the body increasing the risk of cramps and heat stroke. Losing water hurts performance, it doesn't help it. The only reason besides masking that a diuretic would help is if the player taking it was trying to "make weight" at a weigh-in that might be a condition of his contract. Diuretics are only good for short term weight loss and you don't actually lose weight (in terms of muscle or fat) because by simply drinking liquids, you gain that weight right back. Well, I guess you took care of the "there is no other reason" in short order. Also, diuretics like furosemide (Lasix) and hydrochlorothiazide are regularly prescribed for the treatment of high blood pressure. You may be right that there are few reasons for an athlete to use bumetanide other than to mask something OR to make weight, but diuretics have other legit uses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thoner7 Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 Noone has mentioned the fact that with such an increddibly high number of failures, the tests may have been contaminated. Travis Henry appealed and won his case of a mis-handled drug test last season, and that was a one case situation. When I saw this about the 4 Saints on the ESPN Bottom line, my first thought was the tests were contaminated and probably not legit. I bet the NFL throws out these tests results and retests. If they do not I see a lot of players appealing the results and there being a good chance of them winning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth on hold Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 Poster on Jets board saying same thing about Whitner http://www.thejetsblog.com/2008/10/25/unsu...o-be-suspended/ If true, how many games would be be suspended? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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