Mcnabb or Moon

[Dawgg]

If by some miracle he wins a SB or two then we'll talk but until then there is no comparison.

 

Ah yes, I suppose McNabb doesn't hold a candle to Moon's Super Bowl rings.

[Mark Long Beach]

I will even take it a step further. McNabb will go down as one of the most underrated QBs of all time. IMO, he should be rated higher than Jim Kelly . Before TO and Westbrook, he played with crap (James Thrash was their leading receiver for years, that's horrible). He almost single-handedly carrying them to 3 straight NFC title games (eventually 4 and a Super Bowl). In his only year with a good receiver, he put up MVP #s. McNabb is awesome and the only bad thing is that he had to play in front of loser Eagle fans for his whole career.

 

McNabb is good. Much better than I though he'd be. But I still have to go with Moon by a chunk. Moon's passes were a thing of beauty. Deep and shallow with great touch. As someone pointed out just how many yards he also threw in the CFL. Yes he got a boost for being in the run and shoot for a while, but he set NFL franchise records for most passing yards in a season for THREE different teams (Seattle, Houston, MN). They weren't all running the run-and-shoot. Only two times in the CFL has a QB passed for more than 5,000 yards. Both of those were by Moon. 8 Consecutive probowls, winning a probowl mvp at age 41!

 

If you want a bunch of interesting stats about Moon more than what your memory has left in it. check here:

 

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/football/280...nnumbers04.html

 

My favorite:

4 - Number of Pro-Bowlers playing in KC's secondary on 12/16/90, when Moon shredded the Chiefs for 527 yards and 3 TDs. The yardage total marked the 2nd greatest passing day in NFL history behind Van Brocklin's 554 set in 1951. Moon had an opportunity to shatter Van Brocklin's standard, but removed himself from the game early in the 4th Q.

 

Moon by a good chunk.

[BADOLBILZ]

Just to be clear: Anyone who thinks Mcnabb is in the same league with Moon either was too young to remember how good Moon really was or they just need a head examination. It's like trying to compare Big Ben to Bradshaw, while Ben is a good QB he still has a long way to go before you can compare him to an NFL Great. Mcnabb is on the downside of his career and he doesn't have enough time left to even come near what Moon ever did. If by some miracle he wins a SB or two then we'll talk but until then there is no comparison.

 

All of what you said. Not really close, IMO. That guy was a passer supreme.

[Hazed and Amuzed]

Ah yes, I suppose McNabb doesn't hold a candle to Moon's Super Bowl rings.

 

 

I think you misinterpreted what I was saying. What I meant by that statement was that a ring or two is the only way Mcnabb should be uttered in the same sentence with Moon, He's never gonna do it with his stats or by any other means that I can imagine.

[Hazed and Amuzed]

I will even take it a step further. McNabb will go down as one of the most underrated QBs of all time. IMO, he should be rated higher than Jim Kelly . Before TO and Westbrook, he played with crap (James Thrash was their leading receiver for years, that's horrible). He almost single-handedly carrying them to 3 straight NFC title games (eventually 4 and a Super Bowl). In his only year with a good receiver, he put up MVP #s. McNabb is awesome and the only bad thing is that he had to play in front of loser Eagle fans for his whole career.

 

 

And Moon had who? Haywood Jeffries?

[Buftex]

I like Warren Moon. I was kind of surprised that he made the HOF so quickly. Not because I don't think he belongs (he certainly has the stats), but it seemed like he got in very quick, for a guy who played in a gimmick offense, and never won a damn thing. You gotta think, given the criteria that Moon in, Drew Bledsoe is not such a joke to make the Hall.

 

So, my question, assuming McNabb plays another 2 or 3 years, and never wins a Super Bowl, does he belong in the HOF? He takes a lot of knocks, but has been one of the more successful QB's (or at least the QB on some successful teams) over the last 10 years.

[Lemur King]

Hmm... do you think the stat differential "might" have something to do with the fact that Moon ran the Run & Shoot, averaging 500-600 passing attempts PER SEASON, wheres McNabb has run a variant of the West Coast Offense, averaging ~300 passing attempts per season?

 

Nah... who needs perspective, let's just spit out stats to draw conclusions!

 

Yeah, let's just ignore Moon's 5+ years in the CFL. Think there's a reason Moon was in the run-and-shoot? Because he could execute it. It's not like the WCO is not a pass-happy attack. The Eagles ALWAYS pass more than throw. That's the knock against them. Moon is WAY WAY better.

[Hossage]

Ive been surprised throughout his entire career that anybody thought mcnab was very good. I admit that he had streaks where his play was excellent and before he got so fat he was a real scrambling threat. But he was not consistent from year to year and toward the end of his career to date, even when healthy, has been visibly frustrated. When they do not win or are not playing well, he saunters out of the huddle and off the field and pouts like losman.

 

T.O. was right, he got tired in the super bowl. It seemed pretty clear to everyone i watched it with at the time. When owens said that about mcnab, donovan starting calling him names. Yeah, T.O. was a loudmouth, but he should have laughed it off publicly but taken it as constructive criticism and put down the bowl of chunky soup to lose those 50 lbs or so he has gained since he came into the league at 225. When the official weight of your quarterback is 20 or 30 lbs shy of reality, that could be a hint about his fitness level.

 

I hear a lot of silly things about how modern players who are minor stars in the league are better than all of the old players from fans and media who want them to be. But i dont think anyone here thinks peon deion or whatever his nickname is was the greatest cornerback of all time. Direct quote from sanders: "i dont think its my job to tackle." I dont think many people in this forum fall into the aforementioned category.

 

 

Moon was fantastic. I dont think his supporting cast was as bad as others have suggested. The run and shoot spread the defense out and opened up a frustratingly effective singleback running game. It all worked like it was supposed to, and it still would again

[BUFFALOTONE]

I'm sure a six packs of beer inspired this discussion.......

 

Tale of the Tape

 

Arm Strength McNabb

QB IQ Moon

Scramble McNabb

Team Leader Moon

X Factor Moon

2 Minute Drill McNabb

Fantasy Value McNabb

 

My choice is......McNabb

 

Not even close pal. Do you watch football?

[KD in CA]

I will even take it a step further. McNabb will go down as one of the most underrated QBs of all time. IMO, he should be rated higher than Jim Kelly . Before TO and Westbrook, he played with crap (James Thrash was their leading receiver for years, that's horrible). He almost single-handedly carrying them to 3 straight NFC title games (eventually 4 and a Super Bowl). In his only year with a good receiver, he put up MVP #s. McNabb is awesome and the only bad thing is that he had to play in front of loser Eagle fans for his whole career.

 

I disagree with the 'single handed' notion. Not only has McNabb had Westbrook for 5 out of his 8 years as starter, but the Eagles defensive was ranked 2d, 2d, 7th, and 2d, respectively during their NFC championship game years of 2001-04.

 

Moon had better WRs, but certainly no one anywhere near Owen's level (Drew Hill was his leading receiver for five years). And the Oiler defensives were only ranked in the top 10 three out of his ten years in Houston (and never higher than 4th), yet Moon took them to the playoffs 7 years in a row. Unfortunately for Moon his run coincided with a period of very strong top teams in the AFC (Buffalo, Cincy, Denver, Pittsburgh).

 

If anyone belongs in the discussion with Kelly, it's Moon.

[justnzane]

I disagree with the 'single handed' notion. Not only has McNabb had Westbrook for 5 out of his 8 years as starter, but the Eagles defensive was ranked 2d, 2d, 7th, and 2d, respectively during their NFC championship game years of 2001-04.

 

Moon had better WRs, but certainly no one anywhere near Owen's level (Drew Hill was his leading receiver for five years). And the Oiler defensives were only ranked in the top 10 three out of his ten years in Houston (and never higher than 4th), yet Moon took them to the playoffs 7 years in a row. Unfortunately for Moon his run coincided with a period of very strong top teams in the AFC (Buffalo, Cincy, Denver, Pittsburgh).

 

If anyone belongs in the discussion with Kelly, it's Moon.

Tarkenton?

[Hazed and Amuzed]

I'm sure a six packs of beer inspired this discussion.......

 

Tale of the Tape

 

Arm Strength McNabb

QB IQ Moon

Scramble McNabb

Team Leader Moon

X Factor Moon

2 Minute Drill McNabb

Fantasy Value McNabb

 

My choice is......McNabb

 

 

That is on par with some of the craziest sh-- I have ever read. Really? I mean really? Dude we have got to chill sometime just make sure you bring whatever green you've been smokin' because that sh--'s gotta be some Jimmy "Superfly" Snuka sh--.

[Buftex]

I disagree with the 'single handed' notion. Not only has McNabb had Westbrook for 5 out of his 8 years as starter, but the Eagles defensive was ranked 2d, 2d, 7th, and 2d, respectively during their NFC championship game years of 2001-04.

 

Moon had better WRs, but certainly no one anywhere near Owen's level (Drew Hill was his leading receiver for five years). And the Oiler defensives were only ranked in the top 10 three out of his ten years in Houston (and never higher than 4th), yet Moon took them to the playoffs 7 years in a row. Unfortunately for Moon his run coincided with a period of very strong top teams in the AFC (Buffalo, Cincy, Denver, Pittsburgh).

 

If anyone belongs in the discussion with Kelly, it's Moon.

 

 

I think Moon was capable of QB'ing a team to further than the Oilers ever went, but, I think the run and shoot seemed to derail the Oilers at crunch time. That is normally what happens when you have a gimmicky offense. It is fun to watch (and the Oilers were very entertaining), but doesn't normally take you all the way...as Bills fans, we have some experience with this phenomenon..

[Lemur King]

I will even take it a step further. McNabb will go down as one of the most underrated QBs of all time. IMO, he should be rated higher than Jim Kelly . Before TO and Westbrook, he played with crap (James Thrash was their leading receiver for years, that's horrible). He almost single-handedly carrying them to 3 straight NFC title games (eventually 4 and a Super Bowl). In his only year with a good receiver, he put up MVP #s. McNabb is awesome and the only bad thing is that he had to play in front of loser Eagle fans for his whole career.

 

Whatchu smokin' man? McNAbb has had flashes of greatness but nothing more. He'll go down as one of the better QBs of his era but not even a great QB in his own era. In the short pass WCO, his 58% completion percentage is not impressive. He's got no reputation as a clutch or 2 minute drill guy. He can't wash Kelly's balls. And he certainly can't even come close to carrying Moon's jock.

[Gale Gilbert]

And Moon had who? Haywood Jeffries?

 

Moon had some very good receivers in his day. Jeffries, Ernest Givens, Curtis Duncan, Drew Hill. All of those guys could have started on most teams in the early 90's. But put him in Philadelphia, and he would have made that offense hum, too. Put McNabb in the run and shoot, and I'm not so sure it goes as well. He's not accurate enough a passer. I'd take Moon.

[My Friends Call Me Tebucky]

Moon had some very good receivers in his day. Jeffries, Ernest Givens, Curtis Duncan, Drew Hill. All of those guys could have started on most teams in the early 90's. But put him in Philadelphia, and he would have made that offense hum, too. Put McNabb in the run and shoot, and I'm not so sure it goes as well. He's not accurate enough a passer. I'd take Moon.

 

Don't forget Webster Slaughter.

 

I'd take Moon if pressed because he was a smarter player, but it's not be a lot...McNabb's athleticism makes up for a lot of Moon's intelligence.

 

I don't buy the run and shoot factoring in...there Detroit and Atlanta played that system too, and none of their quarterbacks were ever thought of as even close to elite. Moon was a great player, as is McNabb. By the way, for those emphasizing Moon's accuracy over McNabb's, it's not really fair- while McNabb has played in a West Coast Offense, the majority of Moon's throws in the run and shoot were short "dink and dunk" type passes for 5 yards. The systems weren't that different, with the exception of a tight end being on the field.

[BUFFALOTONE]

Moon had some very good receivers in his day. Jeffries, Ernest Givens, Curtis Duncan, Drew Hill. All of those guys could have started on most teams in the early 90's. But put him in Philadelphia, and he would have made that offense hum, too. Put McNabb in the run and shoot, and I'm not so sure it goes as well. He's not accurate enough a passer. I'd take Moon.

Earnest Givens' grand father was my PE teacher in 2nd grad. Coach Pittman. Dude was all time.

[KD in CA]

Tarkenton?

 

Fran was the man. My parents grew up in Minnesota so the Vikes were my NFC team as a kid. He might be the most underrated QB in the Super Bowl era. Ken Anderson is up there too.

[justnzane]

Fran was the man. My parents grew up in Minnesota so the Vikes were my NFC team as a kid. He might be the most underrated QB in the Super Bowl era. Ken Anderson is up there too.

I would say 5 of the best not to win the big one are:

Marino

Kelly

Moon

Tarkenton

Fouts

 

the last two I can't say that I saw on anything besides NFL network/ESPN Classic replays, so i am gauging them 2 more on reputation and stats.

[bluenews]

That is on par with some of the craziest sh-- I have ever read. Really? I mean really? Dude we have got to chill sometime just make sure you bring whatever green you've been smokin' because that sh--'s gotta be some Jimmy "Superfly" Snuka sh--.

 

Thanks, I'll try better next time.....